Vanilla Balance Mod Beta - Testers Wanted

Status
Not open for further replies.
This mod has now been released. All the changes are listed in the above link. If a Forum Admin is reading this, if you could remove the "Testers Wanted" and change it to "Development Discussion" thread, it would be appreciated.

UPDATED TO WORK WITH 1.3

Note: In attempts to fix the interviews and dilemmas, I have temporarily removed all non English languages from those two files. I hope to reinsert them into a later version (but when I do, they'll still be the vanilla text as I am unable to translate in any other language).

 
Last edited:
FlamingRed, do you know if the triggers can be used for available answers, too? It might be interesting to have some answers only available with certain background, for instance.

Edit: Whoops, only now spotted the bit in the earlier post that says this indeed is possible.

Replacement question then: Is 3 the number of maximum possible answers that we can have?
 
Last edited:
Hi Everyone. This one is just a wrong text. The Trait works fine but the text is wrong. I guess the Special Condition should be "Driver isn't open to discussing terms with you" or something like that.
Resentful.jpg No Contract.jpg

Lap Bug Edit: Here is some more info for the lap bug. These two pictures are from 6 days before race when I got the Race report mail. I also took pic from the race calendar the same day.
Race Report 6 Days Ago.jpg Race Calender 6 Days Ago.jpg

After that when I got to the race day the lap count had changed.
Before Race.jpg In Race Weekend.jpg

The exact same happened in the previous race (Tondela) too.
 
Last edited:
Thanks Brain nice idea. This time it's Munich and as you can see the lap counts from the Race Report Mail day (8 days before race).
Munich Race Report.jpg Munich Race Report Day Calendar.jpg
A couple days after (4-5 dyas) I get the WMC and IGTC race event. And right that time (even before I get the results for the WMC [it looks like I don't get the IGTC results at all]) the lap count changed.
Event.jpg Event Calendar.jpg
So did this happen because the WMC or IGTC event or will any event trigger this effect?
And is there anything that could done to fix it?
 
Last edited:
FlamingRed, do you know if the triggers can be used for available answers, too? It might be interesting to have some answers only available with certain background, for instance.

Edit: Whoops, only now spotted the bit in the earlier post that says this indeed is possible.

Replacement question then: Is 3 the number of maximum possible answers that we can have?
I'll answer the bigger post in a post of its own in A bit.

I've seen 4 question interviews before without issue. I've not checked for 5/6/7 but can look at that tonight quickly. (It would be quite cool if I did that with question set 5 actually?. Talk about 2-3 drivers so you can make one happy insulting the others, or insulting them all but keeping your drivers happy, or make all the rival drivers happy at expense of the drivers - stuff like that).

If you go a different route, and you're creative with your "response triggers" you can have dozens of responses for a single question. E.g., you can have one question, but three unique responses if your TeamExpectstion = 10, three more unique responses if TeamExpectstions = 9, etc etc etc. This makes it thst only a few are visible st s time.


Hi Everyone. This one is just a wrong text. The Trait works fine but the text is wrong. I guess the Special Condition should be "Driver isn't open to discussing terms with you" or something like that.
View attachment 181867 View attachment 181868

Lap Bug Edit: Here is some more info for the lap bug. These two pictures are from 6 days before race when I got the Race report mail. I also took pic from the race calendar the same day.
View attachment 181877 View attachment 181878

After that when I got to the race day the lap count had changed.
View attachment 181879 View attachment 181880

The exact same happened in the previous race (Tondela) too.
Trait:
odd that the special condition text is wrong. Resentful is a vanilla Personaliy Trait... I wonder if it has the same problem in the Vanilla game. I'll check the PT tonight and see if it's obvious. If not, a quick frontend edit to that text may do it (either correcting it or making it ambiguous.... I mean, resentful kinda implies that they have an issue with you).

Edit, wait... is the vanilla one Insulted? I've lot track. How did you get this trait? Was it from the interview or dilemma?

Laps:
Given how intermittent the bug is (i.e.. you've shown it can be both correct and incorrect on the same screen), I'm gonna say that it's probably not going to be possible to fix that. It would be quicker for me to write a quick excel column with the "locations" information which had lap data for the long SS and GT races (where you can choose the race length rules and see the results).

