Tactile Immersion - General Discussion - Hardware & Software

No, I meant the full gambit of building out from just the exciters to a full on rig, similar to what you are building towards, and the myriad of other points which could be compiled.

If not, that's cool - I just don't want to keep asking if it's something you would rather not look over.
 
So I am looking for some guidance and hopefully this is the right place.

I purchased two Wondom 4X100W @ 4 OHM, (4) Dayton BST-1 and (4) Dayton DAEX32EP Exciters, (2) 24V 350W meanwell PSU & (2) creative 5.1 sound cards.

I mounted (1) BST-1 under the pedals, (1) under the steering wheel base, (1) under my seat and (1) on the seat back. I mounted (2) exciters on the seat near the shoulder blades and (2) remaining exciters on the sides of the seat directly to the seat.

I am having issues setting all 8 of these transducers up and was wondering if someone could help me?

I originally purchased the (4) BST-1 and had them working just fine but things have become a little more complicated now with the additional (4) exciters.

I am wondering how to configure each sound card using creative software? For some reason, I can never find the 4th transducer that is plugged into the app. In Simhub I always have to add an additional output called " Speakers (High definition Audio Device) to get the 4th transducer to produce any output from each amp.

Furthermore, Now that I have 8 transducers, when I am selecting which effect goes to which transducer it does not seem to be working. For example, I will have the RPM effect selected on the (4) exciters but when I go to test on the effects page only one gives me output.

Hopefully this is not all too confusing but would really like some help. I understand I did not get the best quality hardware but believe I can have a decent setup made with what I have.

Thanks in advance for the help.
 
So I am looking for some guidance and hopefully this is the right place.

I purchased two Wondom 4X100W @ 4 OHM, (4) Dayton BST-1 and (4) Dayton DAEX32EP Exciters, (2) 24V 350W meanwell PSU & (2) creative 5.1 sound cards.

I mounted (1) BST-1 under the pedals, (1) under the steering wheel base, (1) under my seat and (1) on the seat back. I mounted (2) exciters on the seat near the shoulder blades and (2) remaining exciters on the sides of the seat directly to the seat.

I am having issues setting all 8 of these transducers up and was wondering if someone could help me?

I originally purchased the (4) BST-1 and had them working just fine but things have become a little more complicated now with the additional (4) exciters.

I am wondering how to configure each sound card using creative software? For some reason, I can never find the 4th transducer that is plugged into the app. In Simhub I always have to add an additional output called " Speakers (High definition Audio Device) to get the 4th transducer to produce any output from each amp.

Furthermore, Now that I have 8 transducers, when I am selecting which effect goes to which transducer it does not seem to be working. For example, I will have the RPM effect selected on the (4) exciters but when I go to test on the effects page only one gives me output.

Hopefully this is not all too confusing but would really like some help. I understand I did not get the best quality hardware but believe I can have a decent setup made with what I have.

Thanks in advance for the help.
I'm guessing that running 2 of the same sound cards is causing the issue. I have a 5.1 Sound Blaster and will be needing a 2nd card soon. Can anyone else confirm if it's still necessary/preferable to run 2 different cards? If so, any recommendations?
 
Without doing a poll, A question to people in this thread to get general feedback. What do people want to see first or most? Let me know here or via PM. Im going to wait a week to see who bothers to respond and consider things.

1. More on my own build with a dedicated thread
2. Unofficial Simhub thread that covers it in detail and with discussion/queries
3. RD Forums to have a new "Tactile" section and that then have individual threads for topics/guides etc
4. A Youtube channel that specializes on all things "tactile & audio" that are sim related
5. Something else, tell me....
 
I reckon a tactile section with some completed builds / guides on it would be a great start. YouTube video as well, maybe even incorporated into the build guide. Your build could be one of those WIP guides, more for curiosity than anything else. The other guides would help get people into the various levels of tactile many people are currently running. Something like an exciter / budget build, BK Mini / Advance / TST build for mid range, and then the big unit build where budget is less of a concern and end result is all that matters.
 
