PC1 Latest Build testing.

Andy_J · Sep 8, 2012

As you all know, Ian gave me a free pass to test the latest builds and that's what I have been doing for the last week. I will report here as and when I see fit to tell all about my findings.

But I will say that the latest build (296) is quite good. Now lets make some sense of my statement. I used a Lotus 98T in helmet cam using my antique MOMO red wheel and I can honestly report it is coming along much better than I anticipated. The actual feel and immersion is damn fine at this point. The handling is strange at first compared to say...RF2 and FVA, but it grows on you within minutes. At this point in time, this actual car feels good. I like it and I love the Milan circuit. The damage model has come on leaps and bounds.

I am doing some more testing all of next week using a G27 and I will also test some of the other cars that don't interest me as much (I am a F1 nut) and see how the feel in comparison to Shift 2, because that is what I was initially comparing PCars to.

I would like the replay function to have a directors mode though. Something that jumps from action to action and from car to car.

Aside from that, the replay's do crash my PC quite often but I understand that is being looked at.

Watch this space.

Jari Vinnari · Nov 9, 2013

I do like this weeks build and with more time Pcars can be a quite good game. Graphics are great and the sounds are quite good too. Car physics and FFB have still some issues but they are tweaked weekly for better or worse.

There is hope for Pcars but the bar is rised high with Assetto Corsa.

-

TherealWalkman · Nov 10, 2013

In the last build I could not feel anything of the tyres. i explained it in the forum -> answer from one member.: try to raise FFB strenght

WTF

I mean I could only feel some jolts in the suspension. What really frustrates me is that I never read anything about the missing parts of the FFB. If they get implemented later on or something else. That, plus the fanboys that act like everything is spot on.

Andy_J · Nov 10, 2013

Jari Vinnari said:
There is hope for Pcars but the bar is rised high with Assetto Corsa.

-

Oh yes, very high bar. But they are in different class. One is a sim, the other is pretending to be. Just been having a go at the latest build and to me it is no different to builds months ago. I'll wait for the final release to fully judge it but I fear it will be in the same class as Shift 2 (good in its own way) but not on par with proper simulators like AC or RF2 or GSC even. Just my opinion of course. We are allowed to have opinions on here without being called haters etc.

Jari Vinnari · Nov 10, 2013

Well, only opinion that really matters in this case is your own.

TherealWalkman · Nov 10, 2013

Just got attacked by that member for posting "****" on racedepartment.

Andy_J · Nov 10, 2013

Jari Vinnari said:
Well, only opinion that really matters in this case is your own.

Always

Andy_J · Nov 10, 2013

TherealWalkman said:
Just got attacked by that member for posting "****" on racedepartment.

This is Racedepartment.

TherealWalkman · Nov 10, 2013

No Andy not here. On WMD

Fabrizio Corona · Nov 10, 2013

Those sore losers can pretend that only their forum exists and that the game is perfect for all i care. Doesn't change my opinion at all.

From a sim point of view, the game is a mess. They overdone and complicated everything and now are patching&fixing here and there, but as a sim it is compromised.

It will come out as a decent simcade, but will get owned so hard in sales by GT6 and Forza 5.

Glad i took the money from pCARS and bought myself Assetto Corsa.

ibby · Nov 11, 2013

Yeah, except what really happened was walkman was suggested to up ffb strength and lower tyre force which results in actually less ffbstrength.. then to try out change forcemasks and use an ffbtweaker with lots of fz.. then even a dev asked for a vid showing the ffbmeter running so he can help.. then he takes the piss here about one dude there trying to help by posting the above.. and yeah.. i told him that was a bit ****.. man we are really such an evil community.. =)

TherealWalkman · Nov 11, 2013

@ibby telling to raise the FFB strengh is nothing that was already tried millions of times before. So stop being a (offensive) wiseguy. Furthermore you attacked by presuming that I never used a FFB tweak, that is bullcrap as well. So the one taking the piss is only you, you saint

We spent hours of testing with other members of Project cars that are no dummies and it can be said that its not possible to get proper FFB right now. Which is okay for the moment. But there are always some dudes that must get offensive and overreactive as soon as someone gets a wee bit frustrated with that.

btw. don´t talk as if thats not what was happened dude. Dishonesty is so lame.