Though it seems if you check on race day, it all works fine? That would be an even quicker solution.
 
Edit, wait... is the vanilla one Insulted? I've lot track. How did you get this trait? Was it from the interview or dilemma?

I didn't understand what you mean with "is the vanilla one Insulted?". And I got this trait neither from interview or dilemma. One day I just got an email about it.
Just mail.jpg
And for the record, as the driver mentions it, nothing happened before, I guess it's just a flavor text.

Though it seems if you check on race day, it all works fine? That would be an even quicker solution.

I guess this is more convenient. :thumbsup:
 
Disappointed is set to evolve into Resentful, I must've picked up the wrong PSG when I was adding the text.

Even though it's obvious they don't like you, you'll always get one who asks why their driver won't talk to them, hence why I've added the text.
 
I've seen 4 question interviews before without issue. I've not checked for 5/6/7 but can look at that tonight quickly. (It would be quite cool if I did that with question set 5 actually?. Talk about 2-3 drivers so you can make one happy insulting the others, or insulting them all but keeping your drivers happy, or make all the rival drivers happy at expense of the drivers - stuff like that).

If you go a different route, and you're creative with your "response triggers" you can have dozens of responses for a single question. E.g., you can have one question, but three unique responses if your TeamExpectstion = 10, three more unique responses if TeamExpectstions = 9, etc etc etc. This makes it thst only a few are visible st s time.

Hmm, cool. I think you got me hooked... even 4 options is fine I guess, I just first want to add more background-specific answers and things like that. If there's room for more options, then why not expand even further.

Do you mind if I revamp the standard answers completely while I'm at it?
 
Yes, it only changes if it has to call one of the DesignData texts. If it calls GT for a GT race weekend before the race report is spawned, then the race report will use the GTDD miles data, then on the day of your weekend it'll call the SSDD miles and show the right thing.

It is a quirk of the system, it's either not something that can be remedied or is even worth the time trying to fix, so don't bother reporting it any more as there is little, if anything, that can be done.

Same for one set of tyres showing 1 lap less in the estimations, I'm not going to chase it around as it's so minor. If it was out by 20 I'd be concerned, but 1 is negligible.
 
No major bugs encountered.
Music to my ears.

11 or 12 races yesterday with a new game started with 1.31c (mid race length, GT2, some minor mods added). No major bugs encountered.

Some more detailed things:

A. Once again saw an interview asking if I wanted to hire my own driver. I thought I took a screenshot of it, but apparently I did not, since I can't find it anywhere.
B. 3 random breakdowns, 2 of them in the same race. Seems ok to me.
C. I'm also (still) happy with the number of spins. And I've got kinda rubbish pilots.
D. 2 punctures, one at 20% wear and another at ~5%. The 20% one completely ruined my race, season and career, which is excellent!
E. I also have the display bug with estimated tyre duration. I did not pay much attention to it yet, but it seems to be recurring.
A. Was this a question 5 one? If it is, keep you're eye out and grab it and I'll be able to fix it better. If it's not a question 5 one then it's a different one which I've not seen occur before,
B. That's not bad. Is that three for your team? (Having two for your team in one race is pretty unlucky).
C. Awesome. Let us know how it continues as you get better ones.
D. 20% is indeed a bit higher then expected. I assume ultrasofts? And more importantly, did the AI have a similar issue In that instance (in vanilla, the AI are not really set to have punctures as they only occur after 0%, I have no idea how they handle a puncture before it). In one aspect, I'm glad it's occurred, I was thinking that maybe everyone changed their tyres before it happen pedi and punctures would hardly ever be seen,
E. So long as it's just one lap, I am not very worried. Have you noticed the new Tyre ztemperature mechanic yet? (I may have made it subtle - which could be good or bad,)


Game balance suggestions:

1. Longer time required to make the new car parts would be nice (+bigger influence of design office to it, leading to roughly same speed only at higher levels, longer at lower). If you have a few spec parts, you'll run out of things to do atm, even with a crap team. This would also make the bonus from Ex-Engineer background more important.
2. Mechanics skills could also use some balancing. Is pitstop legend any good at any level?
3. I'm not 100% convinced of the idea of removing the possibility of choosing the lower finish for new season than your previous one was. Sometimes it just makes sense to do a controlled step back in order to have two steps forward (e.g. when doing major upgrades to HQ or replacing drivers with young talent), and IMO the option should be left in the game. Think about McLaren with their Honda deal, I'm sure they knew they'll lose ground (even if they hoped it wouldn't be as bad as it is).
4. Does the mechanical issues / spanner icon actually have any effect on car speed? Should it? Should it be bigger?

