Podium DD's VS Simucube 2's

[Darren Byrne]

Hi guys, the past while I was trying to find good comparisons between these two models of dd's. Has anyone tested both ? I understand that the software for these aren't complete yet but is there any clear winner here ? thanks.

 

[Neilski]

Another thing, when you hit e-stop, natural thing to do in case FFB goes out of whack, bumpstops don't work at all, and while there is no active torque, inertia can keep wheel spinning. That happened to me and was reported, but seems like ignored as GD didn't even bother to reply.

Hmm, I confess that I've never tried it on a brushless motor but I'd have thought that a set of relays (or other approach) to short the coils on an e-stop would provide plenty of braking torque... Do any wheels do this?
Perhaps it's just considered a non-issue for safety reasons, once you can remove the actual power and the only thing you can really still damage is flimsy stuff like cabling...

 

[Deleted member 1234936]

Personally I wouldn't entertain a cable, The thoughts of that cable being ripped loose, whipping round and destroying three monitors fills me with dread, let alone any personal injury. My Wireless button box has been completely faultless, and feel wired would be a backwards step.

Roll on wireless power becoming the norm, and I would do away with cables altogether.

J

 

[TedBrosby-]

I honestly don't understand all the fuss about "wireless", with all the limitations and no real advantage over good coiled cable, why even bother.
I own SRB BBPRO 32, Ascher B16LSC, both wireless, but my favorite is still old Ascher C20M USB wheel (don't ask why I bought the other two ).
Much better knitter buttons and encoders as well as more inputs outweigh pseudo convenience of hit-or-miss no cable operation.
Do we have any button plates makers that still make real good, high quality, not exuberantly priced USB button plates like Ascher used to make?

It unfortunately became a race to the top. All the button plate manufacturers saw what Precision did with $75 worth of buttons and $100 worth of industrial grade aluminum and started foaming at the mouth to become "Instagram model high end sim racing solution boutique shops" lol.

I've heard Polsimer's are quite good:
https://www.polsimer.pl/strona-produktu/gt2-button-plate-carbon
As long as you use MPS buttons. But I don't think the shifters are as good as Ascher. He offered a special edition of his formula wheel with Ascher shifters, but not sure if he's doing the same with his GT2 plate.
Not sure if you consider $497 to be cheap (I do, but unfortunately my wife doesn't) but Turn Racing's plate looks incredibly high end, great shifters, 2 funky switches:

Turn Button Plate (BP2) (Pre-Order)

PRE-ORDERS ARE OPEN Estimated ship date is 1st week of October. Due to global material shortages and supply chain issues we have been experiencing frustrating delays :( We're working hard to get these shipped as soon as possible! The Turn Button Plate (BP2) is the best direct drive button box...

www.turnracing.com

My "issue" with wireless is that you're locked into an eco-system. If I decide to sell my SC2 Pro, I have to sell my wireless wheels as well. And if GD releases a V2 of their module which isn't backwards compatible, we could end up with a bunch of completely deflated button plates/wheels, even though the buttons, encoders, materials are all the same as what would be used currently. It's planned obsolescence if that happens.

The non walled garden ones have connectivity issues because Windows' bluetooth connectivity driver is terrible and subject to a lot of interference. Even their own Xbox controller is more reliable when you use it wired or with the old fashioned IR receiver.

Also, call me crazy, but I prefer a standard USB cable that will disconnect out of its port when enough force is pulling it, rather than these "aircraft quality DIN connectors".

DIN connectors are stupid. You're literally forcing your USB cable to play chicken with a 20+ Nm of torque spinning death machine, and the goods being gambled are either the USB cable or the actual DIN connection on the button plate.
If it's just a normal USB cable, it'll slip out of the port when it spins freely, and if you're thinking "Oh I don't want the wheel disconnecting during a race", no offense but if the wheel spins hard enough to pull the cable out, you were losing that race anyway.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

It unfortunately became a race to the top.

I've heard Polsimer's are quite good:
https://www.polsimer.pl/strona-produktu/gt2-button-plate-carbon
As long as you use MPS buttons. But I don't think the shifters are as good as Ascher. He offered a special edition of his formula wheel with Ascher shifters, but not sure if he's doing the same with his GT2 plate.

I don't think it is, it's the low budget crowd targeting wheel in 3d printed plastic enclosure and cheap controls. May be it's not bad for the price, but definitely not a match even for SRB Pro.
There is a good collection of USB and Wireless wheels makers for SC on German site.

