I wasn't mocking you. That's why I put a "
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2012 Formula One Spanish Grand Prix
- Thread starter Manuel De Samaniego
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Not Lewis' fault but the team broke the regulation,that was re-written after they tried to exploit it in Canada 2010, and deserve the penalty. If the team was aware he was underdueled why not abort the lap and accept the 3-4th that he wouldve gotten with his initial time? You can't creatively interpret your way out of " your car must return to the pit under its own power." They gambled and lost.
Chris Jenkins
Driving til the wheels fall off
The biggest problem for Hamilton now is that he's at the back having used two sets of options and one set of primes.
MS started from 22nd last race and finished 16sec off his teammate who started in 5th
i say: its barometer time
i say: its barometer time
I think Lotus-Renault has a good chance of grabbing 1-2 tomorrow. The first lap should be really interesting because it's pretty hard to overtake on this track. Especially for Red Bull because they lack a bit of straight line. Hamilton should've been forced to start from P10, not P24. Seems unlikely to me that Lewis will score points tomorrow.
Last butnot least: Massa qualified 17th. If he is driving the same car as Alonso, he should be replaced quickly. Or is he used as an upgrade-tester?
Last but
I agree with the regulation; We don't want everyone stopping on the track in qualifying.
I don't agree with the penalty. This wasn't Hamilton's fault. The team failed to inform him that he didn't have enough fuel. Why not exclude him from Q3, and use his Q2 time, because he had enough fuel for that. Or they could exclude Hamilton's points from the WCC. The team is at fault, but the penalty went to the driver.
I don't agree with the penalty. This wasn't Hamilton's fault. The team failed to inform him that he didn't have enough fuel. Why not exclude him from Q3, and use his Q2 time, because he had enough fuel for that. Or they could exclude Hamilton's points from the WCC. The team is at fault, but the penalty went to the driver.
Agree, for me he only should loose his times on Q3, he didn't do nothing wrong on the other stages of the qualify. But it was Hamilton and he already are use to this, rules are always different for him.
I think his first flyer in Q3 was on a used set of tires so he would have had to start on 6 laps old soft tires.
most comments are a bit harsh i don't like hamilton that much but some of the penalties are a bit much , and everyone who says he deserved it its not like he pulled up to the gas station and said "gotta get home quickly better only put a £5 in instead of £15 in on gas was it no he didn't fill the car and he didn't know , it was a team member error and he gets punished (i wonder if it was the rear wheel man what got replaced that filled the tank)
Apart from the fuel drama for Hamilton which is a shame for him, qualy has become a poor show in general.
There is no incentive for the teams to go out and really push an F1 car to it's limit.
F1 is meant to be the top level of motorsport, not a demonstration in tire management.
Want to spice up qualifying, here are my thoughts.
Points allocated for top three in the final session upon completion of a full lap.
Each driver who makes the top ten has two sets of super soft qualy tires just for that session use only.
Lets see these cars at their best potential, not putting around looking after tires.
Cheers.
There is no incentive for the teams to go out and really push an F1 car to it's limit.
F1 is meant to be the top level of motorsport, not a demonstration in tire management.
Want to spice up qualifying, here are my thoughts.
Points allocated for top three in the final session upon completion of a full lap.
Each driver who makes the top ten has two sets of super soft qualy tires just for that session use only.
Lets see these cars at their best potential, not putting around looking after tires.
Cheers.
I'm kinda happy to see Hamilton get the penalty, going to enjoy seeing how far Hamilton can move up. Expecting some great overtakes from him!
As for rules being different for him...I disagree with that statement. However I will say consistency has been lacking in the past with the Stewards.
And finally the penalty, I think it's good they excluded him. After all it's a team sport so when one person messes up the entire team is held accountable for the mistake as a team. And not following the rules should result in an exclusion right?
As for cars also stopping after they finish the race not being treated the same way...it's a fair point. Bare in mind I didn't read this whole thread so I guess it depends if that rule is also applied to the race or not.
As for rules being different for him...I disagree with that statement. However I will say consistency has been lacking in the past with the Stewards.
And finally the penalty, I think it's good they excluded him. After all it's a team sport so when one person messes up the entire team is held accountable for the mistake as a team. And not following the rules should result in an exclusion right?
As for cars also stopping after they finish the race not being treated the same way...it's a fair point. Bare in mind I didn't read this whole thread so I guess it depends if that rule is also applied to the race or not.
Pretty ridiculous that even when Alonso can put the Ferrari in third place, the best Massa can do is 17th. Massa tried to downplay the upgrades by saying that they were minimal, but that doesn't make it okay for him to be 14 places behind his teammate.
You win as a team, you lose as a team
The rule specifies practice sessions. It somehow makes sense.
During a qualifying session, you stop the car anywhere because of fuel, and there's a yellow flag, and probably a red flag. Any other drivers on the track will have lost their hotlap attempt, and probably wasted a set of new tyres.
After the race, well, anyone who is behind you will already be finished.
So it can't be compared with cars running out of fuel after the race, because that does not break rule 6.6.2 (not sure if it's defined as an infraction anywhere in the rulebook though). I reiterate that I wish penalties were stated in the rules themselves, instead of left to the stewards' whim.
During a qualifying session, you stop the car anywhere because of fuel, and there's a yellow flag, and probably a red flag. Any other drivers on the track will have lost their hotlap attempt, and probably wasted a set of new tyres.
After the race, well, anyone who is behind you will already be finished.
So it can't be compared with cars running out of fuel after the race, because that does not break rule 6.6.2 (not sure if it's defined as an infraction anywhere in the rulebook though). I reiterate that I wish penalties were stated in the rules themselves, instead of left to the stewards' whim.
Good point ^ That hadn't crossed my mind but it would still be a better place to start than 24th. Gotta love that 20/20 hindsight XD
Excellent point! I really believe Hamilton's exclusion is warranted now. Wasting someones set of tires is pretty severe with the pirelli's.
Hamilton definitely deserved a penalty because the rule clearly states you must have enough fuel to make it back to the pits plus 1L to show the officials; however I think this penalty was too harsh. I mean, some announcers on twitter were sayings he'll probably get a 5 place or 10 place grid penalty or get excluded from Q3, but starting last? This was not a big deal, his team mess up (or tried to break the rules depending how you look at it) and he didn't have enough fuel. It's not like he was blocking the track not letting anyone get a time in. I'm in no way a huge fan of Hamilton, but this penalty was way too harsh for the crime committed.
Standing still always leads to a yellow flag, thus preventing others from drive flat out, because drivers have to drive slower when there's a yellow flag..
The same what Schumacher did in Monaco, Hamilton was just a little less obvious..
thing is hamilton stopped when the session had finished with no other cars on a hotlap. so it's exactly the same situation as when the drivers run out of fuel when the race has finished.
however, rules clearly state that you're not allowed to do this so a penalty is fair. it's just that putting hamilton all the way back to the grid for doing something which was neither unsportsmanlike or dangerous seems incredibly harsh
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