Is VR dead?

[RCHeliguy]

Hmm...
I'm seeing lots of numbers listed around the Internet and these don't match what I've measured personally, but it's another data point. He is also very careful to say that this is for his head.

 

[RCHeliguy]

I have to admit I am getting more excited about the BSB than I expected and more excited about it than any headset since the Index.

 

[RCHeliguy]

Credit where credit is due. Pimax appears to be stepping up. They've apologised to their customers, admitted the issues they caused, and said they will address them.

https://pimax.com/crystal-shipping-update/

Now we see how the follow through goes.

 

[RCHeliguy]

The Beyond is the upcoming hmd I'm most obsessed with, not just he size but also really want something wiht a minimalist strap. I have headrests in my cockpits and my newest one I'm working on is for F1 and sailplane flying with the seat from a PlayseatF1 rig and really need something that doesn't have a bunch of **** back there. Plus for flying gliders you really keep your head on a swivel so you're not only using the headrest to rest your head, it is constantly rolling around on it. Just sitting looking straight ahead feels awful in it with my Index let alone actually moving my head lol.

I'm not gonna preorder but it already had my full attention even before the fov bump and on paper I'm running out of reasons to hate. It's so ironic too, cause I was really dismissive of it initially based on how much Bigscreen the app annoys me since after all this time and all the stupid things they've added to it they have yet to anchor playback audio to the god damn screen. As a home theater owner/enthusiast it makes me want to punch a kitten trying to watch anything that way.. It's so stupid and shortsighted not to pick that low hanging fruit that makes all the difference between feeling like you are actually in a home theater vs watching a movie on an airplane with headphones. It's so dumb that I couldn't imagine anyone at the company would have the wherewithal to make a good hmd with all the nuance that goes into this tech but here we are

The comparisons are now being made directly between the Crystal and BSB.

Basically the visual experience is very similar, but the Crystal is much brighter and has a bit more FOV but not significantly more. The BSB has slightly more stereo overlap, and the Crystal's local dimming appears to hold up well enough to individual pixel lighting of OLED as to not be a significant difference in appearance.

Although I have heard reviewers say that the BSB blacks make some titles much scarier.

However since you can't wear glasses with the BSB, and you are currently limited to their diopter adjustment lenses which do not offer astigmatism correction. The Crystal allows for glasses and has one vendor so far making prescription inserts.

So for me the big question will be whether the BSB is bright enough. If it is bright enough, the comfort and compelling sensation of not feeling like you are wearing a headset vs. putting on a 1kg comfy helmet will be the deciding factor.

For those of us who already have a powerful computer & 4090, and lighthouses, and Index Controllers, and an audio solution this may be an impulse buy.

I think BSB is a bit of a special headset. I don't expect many manufacturers to seriously consider offering a headset customized for person like this to get a size and weight this low. Even the proverbial next Index which I'm still waiting for will likely be a similar size to the previous Index because of the added eye tracking and likely auto IPD, and while I expect it to be a bit lighter, I can't imagine it will be close to the BSB. This may be something we won't see again for a long time.

 

[RCHeliguy]

Historically this took a $4,500 Varjo headset with a yearly maintenance fee and was mostly used by the military.

Mappable pass through video for the enthusiast who wants to see their cockpit in VR.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/apple-finally-reveals-long-awaited-ar-headset-vision-pro/1100-6514811/

 

[RCHeliguy]

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/apple-finally-reveals-long-awaited-ar-headset-vision-pro/1100-6514811/

I knew Apple would come up with a pile of things that I've never seen anywhere else.

Lots of amazing technology! This is really cool stuff!

It has very little that we would care about for sim racing, but still very impressive stuff.

Frankly at $3500 it is an absolute bargain. We have never seen that level of technology, number of features or refinement in anything offered by anyone to date.

Not having any Apple hardware, it is of absolutely no use to me, but it can't help but be impressive.

 

[Leynad777]

The Apple Vision Pro is IMO a joke. Almost everything you saw in this Keynote was not in 3D, but just 2D-apps in AR. So basically you can do everything with an iPad as mobile as with this device, just with far more battery-life, a physical keyboard (or at least with tactile feedback) for a small fraction of the price without having to wear a hot sweaty headset.

Switching from triples to VR makes sense, because VR is 3D and you sit in the car. With the VisionsPro it would be like having a virtual screen in your room, so basically just replacing physical displays at the cost of having to wear a headset that probably get as uncomfortable as all of them after a while. I don't see any benefit with this principle. With one of these glasses I could play triple-A-Games with my upcoming ROG Ally for additional 500 bucks like on a big display if I want. The VisionPro can't even do that.

 

[RCHeliguy]

So you missed the No Man's Sky port?

That judge jury and executioner verdict on a ground breaking product is laughable.

 

[Leynad777]

So you missed the No Man's Sky port?

That judge jury and executioner verdict on a ground breaking product is laughable.

This show was just another evidence of mass hypnosis because people like you want one, even you can't do anything useful with it. You want to watch films on your sofa, there are huge TVs for tiny prices in comparison available and you can even share this with other people. You want to watch films on a plane or train, use a tablet or buy one of this really tiny glasses in my link or just use a Quest or Pico for it if you want privacy. Some people seems to think you could use this as external displays while working, but Apple have not mention it, so the VisionPro won't run run desktop apps like the Adobe Suite. It will just run what's available for iOS. And even if it could run desktop apps like Virtual Desktop, nobody is doing it on PC because it's more convenient to use a physical keyboard and mouse with a big screen or multiple displays while having a drink without a straw and walk around without detaching cables. This device is not even as ground braking as Google Glass and what happened to this gadget? And btw. no Sim-Racing nor Flight-simming with the VisionPro, so why even mention it here?

