Podium DD's VS Simucube 2's

[Darren Byrne]

Hi guys, the past while I was trying to find good comparisons between these two models of dd's. Has anyone tested both ? I understand that the software for these aren't complete yet but is there any clear winner here ? thanks.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

They can perfectly serve computer dummies with predefined profiles they ship with the product (that they never bothered to update), that online move is a smoke screen for something else.
Tommi started some discussion in that thread on subscription based model to "support future SW and product development", but quickly realized that said too much and removed the post. Damage control.
This is where that "it's all in your head" joke came from, if anyone missed that (now corrected) reply from Mika.

 

[Kiryu]

The idea to add always online to a steering wheel for simracing is beyond stupid, it's neither required, nor did anybody ask for crap like that. Seems like solving a problem that does not exist by implementing an uneccessary point of failure.

 

[Chrhun]

It's great that the angst shown by enthusiasts is now evenly distributed between the main manufacturers.

I read the thread too and did not find it that worrying. Cloud based profiles sound like a good thing for future. The DD wheels should technically very long and the subscription fee came up when thinking how to keep up the SW development for a product with lifetime that long.

 

[EsxPaul]

Cloud based profiles sound like a good thing for future.

I'm a fan of implementing cloud based profiles if they are kept as an external repository for users. That's not what GD are trying to implement though.

What they are proposing (if I understand it correctly) is removing all profiles that are currently stored locally on the servo and transferring them to the cloud. This will leave users with access to only a single, last used profile. So, if you aren't connected and online you cannot access any of your other per game/per car profiles.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

They have already done it. So now Mika (thanks to the community) is trying to think of the way to create local cache of online stored profiles, and this will not be available immediately.
Sounds like I might be holding off future TD updates, they haven't added any new or improved existing filters for the whole year anyway, and looks like this is not a priority for them, if anything they might remove or dumb some of the existing ones down.

I wish I knew which version they started limiting power, if it's already sneaked in as they say.

 

[Deleted member 1234936]

I'm not sure what all the negative fuss is about to be honest. Technology moves on, I've got terabytes of movies, tv shows, and games on hdd's, all destined to mechanically fail at some point, so when cloud started to be developed, I just see it as a bonus. Everything online at the touch of a button. If it's in the cloud then it can still be downloaded and the Import button will still be available in the TD software, Just keep your own offline backup. All my TD profiles are stored on usb sticks in triplicate.

If people don't Want to adopt Simucubes plans for the future, there is nothing stopping them from moving on. Resale prices would cover the cost of the competition. Although for me personally this would be a step back.

Companies Have to look to their future, and TD software will need ongoing development, so if cloud based is where it's at, then good luck to them.

J

 

[Kiryu]

I'm not sure what all the negative fuss is about to be honest.

Maybe it's about the fact that at the beginning it was basically planned that the wheelbase would no longer work without a connection to the cloud service that is supposed to host the profiles.

Thats like if your smart fridge stops cooling because the internet connection stopped working.

What's my benefit in that? Oh yeah, i forgot, i can easily swap profiles between my wheelbases. I mean, who does not use and operate several simucube 2s? Great!

 

[TedBrosby-]

I'm not sure what all the negative fuss is about to be honest. Technology moves on, I've got terabytes of movies, tv shows, and games on hdd's, all destined to mechanically fail at some point, so when cloud started to be developed, I just see it as a bonus. Everything online at the touch of a button. If it's in the cloud then it can still be downloaded and the Import button will still be available in the TD software, Just keep your own offline backup. All my TD profiles are stored on usb sticks in triplicate.

If people don't Want to adopt Simucubes plans for the future, there is nothing stopping them from moving on. Resale prices would cover the cost of the competition. Although for me personally this would be a step back.

Companies Have to look to their future, and TD software will need ongoing development, so if cloud based is where it's at, then good luck to them.

J

I work in tech, a lot of guys here do.
The issue is tech "for the sake of tech".
I worked on a seminar with my coworkers to teach our new hires the importance of dialing down your excitement about getting into whatever the "next big thing is". It's important to know trends, to study them and be ready for them in case they hold. But it's not good to shovel garbage into your tech stack just for the sake of having buzzwords in your portfolio. Especially not at the expense of your loyal users.

