PC1 Latest Build testing.

[Andy_J]

As you all know, Ian gave me a free pass to test the latest builds and that's what I have been doing for the last week. I will report here as and when I see fit to tell all about my findings.

But I will say that the latest build (296) is quite good. Now lets make some sense of my statement. I used a Lotus 98T in helmet cam using my antique MOMO red wheel and I can honestly report it is coming along much better than I anticipated. The actual feel and immersion is damn fine at this point. The handling is strange at first compared to say...RF2 and FVA, but it grows on you within minutes. At this point in time, this actual car feels good. I like it and I love the Milan circuit. The damage model has come on leaps and bounds.

I am doing some more testing all of next week using a G27 and I will also test some of the other cars that don't interest me as much (I am a F1 nut) and see how the feel in comparison to Shift 2, because that is what I was initially comparing PCars to.

I would like the replay function to have a directors mode though. Something that jumps from action to action and from car to car.

Aside from that, the replay's do crash my PC quite often but I understand that is being looked at.

Watch this space.

 

[Birddogg66]

I think they will be able to at least get this to the levels of a modern day GTR2 and I would think this would be their goal since that title was their Golden Child of game releases and FTMP the same people are there to put the best effort into making it happen so I will continue to believe.

 

[Jari Vinnari]

Pcars is getting better but it still dosent feel and drive as I wish it would.I feel the weight of the car in my steering wheel but most time it feels artificial and disconnected from the car movement.
In slow corners the car is heavy but FFB feels very damped not letting me know enough about what the car is doing for example when the car is under or oversteering. Once you cross a certain turning point the feel for the car comes back.In fast corners Pcars can feel quite good but the lack of road and actual car weight transfers makes the car handling little bit boring and lifeless.
Pcars is not a bad game and hopefully it gets better as time goes by. Sounds and graphics are all ready very nice and It has very nice variety of cars and tracks.

 

[Tom]

I think the feel of weight is improving but more on some vehicles than others. It isn't at GSC or FVA levels yet but the improvement is real.

Which ones are you satisfied with? I really need to go around Rouen again and would like to know which ones are apparently best by now.

 

[Peter]

I think they will be able to at least get this to the levels of a modern day GTR2 and I would think this would be their goal since that title was their Golden Child of game releases and FTMP the same people are there to put the best effort into making it happen so I will continue to believe.

Untill build 073 it was better than GTR2 and I was a big fan, after that they start changing the ffb/physics and it really turns my of now.
How can I feel ntm/btm/stm with such a bad ffb.

 

[traind]

Which ones are you satisfied with? I really need to go around Rouen again and would like to know which ones are apparently best by now.

Nothing is done yet but the most advanced tire model will be found on the Lotus 49, 98T and Ford GT40. It was just implemented this week so it won't be fully tuned yet but those three cars give a preview of things to come. I would start with the 49.

As far as weight transfer feeling... I would suggest to also test the Mercedes SLS AMG road car. It is not updated with regard to tires but shows some of the weight feel. I would experiment with the tire force in the controls section--- I have been turning it up to 115 or 120 and leaving FFB at 75 and that seems to help with my G25. It isn't perfect but I think you will feel the progress. (BTW, I don't usually experiment much with FFB settings so there may be a much better one out there)

If you want to add in an audio test, check out the Zonda R and the M3GT and be sure to listen to a replay with those cars.

 

[Kazumi]

Project Gotham Racing?

Yes. They have done it (what they wanted to achieve with the franchise) right . It also has the right amount of car-ishness in its handling for a console-ish racer that was supposed to be less sim then Forza.

That got me thinking about one thing. We know the "harder is realistic" myth is finally on its death throes (**fingers crossed**), but still, what is that keeps people referring to iRacing, GPL and NKP as great sims? The challenge - though in the case of NKP this is fully accurate, given the type of tire model Stefano dared to come up with (the best, imo).

Dunno. NkP IMHO is very sensitive, but also progressive. Drive a slow - medium corner in one of the light RWD cars, try to push 5000 Nm to the ground (torque * gear ratios) while stomping on throttle and it won't be easy to handle. Things just make more and more sense with the car balance out of the box so I suppose that's the realistic and accurate challenge of driving a car, as you said. That's one thing people seem to complain about iRacing, it handles okay, (more or less) realistic performance, speed and feel but some things don't make sense even for experienced drivers.