Smaller workshop-kind of stuff (that I might mod in for my own use anyways):

5. Some tweaking for standard part components. There's some idiotic ones that just fill the grid and are never used. Especially the ones which raise the red zone.
6. Engineer part components - I think all the skills that only apply to races or qualify should be removed and replaced with something else. Does anyone really use the +to race or +to qualify components, if better ones are available? Especially the qualify thing is bad, since you don't even have a quali in half of the serieses. I think Engineer components should always be something useful and worth considering, and that'd make a bigger portion of the available pool worth hiring.

1. I've already added one day to all part times, and added 1 day off for each Design centre upgrade (3x it's normal values). I'm currently reluctant to go much more then that, a design centre with 2 days off of the time to make per level would be too overpowered, and it's already an important building anyway,

I did have the idea of making Higher Tier parts take a day or two longer to design (they already cost more). This might represent the 'complexity' of these high-end parts- but this isnt the effect you want anyway.

Anyway, it's all a money vs time issue. But yes, with spec parts tame no performance buildings, there is indeed a development ceiling. But it also needs to be with limited funds in ERS. The way forward is probably in your later suggestion.

2. Mechanic skills are very imbalanced, with the kings being Super Overtake, Nurse, Engine a Expert, and the one which eliminates redzone. The problem with PitStop Master is that pitstops can be really quick anyway,

As a side note (but on a similar note:) Some Mechanic stats and some driver stats are quite useless.

I think all of these things could be tweaked, however, it s likely all in the dll - and I'm at the limit of the amount of things I can add to that on my own really. Once MM reaches the end of its active development cycle, I'll be able to add in these dozen of minor touches without having to recreate them each and every time a new patch comes out.

3. My argument is that had I been chairman of Mclaren, the team principle would have been Fired. ;) I can relate this to Pressure, but have no idea how pressure works over time. Is it a stat from just the start of the game? Maybe I can add randomness to it... Low: -1 / 0. Medium +1, High +2. I don't want people to always choose the safe option though.

Remember that you can keep a Chairman happy while finishing below expectation anyway, I believe the chairman has to be consistantly unhappy for the ultimateum to appear. I am also thinking of making some interviews questions revolve around increasing / decreasing Chairman happiness, at the expense / in favour of the drivers. Making Chairman Morale anbalancing act with driver morale, (I'm also actually looking at creasing the 'in the red money' Chairman unhappiness again but upoing the amount you're in the red by again. )

4. You mean when you hit the redzone. I don't 'believe' it,does (I Amy be wrong). And no it shouldn't. Because
  • With legendary parts, you can be looking at 50-70% redzone when focusing on + performance ,
  • Redzone already comes with greater condition loss per tic
  • Redzone actually increases the likihood of complete random failure,
I think that's enough cons before adding time penalty too. The AI are struggling enough already with redzone issues :) I had one lad pit every other lap because his car was in a constantly bad shape.

5 and 6 are released, and also not workshop moddable actually. Changing component effects requires a frontend.txt edit to get the effects to show, and it isn't something that is currently available on the workshop.

I've played and played and played with all of the components - looking for a fun but good way to make the upgrade system better / funner. I've considered random component oarts for engineers, double power to risky parts. Tonnes of stuff - but nothing has ever felt... perfect.

I have removed one race only part as it bugged me. And I've obviously done the +redzone to the performance parts. That's it though.

I'm really happy to come back and work on this area. It's easy to add hundreds of different combinations to make more components. I just done have the right 'desired core mechanic' to make the changes to.

Like you said, there's plenty of sponsor mods already, and they are relatively trivial to make (or steal from workshop mods for your own use, as I have done with ICE), so I really wouldn't bother. Please concentrate on more important stuff, things that go beyond workshop mods!

I'll take a look at the interview stuff, and if I understand something, maybe I get some inspirations from the triggers.