 

[TedBrosby-]

I don't think it is, it's the low budget crowd targeting wheel in 3d printed plastic enclosure and cheap controls. May be it's not bad for the price, but definitely not a match even for SRB Pro.
There is a good collection of USB and Wireless wheels makers for SC on German site.

I think anything is a tough match for the SRB Ultra.
If Tommo releases a USB version of the SRB Ultra, I'll buy one the first day it's available.
I agree about Polsimer's quality, but at least he isn't over charging.
The thing about Polsimer is that his build quality is pretty much the same as Apex/RRacing etc, so while I wouldn't buy one, it tells me that a lot of the other ones are overpriced.
Some of those guys are using 3D printed rear/middle enclosures and plastic shifter arms and charging $500...
For me, if it's USB and it's over $400, if it's not as good as Turn Racing Button Plate or Ascher B16L, it might as well not even exist.

I think the prices for these things is one of the greatest cons that these makers have pulled on us. If you think about it, all they are, is a regular button box that has a hole pattern for 70mm steering wheels and the buttons oriented in a way that they're not blocked by steering wheel spokes. The only functional difference is that they have shifters on the back. Everything else about them is the same as normal button boxes and yet no one is paying $900 for a button box, but people will drop $1300 on a button plate that doesn't even have a simhub dash panel.

It's sadder if people pay that price and they don't even get Ascher or Turn shifters.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

I agree on everything you say, seems like Tomo and Ascher are the only two who provide reasonable quality product for the asking price.
Still wish we had older designs and most importantly controls from Ascher, while his shifters are still the best, departure from knitter buttons and racing grade encoders is disappointing.
SSRG has good one too, if he still makes them, but it only fits Sportline Comp 300 rim, I was looking at it a while back.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Hmm, I confess that I've never tried it on a brushless motor but I'd have thought that a set of relays (or other approach) to short the coils on an e-stop would provide plenty of braking torque... Do any wheels do this?
Perhaps it's just considered a non-issue for safety reasons, once you can remove the actual power and the only thing you can really still damage is flimsy stuff like cabling...

Unfortunately with e-stop engaged wheel spins just as freely as with no power at all, there is absolutely zero braking force and no bumpstops. So keep that in mind next time before engaging E-stop with wired wheels.

 

[TShrimp]

AccuForce V2 owners. Its startup calibration is so vigorous that
SimXperience recommends removing the cable before powering up,
and cable replacements seem common.

Purchase a QR, and you can just remove your wheel after each session. But if that is a concern for some then wireless may be the way to go.

 

[Glaniu]

for me the problem is that there are no analog connections wirelessly. I use bite point and it's missing :-(

 

[Neilski]

Unfortunately with e-stop engaged wheel spins just as freely as with no power at all, there is absolutely zero braking force and no bumpstops. So keep that in mind next time before engaging E-stop with wired wheels.

Sounds like the coils aren't shorted then. I'd imagine it should work though...

 

[TedBrosby-]

My SC2 is a month old lol...
From Facebook.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

SC3? LOL, I was expecting something like that if you check the company history.
As OSW Argon owner I got super upset when they released SC1 with no plans of backporting even basic new features.
Glad I didn't jump on SC1 bandwagon as in less then 2 years they've released SC2. There were long angry threads from SC1 owners, especially new ones.
Funny to witness like with every release they promise future proof HW solution that will evolve on SW/FW side only.

With SC2 R2 we already on SC 2.5 as besides PSU they've changed quite a lot of things internally as well as completely redesigned backplate, not to the better if you ask me.

 

[Deleted member 1234936]

For anyone fretting about longevity of wireless button plates, and being tied into a system, I'd Put me pod's on it that there will be a usb wifi receiver out there that could be tuned to pick up a wifi signal to match the button plates.

J

 

[TedBrosby-]

SC3? LOL, I was expecting something like that if you check the company history.
As OSW Argon owner I got super upset when they released SC1 with no plans of backporting even basic new features.
Glad I didn't jump on SC1 bandwagon as in less then 2 years they've released SC2. There were long angry threads from SC1 owners, especially new ones.
Funny to witness like with every release they promise feature proof HW solution that will evolve on SW/FW side only.

With SC2 R2 we already on SC 2.5 as besides PSU they've changed quite a lot of things internally as well as completely redesigned backplate, not to the better if you ask me.