Point 2 is also interesting but I guess a bit off-topic. I think Pad handling and basic drivability with a wheel won't be a problem for pCars. The Wii U Pads lack analog triggers and good wheel support though, so that will be another challenge.

 

[Kjell Eilertsen]

Nothing is done yet but the most advanced tire model will be found on the Lotus 49, 98T and Ford GT40. It was just implemented this week so it won't be fully tuned yet but those three cars give a preview of things to come. I would start with the 49.

As far as weight transfer feeling... I would suggest to also test the Mercedes SLS AMG road car. It is not updated with regard to tires but shows some of the weight feel. I would experiment with the tire force in the controls section--- I have been turning it up to 115 or 120 and leaving FFB at 75 and that seems to help with my G25. It isn't perfect but I think you will feel the progress. (BTW, I don't usually experiment much with FFB settings so there may be a much better one out there)

If you want to add in an audio test, check out the Zonda R and the M3GT and be sure to listen to a replay with those cars.

Ohh that explains why I felt the 49 being a good chunk better than the other cars I've tried so far, thought it was merely down to it being a old car. ^^
I'll be taking the others for a spin asap though, thanks for the tips!

 

[Birddogg66]

Which ones are you satisfied with? I really need to go around Rouen again and would like to know which ones are apparently best by now.

Capri and a variety of GT's, LMP1 and most protos, all open wheelers are pretty good, It's really a pick and choose thing I can only recommend since you may create a totally different list than what I think is good but anyway the point is there are nice driving cars just weed through them and tell us what you think. I for one am interested to hear your opinions.

 

[Birddogg66]

Untill build 073 it was better than GTR2 and I was a big fan, after that they start changing the ffb/physics and it really turns my of now.
How can I feel ntm/btm/stm with such a bad ffb.

The last build you tried was? I agree to a point that things had gotten really good right before they dropped the old tire model for the new and I pleaded to at least keep it as an option or create a mode in efforts to keep it in some way but was shot down. The Seta Tire Model I think has added parameters in comparison so I could only expect there is a bit more to deal with in the fine tuning of the tire and balancing the different parameters. While tread model is one thing and wear and heating not being implemented yet much work has been done on grip and how to balance that with the flexi carcass and then work the weight transfer in to it all in regards to suspension. It very much is a trial an error process.
So in efforts to have overall respect of each others opinions give the game an honest run from time to time and let us know what you think. If it's civilly worded I will always respect that because the end goal is to have the title become the best it can be and everyone's voice counts. If you don't want to post your opinions @WMD fine if it's constructive I will be happy to relay the info into the forums there. Of course excluding any names

 

[Micas_WMD]

From today's build notes regarding the new throttle; This is pretty awesome IMO and demonstrates SMS' incremental, but persistent, evolution of the physics.

As you guys will see in the build release notes, we did manage to get the new throttle system in for today's build.

It's a pretty big change which we think you'll all like A LOT and we're eager to get feedback on it. Here is what to expect:

• Better feel from the throttle pedal at small inputs. This was really the main purpose of the new system; everything else is gravy. Gone is the time of the large 'deadzone' when you start to press the pedal; the engine starts producing positive torque very quickly now and you will have a much larger range for modulation.
• Snappier throttle response at low rpm.
• A car's peak power may vary a bit from track to track. This is because we now use ambient air pressure as part of the engine torque calculations, so things like elevation and weather will have an impact on engine performance.
• Idle speeds fall out of the model naturally and will change slightly from setup and weather.
• The clutch feels a lot better when pulling away from a standstill. Unexpected but really cool side effect. A lot of cars can realistically get rolling with careful modulation of the clutch and no throttle input whatsoever.
• New Brake Mapping slider in the setup screen for all cars. This controls the level of engine braking and is a fairly abstract value. Think of it like a vacuum line connected to the throttle, so that it opens up more at high rpm to relieve some of the intake manifold vacuum (the major source of engine braking torque). All you really need to know is that 0=lots of engine braking and 10+=very little engine braking.
• New Restrictor Size slider in setup screen for some cars. Fun stuff here. This changes the size of the restrictors/throttle bodies on the engine to control the amount of power produced. This will ultimately move out of the setup screen and become part of the event setup, only adjustable by the event administrator. For now it needs to be somewhere everyone can work with for testing. As a result it's possible to create a 600hp Asano X4, for example. Honor system will be required for multiplayer with these cars. Do play around with this on the cars that have it enabled. A particularly cool one is the Caper stock car which has a minimum restrictor size similar to what was used at restrictor plate tracks in 1990. You'll notice that not only does the power level reduce from 650 to 400hp, but it also moves down to a much lower rpm simulating the choking effect of the smaller air aperture. Cool stuff.