 

[RCHeliguy]

We'll see

 

[metalnwood]

I couldn't imagine working on a computer the way they were showing it in the video.

It's bad enough ergonomics to work on too large a monitor let alone browsing the web on a 100" screen right in front of you.

It looks like a nice media consumption device and it does look like it will be comfortable and has more than one option for face sizes etc.

I think that doing your work like that on massive displays makes for a cool video for people that don't already work for hours a day in front of a computer and have some optimised workflow.

I do like the idea of being able to use it for computer screens in some scenarios but my fear is that even with a nice resolution it will not be ideal to put a virtual 21" screen in front of you and work with it.

 

[cnhoff]

This show was just another evidence of mass hypnosis because people like you want one, even you can't do anything useful with it. ?

Well there is a whole industry telling us what are the good and desireable products and what are the bad or cheap or whatever options that will not make you happy.
Think of Apple vs. the rest, Dbox vs. SFX, NVidia vs. AMD, Aero vs. Crystal, the list goes on forever.

While i think Apple has some good products and HW, i could not care less about this headset, it simply has no application for me.

 

[RCHeliguy]

Why this matters...

Apple is using eye tracking, auto-IPD, DFR, facial cameras for construction for avatars, high ppd displays, and complete control by eye, voice and hands.

Samsung just purchased a micro OLED manufacturing company and it planning to go head to head with Apple for an AR headset.

Those are two MASSIVE companies and this will be iPhone vs Galaxy. AR will be 100/1000 times more popular than VR and they are going to spent massive amounts of money on this technology.

Finally we will have all the tech we care about in VR being mass produced by the big powerhouses for the first time. They will have many suppliers and will start to advance AR quickly approaching a 1 yr release schedule like they have for phones. When they move on to the new latest greatest technology, the left over tech from the previous year will become cheap and the smaller VR market will be able to pick them up.

The Somnium VR1 with dynamic pass through cameras are in that mixed reality space that will gain the most from this. But what if Apple fully perfects hand tracking? What if Samsung quickly follows? The change will be fast and relentless.

Apple and Samsung will initially want small AR accessories for their iPhones and Galaxy phones. Then these devices will replace your phones and they will try to get you into a new one every year.

MS's efforts with AR were mildly interesting, but like the Zune, Windows Phone, early tablets and their efforts in AR, MS failed and got out and then Apple got things right. Now Apple has shown a vision, they have also indicated to the world that they think the time is right for this technology. Samsung will pursue as will other companies.

This is a huge deal. When a $3T company jumps into a market people notice.

 

[RCHeliguy]

I know much of this technology already exists.

Meta has face cameras
Many have auto-ipd and eye tracking
There are hand tracking systems
There are voice recognition systems.
There are MR camera systems
There are high resolution displays
There are pancake lenses .
MS even had some early AR headsets

What Apple has always done is take a bunch of existing technology as it nears maturity and integrates it into a cohesive product, in a clean form factor that is intuitive to use. People see them as inventing many things they didn't, but they make all the technology approachable and usable. So their customers see all of this technology for the first time with an Apple logo on it.

Now they also have a pile of new patents and features that we won't see until this is released in half a year or so.

 

[ltnordb]

I know much of this technology already exists.

Meta has face cameras
Many have auto-ipd and eye tracking
There are hand tracking systems
There are voice recognition systems.
There are MR camera systems
There are high resolution displays
There are pancake lenses .
MS even had some early AR headsets

What Apple has always done is take a bunch of existing technology as it nears maturity and integrates it into a cohesive product, in a clean form factor that is intuitive to use. People see them as inventing many things they didn't, but they make all the technology approachable and usable. So their customers see all of this technology for the first time with an Apple logo on it.

Now they also have a pile of new patents and features that we won't see until this is released in half a year or so.

Agree. Kinda like the first iphone, the technology was there but no one had put it all together and paired it with a streamlined intuitive software experience.

 

[RCHeliguy]

Agree. Kinda like the first iphone, the technology was there but no one had put it all together and paired it with a streamlined intuitive software experience.

Yup. This guy covers that aspect well.

He did confirm that this headset can handle HDR. So they managed to get some serious dynamics range with microOLED and pancake lenses.

 

[RCHeliguy]

3D avatar released by Meta last year vs. 3D avatar demo'd by Apple using the cameras on the headset.

 

[RCHeliguy]

In preparation for the Big Screen Beyond, assuming I go that route, I decided to try out a little USB-C DAC/headphone amp. This little beast surprised me. It drove my 846 Gen2 easily and they sound good, but what really surprised me was that my little $100 215's sound MUCH better with this.

If my Sure 215's sounded like this when I first got them, I probably would not have bothered to buy the Sure 846's. The 846's still handle vocals better and sound more natural, but for games, they are crazy overkill. With the right amplification the 215's sound plenty good enough.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B083LC9WMB

Damn that is tiny and $12.99 ! Just crazy!!

 

[RCHeliguy]

Wow! Brad really gets it!