I'm guessing that running 2 of the same sound cards is causing the issue. I have a 5.1 Sound Blaster and will be needing a 2nd card soon. Can anyone else confirm if it's still necessary/preferable to run 2 different cards? If so, any recommendations?

I have not and will not test it, but it was recently discussed in discord and it seems that it would be an issue (driven from windows as I understand it really). I have no specific recommendations myself. I run a Creative Labs Audigy RX 7.1. It works fine, BUT, it uses TRRS connections for 2 of the three audio ports. So you DO have to buy special breakout cables VS the normal TRS 1/8" to RCA or whatever. Again, works just fine, but is a little more complicated because of that. Further, that is another SB card, so I would look at externals. Seems they work just fine w/ Simhub.


@Mr Latte
3

That said, you could easily mix 3 and 4. Do a video series expanding on a specific tid-bit, then have a post with the key details that matches to it. So people see the video, get ALL of the extra detail, then have a post here that can be referenced. Then we would have the best of both worlds. A video to see and get a ton of extra detail, and a post which only hits the highlights and ultimately ends up being a guide for each area of tactile on a rig.
 
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Without doing a poll, A question to people in this thread to get general feedback. What do people want to see first or most? Let me know here or via PM. Im going to wait a week to see who bothers to respond and consider things.

1. More on my own build with a dedicated thread
2. Unofficial Simhub thread that covers it in detail and with discussion/queries
3. RD Forums to have a new "Tactile" section and that then have individual threads for topics/guides etc
4. A Youtube channel that specializes on all things "tactile & audio" that are sim related
5. Something else, tell me....
3>1>4>2
 
1. More on my own build with a dedicated thread
2. Unofficial Simhub thread that covers it in detail and with discussion/queries
3. RD Forums to have a new "Tactile" section and that then have individual threads for topics/guides etc
4. A Youtube channel that specializes on all things "tactile & audio" that are sim related
5. Something else, tell me....

If I was being selfish, I would choose option 2 - the Simhub thread, but that's just because that's what I need to learn more about at the moment and it would be a big help.

However, if you have the skills and confidence to do a good job of option 4 - A YouTube channel, I would love to see that and think it would have the best wide appeal. I looked for YouTube videos around tactile when I started on this route a few months back and really struggled to find anything of much help and they all seem to be very poorly made. This would definitely have my vote.
 
1. More on my own build with a dedicated thread
2. Unofficial Simhub thread that covers it in detail and with discussion/queries
3. RD Forums to have a new "Tactile" section and that then have individual threads for topics/guides etc
4. A Youtube channel that specializes on all things "tactile & audio" that are sim related
5. Something else, tell me....

Personally, probably 2. Number 3 would be really helpful, but it should be reasonably organized (which means someone needs to spend time).
What I believe would get most attention from a general audience, probably 4 or 3.
1. is great and interesting, but probably a very specific audience.

When you get into this, and you start to search (everywhere), you really realize there's just minimal helpful information really out there. Lots of 'it-s great'.... 'wow'.... superficial and generic comments, etc, etc, but not much with real substance other than this thread.... and now that I'm into it a bit, I'd also say that a lot of the superficial info out there is also misleading or even incorrect

I seems to me, that this is something like learning to play a guitar:
1. Some people want to learn technique, precision, foundation, theory, etc. Many times teachers/instructors will focus and stress on that.
2. Others just want to learn a popular song to play (even if poorly), and that's enough for them. They are not so interested in scales, and technique. They just want to know the basic notes, and go on.

I believe the great majority of people getting into tactile are in the 2nd category. And they are all asking those in category 1 for help.....and you can see how things evolve.
 