 

[Stefan Mizzi]

Tried the latest build today and loved it! I can feel better forces in the wheel too.

It's going in the right direction, I have no doubt

 

[Birddogg66]

Also a couple cars to drive that I would like your opinions on are the Bac Mono and Ariel 500 and see if that's closer to the handling that you like

 

[Stefan Mizzi]

Also a couple cars to drive that I would like your opinions on are the Bac Mono and Ariel 500 and see if that's closer to the handling that you like

Much better indeed too. What's missing is that one cannot feel the car sliding....though you can in the Lotus 49 where it's physics/tires are I think more advanced

 

[museumsteve]

I only had a super quick blast last night but the throttle improvement is excellent. I'm planning on a decent couple of hours tonight

 

[Peter]

The last build you tried was? I agree to a point that things had gotten really good right before they dropped the old tire model for the new and I pleaded to at least keep it as an option or create a mode in efforts to keep it in some way but was shot down. The Seta Tire Model I think has added parameters in comparison so I could only expect there is a bit more to deal with in the fine tuning of the tire and balancing the different parameters. While tread model is one thing and wear and heating not being implemented yet much work has been done on grip and how to balance that with the flexi carcass and then work the weight transfer in to it all in regards to suspension. It very much is a trial an error process.
So in efforts to have overall respect of each others opinions give the game an honest run from time to time and let us know what you think. If it's civilly worded I will always respect that because the end goal is to have the title become the best it can be and everyone's voice counts. If you don't want to post your opinions @WMD fine if it's constructive I will be happy to relay the info into the forums there. Of course excluding any names

The last build I tested was build 489, the Lotus 98T at Mugello.

I have to hold the wheel real tight because it slams left/right, I also still can't brake because the wheel pulls left or right. So how can I test these beautiful new things.
I stopped posting my opinion a year ago because no game is worth getting a **** load of comments over you.

 

[Birddogg66]

@PK the oscillation thing with the wheel before you get moving is a bit Hokie I agree but is not a bother when you get moving. The front brake lock up effect is by design and does to a point represent real life when entering corners. I can understand if you are not using a load cell brake and are more prone to lock ups why you may not like this effect but if you play through it actually it may be a help over time into the finesse of braking into corners. I think the pit garage is pretty close to becoming active that will allow setup tweaks on the fly and is an option when you pause the game. This will allow tweaks without a hard save of the setup and is an item I have been waiting for a long time. A brake bias tweak may be a solution. I felt the GT40 had too much rear brake and found my self spinning a lot into corners at default setup.

 

[Peter]

The brakes do not represent real life, I owned the most different cars ( Audi coupe, BMW 525i, Lancia Thema etc) and they never slamped to one side under heavy braking.

 

[Chronus]

Never experienced that myself (from an old CSL 3.0 "racer" to modern sports with stability systems off), at least in a straight line with no steering angle.

With simulations, that happens when something is obviously wrong (code or calibration wise) - unless it is not steady state. Under what circumstances does that happen with that car, Peter K.?

 

[Peter]

Never experienced that myself (from an old CSL 3.0 "racer" to modern sports with stability systems off), at least in a straight line with no steering angle.

With simulations, that happens when something is obviously wrong (code or calibration wise) - unless it is not steady state. Under what circumstances does that happen with that car, Peter K.?

I happens with every car and I'm not even braking very hard. With other sims I brake hard and when I feel that the wheels are going to lock I lift the brake, never had any problems.
If this behaviour is realistic, it's time for a bike.

I'm not the only one with that problem and if this still happens in a finished state, ppl should be warned to turn the ffb off.

 

[Randy Winston]

This game is getting better and better. I'm going to be playing it a LOT more from here on out. I just wish I had upped my membership when I had the chance so that I could race more of the cars and tracks.