They should've built the online profile to compliment the existing offline profiles feature, not replace it.
Now they're doing the opposite. They've invested too much into this online platform and it seems they're going to try to hack together an offline mode to satisfy the "angry old men" online.

Mika seems to be a really solid engineer, but the way he talks to users is why if I were his engineering manager, I would've pulled his forum access 8 months ago and started routing his opinions through a PR representative.

 

[Wmacky]

I happen to live in a online hole. Everyone one around has high speed cable, or fiber. My one neighborhood block was forgotten somehow, and I'm stuck with slow crappy data limited DSL that likes to disconnect randomly. The less I have dependent on the Internet the better. They can keep that "required" online connection.

I think profile developement, and sharing is a great idea. The plan was sounding great UNTIL that dropped that little nugget. I don't like being "Required" to do anything. THis isn't shareware, but a expensive purchase. I'll just never update again.

 

[DrRob]

I don't get that cloud thing GD is proposing. Make it optional, but not an integral part of the functionality of the base. Problem solved.
On that note I'm still on 2020.4 I think.
Don't see a reason to upgrade as it works just fine.

 

[AccAkut]

I can see potential use for that cloud **** if you have like a squad of drivers and want them to always run the same settings, else not much. Is TD autoupdating? As I haven't changed anything on mine since I installed it last July. And seeing whats going on now I don't want to either.

 

[jamescarruthers]

I honestly thought the concept was fine until they started saying you had to be online. Be able to create and cache the profiles locally and I’m fine with it. I think the idea comes from a good place, they just got a little lost along the way.

I also think everyone on the forum is taking their own viewpoint with too much weight — they sell a lot of units more than people who are on the forum. I do research/design/product for a living and I encounter this in research all the time. If they _really_ do know their user base (not forum people!) then making the choices they make is fine.

I would hope they know their customer base fairly well, though my experience of engineering based firms is usually the opposite. Engineers are typically awful at knowing their customers. (There’s a hell of a lot of awful software out there!)

 

[klh]

I don't get that cloud thing GD is proposing. Make it optional, but not an integral part of the functionality of the base. Problem solved.
On that note I'm still on 2020.4 I think.
Don't see a reason to upgrade as it works just fine.

Except on wireless wheels where that version drains the battery quickly.
So that's the problem, there will always be natural developments you might need for one reason or another...

 

[klh]

I work in tech, a lot of guys here do.
The issue is tech "for the sake of tech".
I worked on a seminar with my coworkers to teach our new hires the importance of dialing down your excitement about getting into whatever the "next big thing is". It's important to know trends, to study them and be ready for them in case they hold. But it's not good to shovel garbage into your tech stack just for the sake of having buzzwords in your portfolio. Especially not at the expense of your loyal users.

They should've built the online profile to compliment the existing offline profiles feature, not replace it.
Now they're doing the opposite. They've invested too much into this online platform and it seems they're going to try to hack together an offline mode to satisfy the "angry old men" online.

Mika seems to be a really solid engineer, but the way he talks to users is why if I were his engineering manager, I would've pulled his forum access 8 months ago and started routing his opinions through a PR representative.

Hehe, right!
But you'd prob. have fired Tommi(coworker of Mika's) for his post, that was wisely removed silently and quickly within 30 mins from being posted....
That was one long lesson for any support person for how NOT to deal with the situation 8)
He basically confirmed every single fear of the forum that had ever been voiced.... But at the same time not confirmative... His own arguments FOR doing exactly what we all asked not to happen. Crazy act, from a company/sales perspective, but liberating HONEST, which was a part of it I actually liked, I have to say.

 

[EsxPaul]

Is TD autoupdating?

As of now, no, so you can stick with the firmware you have.

The drawback is that any future improvements to filtering will only be deployed within the newest firmware. There's been very little to no improvement on those since release anyway even though many feel that would be a far more important area of focus

I personally haven't found any reason to upgrade from the ancient 1.0.7 that I've been using for over a year now.

I feel like I'm constantly bashing GD these days which is a shame because I still think it's without a doubt the best DD option out there, hardware wise.