I think there's still a few areas in sponsors which could be improved upon. I think the 'long term contracts' was a good step in the right direction but there's more subtilise to the file which could be added. It may be worth while for me seeing if another modded wants to work with me on sponsors, to make a version which exists as a new gameplay balance base to go alongside all of these changes.

But it's not a high priority, but as Im Effective back to editing the asset texts, it might be on the agenda again one day.
 
Disappointed is set to evolve into Resentful, I must've picked up the wrong PSG when I was adding the text.

Even though it's obvious they don't like you, you'll always get one who asks why their driver won't talk to them, hence why I've added the text.
You're going to have to teach me how messages work one day. There might be some real amazing potential in there.
Hmm, cool. I think you got me hooked... even 4 options is fine I guess, I just first want to add more background-specific answers and things like that. If there's room for more options, then why not expand even further.

Do you mind if I revamp the standard answers completely while I'm at it?
You can do, but I don't know if the version I've given you is Vanilla or Modded for 4 questions.

So if you are keeping things in excel, if you can add some sort of highlight or notes or... 'something' to which questions you've modified (and where they are in the Vanilla file), that would really help when I come to "merge" any changes you make to my 'WIP' file.

(Brand new questions aren't as bad as I can just insert them wherever).
 
I am not sure if this is my imagination, but when I keep the tire temp in the middle it seem that tire wear is minimal (then upper and under half of gauge) and pace it better (again from upper and under half of the gauge). So it seems for every situation (more laps on stint + better pace) the best is to keep it in the middle. Is that true FlamingRed or am I just imagining that? :O_o:
 
A. Was this a question 5 one? If it is, keep you're eye out and grab it and I'll be able to fix it better. If it's not a question 5 one then it's a different one which I've not seen occur before

It was one of the first questions, but I lost the damn screenshot so I can't check which exactly. :(

B. That's not bad. Is that three for your team? (Having two for your team in one race is pretty unlucky).

Yep, those were for my team only. AI got a bunch, too, but I wasn't counting them, since it's not always easy to know if they were of the 'sudden' sort or 'traditional' breakdowns.

I think the worst case still was only 6 DNFs in one race, including the crashes. But those numbers are for the first season, second might be more chaotic with lower reliabilities & higher red zones.

D. 20% is indeed a bit higher then expected. I assume ultrasofts? And more importantly, did the AI have a similar issue In that instance (in vanilla, the AI are not really set to have punctures as they only occur after 0%, I have no idea how they handle a puncture before it). In one aspect, I'm glad it's occurred, I was thinking that maybe everyone changed their tyres before it happen pedi and punctures would hardly ever be seen,

I wasn't the ultra's, it was probably the yellow ones, whatever they are called. I'm not 100% sure about the exact % where it happened, or if my driver locked up or spun just before it, but a few seconds before it was definitely around 20%. Anyways, I wouldn't consider it a problem, unless it's very frequent (which does not seem to be the case).

Have you noticed the new Tyre ztemperature mechanic yet? (I may have made it subtle - which could be good or bad,)

Yeah, there seems to be an effect. I haven't got a good touch for it yet, but it seems I can extend the tyre life a bit if needed by running a bit on the cold side. I'll continue testing this.


1. I did have the idea of making Higher Tier parts take a day or two longer to design (they already cost more). This might represent the 'complexity' of these high-end parts- but this isnt the effect you want anyway.

Anyway, it's all a money vs time issue. But yes, with spec parts tame no performance buildings, there is indeed a development ceiling. But it also needs to be with limited funds in ERS. The way forward is probably in your later suggestion.

Actually, even this would at least force the player to make some choises, assuming the times grow high enough: to have decent parts in all areas, or to have a couple of categories going to maximum.

I guess the main problem is that brakes and suspension have such a short base time.


2. I think all of these things could be tweaked, however, it s likely all in the dll - and I'm at the limit of the amount of things I can add to that on my own really. Once MM reaches the end of its active development cycle, I'll be able to add in these dozen of minor touches without having to recreate them each and every time a new patch comes out.

Hmm, I see your point, but on the other hand, this kind of stuff are potentially the things with most reward, too.

Personally I hope that the development cycle continues for a long time with a nice bunch of DLCs... :)

3. I can relate this to Pressure, but have no idea how pressure works over time. Is it a stat from just the start of the game? Maybe I can add randomness to it... Low: -1 / 0. Medium +1, High +2. I don't want people to always choose the safe option though.