I agree with Brutal. If you are good and confident about making videos and you are informative, then videos would probably be most useful and easy to follow. Hopefully they will get some views and you can make some money from them. You could make many short ones that has specialized topics or reviews. Start of by doing reviews on the inducers and amps you have and how to best use them in different setups and at different price points. Or start of by showing a basic build with the parts you have recommended in this thread and how to best utilize them in a build with SimHub or SimVibe. A forum topic with specialized threads would also be great:)
 
I seems to me, that this is something like learning to play a guitar:
1. Some people want to learn technique, precision, foundation, theory, etc. Many times teachers/instructors will focus and stress on that.
2. Others just want to learn a popular song to play (even if poorly), and that's enough for them. They are not so interested in scales, and technique. They just want to know the basic notes, and go on.

I believe the great majority of people getting into tactile are in the 2nd category. And they are all asking those in category 1 for help.....and you can see how things evolve.

I think you have a point here, I see this in the same way. I have an exciter setup built I'm very happy with. I got it done with Mr Latte's help (which I'm very grateful for), having followed this thread for a while I trusted his opinions. However, I'm not a tactile enthusiast, I'm a simracer. Tactile is just something I wanted to add to my rig, and once satisfied I was over and done with it.
 
Thanks, keep ideas and comments coming.

Improved Forum Content
It would not be that hard to do a thread on specific audio/topics. Sure it needs some consideration and I may seek a bit of help with graphical flair as photoshop etc is not something I ever got into.

First, though, we badly need an "Audio & Tactile" based area for such content rather than just the "General Hardware" section. When you see the views that this thread has generated, then clearly it is a topic people follow or seek more info on, so it should have its own section?

Video Content
I particularly want to hear from people that ventured into perhaps doing a YT channel or blog based on a hobby or interest. Even if not personal it would be nice to see examples that can be shared (via PM) as those would be appreciated.

I see potential with trying a few videos perhaps on a YT account as really it is shocking how few good tactile videos there are. Be it on tests, reviews, comparisons. I would opt more towards making the "product" the focus and not me in front of a camera. I have been gradually taking onboard hardware and software that people entering into such go for. I also see a growing number of people recommending "Lumafusion" for editing videos via iPad pro.

This is not so much my priority as it would take time and I have restricted space as well but yes being able to place good content here and then combine that with video content makes sense. Its a risk as it may not do that well or I just might suck at it.

Test To Users & Feedback
One thing that annoys the heck out of me is lack of people seeking to share or improve the effects they have. I'm going to test you guys right now in a moment. As engines are one of the more enjoyed or deemed important effects. I want people to send me links (via PM) to try their own RPM layers they use.

I want to get an idea to the level of effects in what people are using or experiencing. Consider this as research towards further content, so lets see how many of you do this? I don't care if you are a beginner or advanced user, you might even think your effects may not be that great, regardless it does not matter, send me a link to download what you have so I can get a grasp of what people use and "feel is good enough" for them. I need to get a benchmark to help evaluate things.


Hardware Limitations / Effects & Settings Matter
One point I want to mention here, based on the post from @Chrhun above. Let me say that getting into tactile and it merely working remotely well. It can come as a nice added addition to immersion but just how well is your tactile performing? You do not need to be a "tactile enthusiast" to want or be able to appreciate good effects or how to apply settings and use effects to work best on your own hardware. Again this is an area that needs a tutorial with individual effects and taking into account different levels of hardware.

We also need to get past this idea that budget tactile is "good enough" and the more expensive units and amps are just more powerful. So much focus is on watts and not the usable frequency range.

The truth is that many of the budget hardware and standard or basic effects are not even close to the potential possible. IIts easy to make rather poor buying choices not knowing what is good or bad. We need to also focus on the effects themselves, its not all just hardware.

Many transducers sold that are cheap are very limited in the frequency range they offer and people need to take this into account. So yes one of the early things needed is a detailed comparison on specs and all the budget offerings that people usually buy.

Continued Research/Tests:
I have been working on continued effects, this week messing around with some RPM stuff that can work along with the "Speed" based effects.

