Tactile Immersion - General Discussion - Hardware & Software

[blekenbleu]

Everyone has different priorities and you can't argue these things

What he said. Among tactile priorities:

• immersion AKA fun
• realism
• driving aids

About immersion, IMO it can distract from driving (just as can e.g. motion).
Arguably, that is "realistic", because most real race cars deliver excessive stimuli,
which requires some learning/adaptation to filter/ignore.

About realism, IMO is impossible, if only because Sim racing games provide insufficient
information e.g. to generate accurate engine vibrations:

• in-line 6 cylinder engines != 90 degree V6 != 60 degree V6 != boxer 6

About driving aids, IMO bang per buck is Sim Racing Studio ShakeKit,
which for less than US$300 is nearly plug and play.
For lazy DIY (myself), their cushion + an old surround receiver + motherboard sound card + SimHub can be cheaper and extensible/more capable.
FWIW, engine rumble from Dayton pucks in SRS cushion can be credible,
but interferes with IMO more useful feedback.
18 Jan 2024: SRS' original ShakeKit 4-puck seat cushion is no longer available,
but a DIY PuckSeat is not too hard to assemble.

 

[Peterpan6666]

.. does not exist

 

[Peterpan6666]

I started with the Buttkicker Gamer 2 which is the complete package, amp included. With that and a couple of small transducers on the brake pedal and accelerator pedal and I was very happy with no particular desire to upgrade. And this is where "cheaper" solutions can sometimes turn out to be a false economy. The BK amp died on me after a few months and it's a common problem according to the internet.

That's your Behringer NX3000D right there.

 

[Milkie]

Can anyone recommend a guide for getting the most out of the bass shakers and sim hub?

 

[GeekyDeaks]

Can anyone recommend a guide for getting the most out of the bass shakers and sim hub?

Did you watch the video posted by Andrew a few days ago?

This was posted on SimHub discord today.

It's an oldie, but still seems relevant

 

[sunaurus]

Thanks a lot for the detailed responses, guys! I think I will have to give it a go with the small buttkicker kit - if the amp does end up dying, at least by that point I think I'll have a better understanding of whether I want to invest in a better amp or just go back to no bass shaker.

Regarding the seat isolation, I understand it's very important, but having only just recently upgraded from a very unstable setup to a proper sturdy P1-X, I'm very hesitant to go back to a rig that bends under pressure. And from what I can tell, getting seat isolation that both works and doesn't move under heavy braking seems quite expensive. So maybe I'll try to do seat isolation in the future if I like what I see with the small buttkicker, but for now, I will stick with the rug under my P1-X. I also have the P1-X feet that I haven't attached yet, I can try those as well as a first measure if my house vibrates too much .

 

[Peterpan6666]

Thanks a lot for the detailed responses, guys! I think I will have to give it a go with the small buttkicker kit - if the amp does end up dying, at least by that point I think I'll have a better understanding of whether I want to invest in a better amp or just go back to no bass shaker.

Regarding the seat isolation, I understand it's very important, but having only just recently upgraded from a very unstable setup to a proper sturdy P1-X, I'm very hesitant to go back to a rig that bends under pressure. And from what I can tell, getting seat isolation that both works and doesn't move under heavy braking seems quite expensive. So maybe I'll try to do seat isolation in the future if I like what I see with the small buttkicker, but for now, I will stick with the rug under my P1-X. I also have the P1-X feet that I haven't attached yet, I can try those as well as a first measure if my house vibrates too much .

All understandable and makes good sense. Going from no tactile to the Buttkicker Gamer 2 is amazing and definitely more impactful than going from the Buttkicker Gamer 2 to high end tactile.

A couple of things to be aware of… the sound and vibration coming from your rig will be exponentially greater than if you isolated the seat, so carpet won’t cut it unless you live alone in a detached house. You’ll be clamping the buttkicker directly to the P1-X chssis and as such will need to run the transducer and amp harder than if you had isolation in place. This is because much of the energy being generated by the transducer will dissipate and be lost to other parts of the chassis and the floor leaving a smaller fraction of that energy reaching you. With the use of vibration isolators you would get the same desired effects at lower volumes, however you’d need to also find an alternative mounting solution which was not directly connected to the P1-X but rather to the seat brackets or similar.

Here’s a mount I recommend for the BKG2. I mounted this to the centre back section.

Not sure if you use these feet, but I found them great.

 

[RCHeliguy]

The buy once philosophy doesn't always work in terms of saving money. In many cases it is a wash or even works against you. We all have an idea what we are willing to justify for something and that tends to change over time. Sometimes we are better off not going in deep because we lose interest and the money would have been wasted.