No idea if pressure used anywhere else, but at least it would be kinda logical, if it indeed can be used. It does sound like a difficulty setting if nothing else.

I've yet to be fired from my position, so I'm not sure how tough it is in the long run to keep the chairman happy in these transitions. At some point I got the ultimatum which blatantly said that if I don't reach the goal I will be fired, but I never played that game far enough to see if it would have really happened.

Would it be possible to make the lower expectations simply be more punishing financially? Maybe that would be an incentive enough not to do it unnecessarily.

As a side thought: do you think this could be also used for the tech decay? Might save you from doing the different ddl's?

5 and 6 are released, and also not workshop moddable actually. Changing component effects requires a frontend.txt edit to get the effects to show, and it isn't something that is currently available on the workshop.

I've played and played and played with all of the components - looking for a fun but good way to make the upgrade system better / funner. I've considered random component oarts for engineers, double power to risky parts. Tonnes of stuff - but nothing has ever felt... perfect.

I have removed one race only part as it bugged me. And I've obviously done the +redzone to the performance parts. That's it though.

I'm really happy to come back and work on this area. It's easy to add hundreds of different combinations to make more components. I just done have the right 'desired core mechanic' to make the changes to.

The only reason why I haven't done anything to components myself yet is that I haven't been able to figure out a fun logic either. ;)

I've just noticed that I never use the +race/+qualify bits, not to mention the +compound components (which I actually forgot that they even exist!) and rarely risky parts either, except for next season's base stat scumming (unless I happen to have a designer, who got the -1 risk thingy as a 'free bonus' on top of the skills that I really wanted).

Maybe one option would be to add more -1 risk skills to the engineers, actually, and more variety in the risky parts, like good red zone decreasing stuff etc?

You can do, but I don't know if the version I've given you is Vanilla or Modded for 4 questions.

Seems to be the modded one, but I'm not 100% sure.

So if you are keeping things in excel, if you can add some sort of highlight or notes or... 'something' to which questions you've modified (and where they are in the Vanilla file), that would really help when I come to "merge" any changes you make to my 'WIP' file.

(Brand new questions aren't as bad as I can just insert them wherever).

Will do. I can easily keep the modified versions somehow marked.

I'm not quite happy how some of the answers in vanilla are always 'right' ones, I'd much rather see there be some drawbacks and so on. Plus at the same time I kinda learn what is already there and what is not, before adding new stuff. Less crossreferencing for me.
 
I am not sure if this is my imagination, but when I keep the tire temp in the middle it seem that tire wear is minimal (then upper and under half of gauge) and pace it better (again from upper and under half of the gauge). So it seems for every situation (more laps on stint + better pace) the best is to keep it in the middle. Is that true FlamingRed or am I just imagining that? :O_o:
It depends if I've messed up the coding of it ;) hotnshould be more tyre wear, cooler should be less.... hot should be more pace, cooler should be less...

I'll have a double check look of the math!

If the math is right, then you're imagining it.
 
It was one of the first questions, but I lost the damn screenshot so I can't check which exactly. :(
Nevermind, sure it will appear again. Sometimes the interview just says {interviewsubject:name} instead of a name, and just intermittently bugs out. It's a little awakward sometimes,

I just pretend that I'm being asked a question by an idiot...
Yep, those were for my team only. AI got a bunch, too, but I wasn't counting them, since it's not always easy to know if they were of the 'sudden' sort or 'traditional' breakdowns.
Well I think three a season is an okay amount. Some years will be luckier then others too.
I think the worst case still was only 6 DNFs in one race, including the crashes. But those numbers are for the first season, second might be more chaotic with lower reliabilities & higher red zones.
I expect I'm ERS that there may be upto 8... I'm beginning to like ERS being a reliabilty problem series. It's a nice 'feature' which a player an take advantage of, but can't rely on it in higher tiers,
I wasn't the ultra's, it was probably the yellow ones, whatever they are called. I'm not 100% sure about the exact % where it happened, or if my driver locked up or spun just before it, but a few seconds before it was definitely around 20%. Anyways, I wouldn't consider it a problem, unless it's very frequent (which does not seem to be the case).
Ouch. Well let me know if there's any races where everyone gets a puncture. :) it's not outside the world of possibility that could happen. Again, I'm being inventive with the code and it may have unforeseen consequences.
Yeah, there seems to be an effect. I haven't got a good touch for it yet, but it seems I can extend the tyre life a bit if needed by running a bit on the cold side. I'll continue testing this.
Sounds good.... I may have messed up the math so will be looking at it tonigtnto make sure it's working.
Actually, even this would at least force the player to make some choises, assuming the times grow high enough: to have decent parts in all areas, or to have a couple of categories going to maximum.