Part of improving things has been in seeking to reduce the number of layers needed but obtain excellent results. Currently, I have built a nice RPM sensation from only 3 layers. I then created 5 variants of this to work with a speed effect and it too have variations. These variations use similar settings to the core effect layers used but with differences in the operating Hz. This makes it ideal to let people then find a more suitable sensation of a well-crafted effects operation.

What I can say is the sensations being achieved are quite amazing. I want someone that owns a DSP/NXD amp with BK Concert/BK LFE to test this new 3 layer RPM set and compare it to what they have been using. Then to give their own thoughts about it here.

*Edits Added Content
 
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So - to follow up on the WOW.

I am actually going to quote Mr Latte, "We need to get past this idea that budget tactile is good enough and the more expensive units and amps are just more powerful. The truth is that budget hardware and standard or basic effects are not even close to the potential possible."

To be fair, I knew there was more to it than more powerful. BUT ... "The truth is that budget hardware and standard or basic effects are not even close to the potential possible." bares repeating.

I hooked up the BK-LFE's yesterday (stereo - isolated seat - NX3000D). I did just a couple quick tests to make sure they were working via the tone generator. My rig wasn't rattling at all, at 10 hz. But the door to my office was lol, even worse at like 17. I traded them with two Aura's and left the settings the same (tuned for Aura's) and wow. Then I did a little dub-step tuning and dropped the bass. Holy rusted metal batman!

I have to completely retune now, but dayum. I understand why Latte discards idea's of cheap tactile. That's not to say it wont work, or be enjoyable at all. But once you get a feel for what the BK-LFE's can give...it IS a totally different experience. And that was with it turned down...WAY down. 12'oclocks on the amp, and 1% in simhub. that is NOT a typo 1%. Like I said, it is not tuned at all - I should have toned down the amp, but I couldn't reach it and had the mouse so I changed simhub. It was still throwing me around!

There is a downfall though. I only have the ability to put two exciters on my seat...they stood out ok with the Aura's on the seat. Maybe I was just so amazed by the low hz I was feeling, but they kind of disappeared for the most part. Time to retune.
 
What I can say is the sensations being achieved are quite amazing. I want someone that owns a DSP/NXD amp with BK Concert to test this new 3 layer RPM set and compare it to what they have been using.
Well, what can I say? NX1000D and BK LFE Concert owner here. I seem to change every setting almost daily, but I can give it a try if you like. Let me know if you need me to give further details how I have things installed, or not.
 
@bassun,
Well, what can I say? NX1000D and BK LFE Concert owner here. I seem to change every setting almost daily, but I can give it a try if you like. Let me know if you need me to give further details how I have things installed, or not.

Send me a PM I will send you a link and instruction on settings for amp etc (later today/tonight)
Share with me also what you have been using so far, its good for me to see what settings both via the amp and Simhub people have been using based on their own.
 
@bassun,


Send me a PM I will send you a link and instruction on settings for amp etc (later today/tonight)
Share with me also what you have been using so far, its good for me to see what settings both via the amp and Simhub people have been using based on their own.
I will, but - I want to actually tweak things for the LFE's first. I had not spent too much time on the Aura's once I knew I was getting the BK's. I literally just had a couple layers and just dropped the hz to play with it when I hooked it up last night. On the amp, I didn't even log into the the DSP yet. Literally turned it on, and got floored. Then drove. Had to make a few quick tweaks along the way (basically turning it down) but basically it's untuned atm.

That said, I will get with you, just want to have an idea of how they respond first.
 
I want to confirm something.
Can we load/save amp profiles between the DSP & NXD models?

I know the new NXD software wont load on older DSP models but not tried saved settings.
Someone send me PM with email and I will forward one to confirm.

If it doesnt work I will then share images of settings I was using with the BK Concert on their own with no exciters. I have settings that push the low bass but make it operate with higher Hz as well.
 

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