Other times it is part of the learning experience and you refine your taste and wants in a specific direction. Other times the goal post changes. I remember when a bunch of people were trying to convince me to get an old SimuCube direct drive setup with big military connectors a large external control box in what I would call a industrial looking form factor. When the SC2 Pro was released in a much cleaner form factor, I made the jump and in this case I'm very glad I waited.

Just saying that you never know what is around the corner that changes everything.

 

[Milkie]

Did you watch the video posted by Andrew a few days ago?

It's an oldie, but still seems relevant

Perfect! This has helped a little and has enabled me to get a little more detail.

I think I need to spend some time setting up an EQ profile for the BK Concert. I think I'll use a frequency sweep and tune by the feel on my ass! I was thinking this would be a common setup and others would have profiles ready to go, but I don't mind taking the time to tune it.

Is there an alternative to the DAEX32EP-4? Currently using a vibration motor on the brake pedal, thought I might get a bit more detail for the DAEX32EP-4, but they are out of stock here in the UK.

 

[Glaucoso]

Hi, I'm a desktop with office chair simracer, now I have only 2 motor attached to the pedals (one for slip on throttle, one for brake lock on the brake pedal). I'm thinking of adding a little bass shaker under the chair and completely change the SimHub Effect setup this way: the 2 rumble motor "linked" to the front wheels (wheel slip AND brake lock on both pedals), and the bass shaker "linked" to the rear wheels (wheel slip AND brake lock on both pedals).
Obviously the result change based on FWD or RWD car, but I think this will be a good update to better understand what's happening in the car: Is it correct?

 

[blekenbleu]

alternative to the DAEX32EP-4?

The DAEX30HESF-4

• same power rating
• better heat dissipation
• smaller mount
• stronger terminals
• slightly better tactile measurements

 

[blekenbleu]

desktop with office chair simracer

SRS ShakeSeat

 

[anton_Chez]

Perfect! This has helped a little and has enabled me to get a little more detail.

I think I need to spend some time setting up an EQ profile for the BK Concert. I think I'll use a frequency sweep and tune by the feel on my ass! I was thinking this would be a common setup and others would have profiles ready to go, but I don't mind taking the time to tune it.

Is there an alternative to the DAEX32EP-4? Currently using a vibration motor on the brake pedal, thought I might get a bit more detail for the DAEX32EP-4, but they are out of stock here in the UK.

If you boost the gain of the Concert from basically 0hz up to around 60hz, that should give you a pretty good starting point. The Concert is at it's best under 50hz and to get a little more juice out of the low end, boosting it around +10dB around the 20hz mark is ideal.

That's a DSP setting from dMass, another member here. Something like that will boost the low end a good deal. I had mine fall off sooner and much more sharply to begin with, like a cliff as opposed to this slope. But I think I'm using a variation of this now.

 

[Cameltotem]

If anyone could help me. Please. I've tried everything to reduce vibration noise but I can't seem to find any solution.

 

[Glaucoso]

SRS ShakeSeat

Thankyou, but I don't want to recreate a vibrating cushion, my idea is very different: The SRS video shows 4 bass shaker on the seat, but I'm thinking at 1 on the seat (sticked on the wood bottom with screws) and rumble motors on the pedals for a big (and more intuitive?) front/rear separation

 

[blekenbleu]

alternative to the DAEX32EP-4?

The DAEX30HESF-4

• same power rating
• better heat dissipation
• smaller mount
• stronger terminals
• slightly better tactile measurements

 

[boern69]

SRS ShakeSeat

I use these shakers on my seat- they do a good job for the money

2 at the top
2 under the seat

 

[anton_Chez]

Hmm I might have a look at these. I have a spare Nobsound amp that I have left over from a failed "speaker on the rig" experiment. They look WAY more useful than any of the exciters that I've owned and should pair nicely with that small amp. I have a spare set of extension RCA's left over from the SMSL amps that I had and they should fit nicely exactly where they are in that pic above.

I'll look into them.

 

[boern69]

Here is project I already showed in this thread

the cusion in the middle is only for our cat

this is the concept behind

rolling is tilt movement in the green direction for this u put the absorbers more to the middle
violet is the force direction ->which changes / but while left is going down right is going up and visa versa
extramass at the shakers is blue -> the shakers are modified to go down under 20hz / 10 -20 hz feels much better and more
like a car
And this is the major point -the system feels like a car now

orange are the stereo shakers mounted to the seat ->these are the only shakers I use higher frequencies /bigger than 20
up to 80hz to simulate speed

black profiles are made of 80% wood 20 % plastic
complete different feeling + less mass + less stiffness + no need to seperate absorbers from the frame

any questions plz let me know
will post some simhub pics later

 

[Atak_Kat]

I like this. It’s similar to some concepts I’ve been thinking about for many months but could not put together the mechanics (in my mind) to support it.
It’s different and interesting. Thanks for sharing.