I guess the main problem is that brakes and suspension have such a short base time.
Becausebuildings never 'decay' eventually everyone is going to have access to legendary parts. It's a long term issue, but technically everyone can have a max HQ. In that instance, it is a case of which parts you can develop to the max, not a case of doing them all.

Would love to see some sort of building decay happen one day.
Hmm, I see your point, but on the other hand, this kind of stuff are potentially the things with most reward, too.
Very true. I wonder if I can recruit Coops to do some more areas for me if he comes back ;) I currently have to do about 6 hours of work per dev based update.

I mean, adaptability does nothing as far as I can tell, but it's easy to add a timer to reduce the rain penalty when wet. And consistency could have a random e,emended added to the time with the randomness reduced with higher consistency.
Personally I hope that the development cycle continues for a long time with a nice bunch of DLCs... :)
Me too actually. I feel there is another series coming at least. They may surprise us with a few more new features too which I've seen 'remanats' of.
No idea if pressure used anywhere else, but at least it would be kinda logical, if it indeed can be used. It does sound like a difficulty setting if nothing else.

I've yet to be fired from my position, so I'm not sure how tough it is in the long run to keep the chairman happy in these transitions. At some point I got the ultimatum which blatantly said that if I don't reach the goal I will be fired, but I never played that game far enough to see if it would have really happened.

Would it be possible to make the lower expectations simply be more punishing financially? Maybe that would be an incentive enough not to do it unnecessarily.

As a side thought: do you think this could be also used for the tech decay? Might save you from doing the different ddl's?
They're far too separated for tech decay to apply. And the financial aspect is actually fixed on the position desires, not the high/low offer itself. It's an odd one.
The only reason why I haven't done anything to components myself yet is that I haven't been able to figure out a fun logic either. ;)

I've just noticed that I never use the +race/+qualify bits, not to mention the +compound components (which I actually forgot that they even exist!) and rarely risky parts either, except for next season's base stat scumming (unless I happen to have a designer, who got the -1 risk thingy as a 'free bonus' on top of the skills that I really wanted).

Maybe one option would be to add more -1 risk skills to the engineers, actually, and more variety in the risky parts, like good red zone decreasing stuff etc?
Could do, I'll be revisiting it. Maybe we can make a list of all the components which are under balanced. Unless we can think of a good mechanic.
Seems to be the modded one, but I'm not 100% sure.



Will do. I can easily keep the modified versions somehow marked.

I'm not quite happy how some of the answers in vanilla are always 'right' ones, I'd much rather see there be some drawbacks and so on. Plus at the same time I kinda learn what is already there and what is not, before adding new stuff. Less crossreferencing for me.

If it's modded you'll see sets of Question1 question2, 3 and 4. So it's probably modded. It is still old though, but yeah :) keep a track and edit what you feel like. I agree there should be no 'Right' answers. It annoys me that there is ATM.
 
I've got a *really* slow week at work, so I can give alternative/new part component choices and whatnot a good think over, see if I can come up with something new.

As for teaching you messages, Red, it's really simple and easy to do.

And I confirmed the Resentful issue, I copied the wrong PSG: https://gyazo.com/97f82a5a67e8ce8f78e18a2047870af3

Top one is Offended, bottom is Resentful. If anyone has finished a season, could you please scout the winning drivers to check if they have the championship traits? Need to see if they are coming up correctly.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest News

Do you prefer licensed hardware?

  • Yes for me it is vital

  • Yes, but only if it's a manufacturer I like

  • Yes, but only if the price is right

  • No, a generic wheel is fine

  • No, I would be ok with a replica


Results are only viewable after voting.
Back
Top