2015 RD Touring Car Championship (Stock Car Extreme)

[Bram Hengeveld]

@Tal Everybody gets points based on their position to avoid the issues we had in the last stock car series where people were knocked off the track and had to retire with too much damage without being at fault.

 

[Sam Hill]

@Bram but isn't that hurting the drivers that race on with damage? Then they lose some of the advantage they'd get from finishing despite being taken off.

I see your point but racing is racing. If you don't finish you shouldn't get a reward. Then drivers have an incentive to try and salvage something, otherwise they just take the huff and rage quit

 

[Tume]

@Tal Everybody gets points based on their position to avoid the issues we had in the last stock car series where people were knocked off the track and had to retire with too much damage without being at fault.

I find this really fair, even though I caused my own retirement in race 2...by not avoiding a standing car sufficiently, but since it can get unfair for those who do nothing wrong, it's nice to stay close in the fight.

Also, @Mike Bell http://prntscr.com/8kzcin

 

[Bram Hengeveld]

@Sam Hill there are always two sides. If DNF's would not get points somebody else would raise the question saying its unfair that he got hit off and is now driving in server 2 for the rest of the season without being at fault.

Choices, choices, choices.

 

[Eric Stranne]

Had quite a good time in division two yesterday. Got called in to race at the final moment which was a relief as otherwise I'd have a really hard time being able to race soon enough. Managed quite a good time in the qualifying session which actually counted, probably should've been able to go a bit faster but was still a comfortable pole.

Got a good start in race 1 and tried to gap Nilsson and company as soon as possible. However, I ran out of talent going into turn 4 twice when I didn't see that the distance board had been knocked down and outbraked myself two or three times into there, loosing several seconds both times. But managed to get back up to the leaders and perform clean passes and then run away with the victory.

Obviously the win meant starting last for the second race. Managed to stall the car on the grid but just got it back going as the lights went out (seems that the car always stalls after I go out on the grid, does this happen to anyone else?) The first lap was mad, cars going everywhere and people going off all the time. Think I climbed to P15 at the end of lap 1, and then picked off car by car to get into the lead and win race two as well.

Must say some people need to look at their own defending (moving lines several times, cutting off while others have an overlap, turning in even though I was basically side-by-side etc). Doesn't fill me with confidence racing some people to be honest, and there was one or two drivers who really need to practice more. Came across one car which had spun in the final corner and was stopped on the exit and didn't move or escape. Pretty poor. Hopefully it was a one-off incident and things will be better in division two in the future.

 

[Nobkins]

Must say some people need to look at their own defending (moving lines several times, cutting off while others have an overlap, turning in even though I was basically side-by-side etc). Doesn't fill me with confidence racing some people to be honest, and there was one or two drivers who really need to practice more. Came across one car which had spun in the final corner and was stopped on the exit and didn't move or escape. Pretty poor. Hopefully it was a one-off incident and things will be better in division two in the future.

With 2 victories I would expect you to be promoted to server 1 for the next race. A quick check of the provisional standings shows you are 23rd out of 60 drivers on points. I would think that server 1 is where you will be racing next time. Congratulations on your double victory. The problem with race 2 (or additional challenge some might say) is that the very fast drivers (like yourself) are at the back of the grid and the slower drivers (who are less likely to have good defending skills etc. are in between you and victory. You won both races so you have clearly demonstrated your skill at dealing with us lesser mortals

 

[Oscar Hardwick]

The only thing with the points is that someone who got a 5th and 6th in Division 2 currently sits 4 points behind two people who double DNF'd in server 1 and in at least one of those cases it was two race DNFs through driver error. I get that you want to keep people enthused but that does seem incredibly silly.

 

[Tume]

The only thing with the points is that someone who got a 5th and 6th in Division 2 currently sits 4 points behind two people who double DNF'd in server 1 and in at least one of those cases it was two race DNFs through driver error. I get that you want to keep people enthused but that does seem incredibly silly.

Honestly, does not seem silly from my point of view. You gotta keep in mind they're two different divisions and the better you do in the lower one, the better are the chances to get in the first one. Plus, in the first division it's only expected people know how to drive (at least better than the lower division in general) so DNF in top division is never good.