 

[Squared Circle]

Guys,

for whatever reason I've missed this "discussion" (that GD obviously does not want to happen).
Working in IT since now almost 40 years I've seen lots of crap. But the reasoning behind a "feature" that I can't opt-out of that "enables" me to sync my profiles over all SC2 devices that I run all over the globe is the biggest bull...t I have heard of in quite a while. Am I the only one who only has one SC2? Everybody else having 17 or more of them?

In addition I feel that a DD profile is highly subjective matter. I don't think that my profiles will be any good for anybody else. What is the sense of having 1001 profiles availlable online only for the 488 in rf2? Should I try them all to find out if I like one?

If I knew that would go in this direction I would as well have gone the Fanatec route (which I ultimately did not to avoid the vendor lock-in). What GD are doing here is worse. Big time.

Or to make it short: What is this Sh.t?

 

[jamescarruthers]

To be fair — I don't think the "across all your devices" was the key feature here... it's more that you can share them with the community.

The exact quote:

The driver can save and load profiles to your own account – You can create a profile with one device and share it to all your devices and with your friends.
Official profiles from professional drivers, teams, etc.
A voting system for the community to determine proper good profiles from the mass

I wouldn't disagree with any of these as ideas. It seems to make sense to me. Added value for those who don't want to mess with settings (aka not the people on the thread)

Reading through some of the posts again — I actually think it's just the way it was all communicated... it wasn't a great way of getting feedback which then turned in to a mess. I think they're lacking a comms person!

They should have realised when @Andrew_WOT asked about profiles being only online... they were getting in trouble.

They also said this:

We will have a fallback firmware and software version available that does not have this requirement. All new upcoming filters etc will be coming only to the latest software version.

Which means... if you really want to you can still run the older software and have normal profiles just like now. It's not like new filters etc are coming any time soon...

It doesn't say you won't be able to use your wheel without an internet connection. That was just implied by some people below that — which was wrong.

I am not defending GD — but I think it was just a perfect storm of a thread of people without much faith that the feedback would be taken on board and the right thing done and accusations of things that weren't said etc

 

[DrRob]

Except on wireless wheels where that version drains the battery quickly.
So that's the problem, there will always be natural developments you might need for one reason or another...

Good I'm using a wired wheel then!
I'm all for development and bugfixes. The "problem" I have at the moment is that everything works a charm.
FFB behaviour in ACC is absolutely fine for me. No improvements needed to satisfy me there.
No issues with firmware or software either.

Never change a running system.
I do the same with graphics drivers and the like.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

 

[Squared Circle]

@jamescarruthers : The problem in my view is not that you CAN do this. It is that you HAVE TO do this.

If GD seem to have an overwhelming technical problem with leaving my profiles on my system AND develop the driver for the device any further, it is fair to assume that they will have the same problems storing profiles anywhere else.
If they don't have a technical problem, then there must be some other reason. Which could be an economical one (it's too expensive to implement). Which is not the case as it's implemented already. What they are doing costs them more money than if they would not do it.
Which leaves only one logical explanation: They do it on purpose to force me (for whatever reason) to store my profiles somewhere else. As long as there is no logical explanation for this, I think it is fair to say: I don't like to be forced. Which I already stated was the primary reason for avoiding Fanatec. This FORCE is technically completely unnecessary - and this is what always puts me off. That's what made me stop being a customer of Apple, Adobe... a long time ago.

As a fact I have the choice of either not having my profiles stored on my system or not have any benefits from further enhancements to the software. As @DrRob already stated, there's no problem (affecting me) with the current software, so I'll leave it at that.
In the end it's just the old principle that whatever you demand has a price: If I see something in new software releases that really makes me pay the "price", I'll do it Example: While being forced by MS in all kinds of ways, I still run one Win-Installation. Because my favourite Racing Sims just require it

 

[Deleted member 197115]

I also think everyone on the forum is taking their own viewpoint with too much weight — they sell a lot of units more than people who are on the forum. I do research/design/product for a living and I encounter this in research all the time. If they _really_ do know their user base (not forum people!) then making the choices they make is fine.

It is possible, but I am genuinely curios who are all these people and how exactly they communicate feedback to GD. Obviously if they are sim racing they should be registered on some form of forum, unless they don't have internet.

Plus as it was pointed out a few times on main discussion thread, having profiles online will not solve any problem for them, we have predefined profiles already right there at the click of the button.