ibby said:
Yeah, except what really happened ....

ibby · Nov 11, 2013

TherealWalkman said:
@ibby telling to raise the FFB strengh is nothing that was already tried millions of times before. So stop being a (offensive) wiseguy. Furthermore you attacked by presuming that I never used a FFB tweak, that is bullcrap as well. So the one taking the piss is only you, you saint
We spent hours of testing with other members of Project cars that are no dummies and it can be said that its not possible to get proper FFB right now. Which is okay for the moment. But there are always some dudes that must get offensive and overreactive as soon as someone gets a wee bit frustrated with that.

btw. don´t talk as if thats not what was happened dude. Dishonesty is so lame.

I don't have a problem with someone saying ffb is crap actually.. I really hope it will.. and i actually think it needs to be better.. Even fiddling hours with the tweakers doesn't get me there yet. I'd give the FFB a 7/10 right now. rF2 a 10/10. AC a 9/10.
I'm only upset about you belittling certain members and then later in the post the whole community + connecting it with a half truth to make them look stupid. It's just wrong and looks like backstabbing to dis a community who tried to help.. Nobody was even a bit sarcastic about your posts as far as i could read.

TherealWalkman · Nov 11, 2013

As a measure to meet the conditions I´m used to use RD as a vent, since some guys at WMD get overemotional all the time as soon as someone puts some oomph into his phrasing. Thats not backstabbing. But its surely guileful if members then act like it is although its not allowed to use WMD as a vent.

edit: pls tell me where I belittled any members.

I think we can act cool and theres no reason to get overly emotional about a game. Thats why I can´t see any "community" that gets dissed. Really, no matter if here or at WMD, I see you just as a bunch of guys that write with each other. Community?. Don´t even know a single one of you, except for my colleagues that play as well. But they are my friends not a community.
So to be clear I didn´t diss Andrew Weber, you or any other person in that thread. If it hurt your feelings that I vented my frustration here (because its impossible at WMD) I´m sorry.

As I sayed, I think we don´t need to overreact over words. I´m frustrated because of the state of FFB not about any members.

According to force feedback I would give PCARS a 3/10 at max. In the meantime i have checked my G25 and its not broken

In PCARS I can´t get any feedback of actual tyre work, no scrubbing (okay there was a little, insonsistent scrub when the car got totally out of controll) no weight transfer, the steering is inconsistent and changes way to fast, every little bump on the tarmac gets exaggerated on the other hand. Allt his would actually be okay I could see those bumps that are about to hit the car´s geometry so I can brace myself.

ONT · Nov 12, 2013

Lot's of work going on in the HDR/over exposure department.

I normally turn HDR off to get a "crisper" look, but maybe there is a setting that works.

Post over bright track spots here.

Post findings build 604 here http://forum.wmdportal.com/showthread.php?16591-Over-Exposure-Specific-Feedback-Required

ibby · Nov 27, 2013

The Mclaren F1 / FG1000 / Lotus49 have new FFB calculated from the geometry now.
This is feeling alot like rF2's FFB now imho.. rF2 has more of a 'hole' in the middle thus you can feel every tiny weightshift immediately in pCars there's more mzscale+fy feeling throughout the wheel but i can feel the weightshifts really nicely now with scrubbing during cornering. Also feels very good going on and off the curbs..
Of course it can always be improved but this latest development is really promising.

Graham Byford · Nov 30, 2013

I just tried the latest build and took the Lotus 49 for a spin, the FFB is still not good for me,, the car is drifting but it just feel numb like driving on grease, what comes through the most is the track surface and suspension going up and down, can't really feel the weight shifting around when I should or the tyres and grip. Overall the FFB still feels unnatural and doesn't help enough in driving the car.

Physics wise the car goes sideways very easily and is easy to hold in a slide, but there is a lack of overall bite and grip. I admit I played with defaults but I did tweak the FFB/TF to correct levels and turn off the masks in the f1 menu except force, I don't have time to tweak any further and would rather spend my free time playing other sims..