 

[Oscar Hardwick]

@Tume We should not reward two DNFs with more points than two top 6 finishes, irrespective of division. If you DNF twice in Division 1 in round 1 then you probably shouldn't be there in the following race.

 

[Sam Hill]

DNF shouldn't be rewared at all IMO. Sometimes it isn't your fault that you get taken out but tough. That's racing. It shouldn't mean that those who crash on their own get rewarded

 

[Tume]

@Oscar Hardwick @Sam Hill Oh well, I'm not the one planning these events anyway.

Just seems fair to me, otherwise Andrew Waring for example would be in division 2 now, hmm?

Thought so.

Meeeeh, we all have our views. I know simracing shouldn't be made too forgiving but I like how close it is, plus chances to bounce back. There are "only" 6 rounds anyway.

 

[Eric Stranne]

Just seems fair to me, otherwise Andrew Waring for example would be in division 2 now, hmm?

If you double DNF, that's kind of what you deserve though

 

[Tume]

If you double DNF, that's kind of what you deserve though

Maybeh. And if you double win, you deserve to be in division 1

 

[Angelo dos Santos]

Yeah, the perfect solution would be provisional points for those who DNF.
And those points cannot be more than finish positions on both divisions, at all.
This go against what is fair and logical.

Personally is frustrating. On server 2 I got a Podium on race 1 but on the complete lotery that is race 2, I got involved in other peoples accidents, I was pushed off track by some """driver""" who gained a top 10 position just like that...still I fought until the end, finishing the race...11th, but I finished. I had huge potential to be in server 1 fighting hard, but race 2 went wrong for my lotery ticket.

A guy in Division 1 retires 2 times and still scores more than me is quite depressing.
You dont have to think much to find out this. If the series is supposed to be both divisions scoring for the same Championship, the system is fundamentally flaw. This is obvious.

This is one of the reasons I think fixed divisions is a much better concept.

Anyway, some things need to be improved on RD rules. Not saying for now, but surely for future series.

On other hand, my big Thank You to Bram and all RD staff for keep calm yesterday and keep the event on track despite the servers problems. I think that was a solid job and Im happy that we had both races.

 

[PicoBp]

Just my $0.02... Why did those who complain about the rules or the scoring have signed up and accepted them in the first place? These haven't changed since the championship got announced...

 

[Oscar Hardwick]

Just my $0.02... Why did those who complain about the rules or the scoring have signed up and accepted them in the first place? These haven't changed since the championship got announced...

I am in division 1 so the problem doesn't affect me. If it stays as is my championship carries on as planned. I am just saying that the problem is there and that it should at some point be looked at.

 

[Tume]

@PicoBp Exactly! They could've just stayed out.

 

[Tume]

 

[Tero Dahlberg]

Just my $0.02... Why did those who complain about the rules or the scoring have signed up and accepted them in the first place? These haven't changed since the championship got announced...

I totally agree. But just have to point out that often people need to first see how things affect them or people they know before fully understanding the rules.

 

[Chark]

Just my $0.02... Why did those who complain about the rules or the scoring have signed up and accepted them in the first place? These haven't changed since the championship got announced...

Totally agree on the general principle. Although I guess people are complaining because the fact that "DNFs score points" was not clearly specified in the first place. Here is what I mean.

From the league rules (make sure to expand):

After the race has finished points are rewarded to the drivers. You can find the scoring system below. It is the same for all RaceDepartment´s official leagues unless stated otherwise in the specific league forums.

P1 - 20
P2 - 17
P3 - 15
P4 - 13
P5 - 11
P6 - 10
P7 - 9
P8 - 8
P9 - 7
P10 – 6
P11 – 5
P12 – 4
P13 – 3
P14 – 2
P15 – 1
Pole Position – 1
Fastest Lap - 1

A driver can only score points when he has covered 75% of the race distance. This may vary on league per league basis.

It's clearly specified that the 75% rule can be altered if the league says so.

However, from this league's rules:

Points Distribution System
Points will be awarded to all the drivers in division one and two according to the following point list.

It might not be clear to some of us that "all the drivers" is actually meaning "everyone including DNFs". This misunderstanding (implying the complaints) is, to be honest, fair enough. But at least, now we know!

Motorsports are about winning in given circumstances, not winning in a 100% fair and perfect world, as it is for a lot of things actually...