Man if they release SC3, I’m just gonna sell my SC2 and buy a Podium. Lol. Fanatec might have garbage QC but Fanatec owners haven’t had to worry about a DD3 or DD4 lol. Plus GD hasn’t released a new filter for SC2 in a while which means it’s already getting taken out back and shot like Old Yeller SC1 was.
Apparently there’s no SC3. Whoever is in charge of their PR needs to be careful what they “jokingly” put out... I would’ve been hyped if they were like “new QR?” Or “whos excited for our new accessories?” But instead they put out this awful joke and now I kind of don’t care what they release...

 

[DrRob]

I don't get it honestly. Not referring to anybody here specifically.

I've bought a SC2Pro and am still chuffed to bits. It works flawlessly, does everything I could ever want.
Why would I bother about a potential SC3 up the road?

And why would I feel "betrayed" that a company offers a new product every 2-3 years.
Are these people also Golf 7 owners who go to their car dealership and complain about the new Golf 8?

As @Andrew_WOT said the new firm-/software for the SC2 might not be to everybody's taste.
Personally I stayed with an older build. Because there were no issues. So why update?
I don't need weekly updates to feel happy. On the contrary.

I mean, if you are not satisfied with the current product, rejoice!
A potentially better product around the corner!

 

[jamescarruthers]

It’s easier to moan about something than enjoy the moment? Fear of missing out? Only ever wanting to have the best? The endless quest for “perfection”? The terrifying nature of time as it passes?

I would get some of it if it were real race car, or if this all mattered to get the final tenth of a lap in a competition with real prize money. But, we all know that people win esports with Logitech gear...

It all feels very distracting from doing the actual thing all this is hardware designed to do...

 

[Deleted member 197115]

There are people who went through more than one generation of GD based DD solutions while not getting promised future proof HW.
Motor wise Mige was more than enough, if not more, but we are forced to upgrade HW to get promised new SW features, just to get obsolete in a year without gaining much if anything from the upgrade.
I understand @TedBrosby- disappointment, he just built SC1, upgraded to SC2, just to find out in less than a month that there is new (better) R2 version of SC2 and some new upcoming SC3 model (which could be a rumor or sick joke). Just as I was upset when overnight after SC1 announcement my Argon build has become an obsolete, desupported old junk.
G27 was active in production for 5 years and still getting driver updates along with the new models.
SC is 10 times bigger investment with what seems like proportionally shorter product lifetime and support.
And yeah, we can all enjoy the moment, while it last, but I sincerely hope that may be at least with SC2 GD will find a way for proper upgrade path for existing customers.

 

[TedBrosby-]

I don't get it honestly. Not referring to anybody here specifically.

I've bought a SC2Pro and am still chuffed to bits. It works flawlessly, does everything I could ever want.
Why would I bother about a potential SC3 up the road?

And why would I feel "betrayed" that a company offers a new product every 2-3 years.
Are these people also Golf 7 owners who go to their car dealership and complain about the new Golf 8?

As @Andrew_WOT said the new firm-/software for the SC2 might not be to everybody's taste.
Personally I stayed with an older build. Because there were no issues. So why update?
I don't need weekly updates to feel happy. On the contrary.

I mean, if you are not satisfied with the current product, rejoice!
A potentially better product around the corner!

The SC2, while frustrating for SC1 owners, was a step in the right direction (moving everything into a single unit, having a specially designed servo motor for sim racing, putting all the electronics onto a single PCB).

An SC3, when they haven't even scratched the surface of unlocking what the SC2 series is capable of (the last filter they built was the Static Force reduction filter, and since then they haven't really done anything for smoothness or FFB), is an unnecessary iteration just to force SC2 owners to upgrade if they want the latest software.

To me, that's unforgivable.

we criticize Fanatec here a lot... But at least their wheel bases are in 3-5 year cycles and they do their best to make sure the pedals and wheels are compatible across generations.

By the way, I don't think it's appropriate for any of you to use the "buy once, cry once" argument, if you advocate for direct drive makers to push out a new wheel base every 2-3 years when even belt drive makers don't do that. Encouraging that kind of e-waste from companies means it's not "buy once, cry once", it's "buy once, be okay with having inferior software compared to the new one in 2~ish years or buy many times to stay ahead, cry a lot".

 

[jamescarruthers]

But we don't even know if that's SC3?

 

[Guido Trampe]

GD allready stated that the picture was from a gadget. there is no SC3 planned at the moment. It would have been nice if the poster that started this fire also was forthcomming with the fact that he made a totaly wrong conclusion. The emotions in this tread are getting out of hand I think.