Generally speaking all the cars are not convincing with weight shift both visually and physics wise, something just isn't right with how the suspension and chassis reacts it's never looked or felt right and I honestly believe it isn't a tyre issue at all, the core physics/engine needs some attention.

ibby · Nov 30, 2013

There are alot of tyres to choose from, which tyre did you use ?
The default is a modal tyre.. The other are flexi's ( newer tyre tech ).
I think if it would help even more it wouldn't feel real.
I really don't feel any more or much different information coming through in rF2 and i think it's ffb is perfect.. for my needs anyway. There are no seat of pants effects in the FFB right now btw.. In reality you don't feel them through the wheel either.
What is missing is perhaps something else ?
In AC the tyre sounds help alot in knowing when on the limit and the soundguys are working on a new tyresoundmodel in pCars. Maybe wait till that's in and try again.

Graham Byford said:
I just tried the latest build and took the Lotus 49 for a spin, the FFB is still not good for me,, the car is drifting but it just feel numb like driving on grease, what comes through the most is the track surface and suspension going up and down, can't really feel the weight shifting around when I should or the tyres and grip. Overall the FFB still feels unnatural and doesn't help enough in driving the car.

Physics wise the car goes sideways very easily and is easy to hold in a slide, but there is a lack of overall bite and grip. I admit I played with defaults but I did tweak the FFB/TF to correct levels and turn off the masks in the f1 menu except force, I don't have time to tweak any further and would rather spend my free time playing other sims..

Generally speaking all the cars are not convincing with weight shift both visually and physics wise, something just isn't right with how the suspension and chassis reacts it's never looked or felt right and I honestly believe it isn't a tyre issue at all, the core physics/engine needs some attention.

RaceNut · Dec 4, 2013

I was getting terrible FFB until I stopped using my Global setup in the Logitech Profiler (G25) and made a custom profile for Pcars with the following settings:

- Use Special FFB Device Settings = Checked
- Overall FX Strength = 107% (Something over 100% is needed for full FX)
- Spring Effect Strength = 100%
- Damper Effect Strength = 100%
- Enable Centering Spring = Checked but set to 0
- Use Special Game Settings = checked
- Degrees of Rotation = 900
- Use Special Game Settings = checked
- Allow Game to Adjust Settings = checked

It is very important that the Global settings page does NOT have the "Allow Game to Adjust Settings" checked - doing so essentially renders the custom profile ineffective. The overall strength in Global is set to 107%, Spring & Damper set to 0, Centering Spring checked but set to 0, rest unchecked.

I know that these are not typical settings for Racing Sims but, the FFB feels as it should now in Pcars. I tried this after reading about a similar setup for AC, recommended by a Kunos Team member.

traind · Jan 4, 2014

Builds running up to Christmas seemed to be all over the place regarding tire models and handling feel. The build from yesterday, Jan 3rd, seems to have really nailed the FA. Someone posted Ben Collins comments-- which were at long last very positive on the FA so I gave it a go. Wow, what a jump forward! I recommend you all give the FA a try with this new build--- it is by far the best it has ever been in pCars. I also tried a few others-- the 49 felt quite good and the 12c road car apparently hasn't gotten any love as it feels way off with current default tires/physics.

Chris Partridge · Jan 4, 2014

RaceNut said:
I was getting terrible FFB until I stopped using my Global setup in the Logitech Profiler (G25) and made a custom profile for Pcars with the following settings:

- Use Special FFB Device Settings = Checked
- Overall FX Strength = 107% (Something over 100% is needed for full FX)
- Spring Effect Strength = 100%
- Damper Effect Strength = 100%
- Enable Centering Spring = Checked but set to 0
- Use Special Game Settings = checked
- Degrees of Rotation = 900
- Use Special Game Settings = checked
- Allow Game to Adjust Settings = checked

It is very important that the Global settings page does NOT have the "Allow Game to Adjust Settings" checked - doing so essentially renders the custom profile ineffective. The overall strength in Global is set to 107%, Spring & Damper set to 0, Centering Spring checked but set to 0, rest unchecked.

I know that these are not typical settings for Racing Sims but, the FFB feels as it should now in Pcars. I tried this after reading about a similar setup for AC, recommended by a Kunos Team member.

I made this approach about a year ago -- the trouble is it is totally negating what the physics is delivering to the wheel. Ian B said here last year that once the tyre model is correct, the FFB should naturally fall out from it. My fear is that using the profiler is avoiding the solution to the best way to the feel at the wheel -- ie one that is totally derived from the physics engine.