Tactile Immersion - General Discussion - Hardware & Software

[CC]

I use 3x NX1000D Amps 3000 seems like overkill for me unless you want to power a spaceship

 

[vanka472]

I use 3x NX1000D Amps 3000 seems like overkill for me unless you want to power a spaceship

What shakers are you powering?

 

[CC]

What shakers are you powering?

6x BK LFE Mini

 

[FlikenFlaken24]

Hi!

Im looking for help to build my own sim setup, english isnt my main language sorry.
If you can link me any guides in this topic that would help. Mainly playing iRacing.

Im thinking about to use transducers for my seat and rumble motors for my pedals.
I read forums and google for days, but there is too much information, basicly i want to use bass shakers on my seat, read a lot of options but maybe the 2 shakers for the 2 sides would be the best mounted on my seat. The other possibility is the 4 corners but i think that wouldnt give more immersion for me.

Found this for pedal rumble link, dont know wich one would be better, this or the transducers.

Need help onwhat parts, software i need to buy or how to connect and setup them.
Arduino uno is the best option for this?

My rig:
Simetik K2 base
Fanatec CSL elite LC pedals
Old BMW seat (im going to change this to a "proper" seat in the future)

Thanks for reading this, if somebody asked this or its already answered sorry for the post.

 

[Tom_Hampton]

Hi!

Im looking for help to build my own sim setup, english isnt my main language sorry.
If you can link me any guides in this topic that would help. Mainly playing iRacing.

Im thinking about to use transducers for my seat and rumble motors for my pedals.
I read forums and google for days, but there is too much information, basicly i want to use bass shakers on my seat, read a lot of options but maybe the 2 shakers for the 2 sides would be the best mounted on my seat. The other possibility is the 4 corners but i think that wouldnt give more immersion for me.

Found this for pedal rumble link, dont know wich one would be better, this or the transducers.

Need help onwhat parts, software i need to buy or how to connect and setup them.
Arduino uno is the best option for this?

My rig:
Simetik K2 base
Fanatec CSL elite LC pedals
Old BMW seat (im going to change this to a "proper" seat in the future)

Thanks for reading this, if somebody asked this or its already answered sorry for the post.

You can see my post above (https://www.racedepartment.com/thre...cussion-hardware-software.137631/post-3207069)

Also, Brutal Deluxe has a similar setup on the same page (a few posts after mine).

I'm planning to put exciters on my pedals. I looked at the rumble motors, and initially considered it. But, after experiencing the exciters on the seat, they have PLENTY of power to vibrate a pedal. Mounted directly to the pedal, I'm sure it won't be needed though. Further, you have "infinite control" over the rumble effect (frequency, modulation, etc) that gets generated. The rumble motors would be much more limited in both...further, there will be a small spin-up delay in the rumble effect that will not be present in the exciter.

The software (SimHub) is free, but donation is encouraged...because its amazingly well done.

SimHub, DIY Sim Racing Dash and Hardware – Bring Your Sim Racing Rig To Life

www.simhubdash.com

It has plugins for many different things, not just base-shakers. This includes the rumble motors if you decide to go that route...you can do both shakers and rumbles from the same package (and overlays, and other cool stuff).

 

[FlikenFlaken24]

You can see my post above (https://www.racedepartment.com/thre...cussion-hardware-software.137631/post-3207069)

Also, Brutal Deluxe has a similar setup on the same page (a few posts after mine).

I'm planning to put exciters on my pedals. I looked at the rumble motors, and initially considered it. But, after experiencing the exciters on the seat, they have PLENTY of power to vibrate a pedal. Mounted directly to the pedal, I'm sure it won't be needed though. Further, you have "infinite control" over the rumble effect (frequency, modulation, etc) that gets generated. The rumble motors would be much more limited in both...further, there will be a small spin-up delay in the rumble effect that will not be present in the exciter.

The software (SimHub) is free, but donation is encouraged...because its amazingly well done.

SimHub, DIY Sim Racing Dash and Hardware – Bring Your Sim Racing Rig To Life

www.simhubdash.com

It has plugins for many different things, not just base-shakers. This includes the rumble motors if you decide to go that route...you can do both shakers and rumbles from the same package (and overlays, and other cool stuff).

Hi!

Thanks for the response, i read your post and Brutal Deluxe full guide, all this is looking good for first try. I barely understand this whole thing but that exiters have enough range for low frequency sound?
Your suggestion to use it on the pedal makes the whole thing easier. Im planning 1 for the brake pedal and 2 for the seat in mono mode, this amplifier is capable to do this? Like can it send 2 different signals to the 2 side? If i understand correctly this is the way to use this mounted on the seat.

Is there any cheaper option for the amplifier? What cables or anything else do i need? It will be plug and play? I have a B450 Mortar Max motherboard with back panel like this.
Realtek® ALC892 Codec

• 7.1-Channel High Definition Audio
  

Sorry for the lot of questions, its a bit hard to understand everything.

 

[KnIgHtCoM]

Thank you! The link goes straight to the channel, but if you are not in the discord that doesn't work so just incase anyone else was looking for it.

Simhub Discord Link:

Rejoins le serveur Discord SimHub !

Découvre la communauté SimHub sur Discord - discute avec 28252 autres membres et profite du chat vocal et textuel gratuit.

discord.com

Chanel Link:

Discord - Group Chat That’s All Fun & Games

Discord is great for playing games and chilling with friends, or even building a worldwide community. Customize your own space to talk, play, and hang out.

discord.com

I'm a Discord noob. How do I find RomainRob's profile in the channel? I did a search on his name, but not really finding anything relevant.

 

[Tom_Hampton]

Hi!

Thanks for the response, i read your post and Brutal Deluxe full guide, all this is looking good for first try. I barely understand this whole thing but that exiters have enough range for low frequency sound?

Yes, the exciters are clearly good down to 40 Hz. I tried some effects down into the 30s, and they didn't seem to be able to generate the amplitude down that low. Granted I've only played around with them for a week. And I haven't done anything all that rigorous. But, clearly from 40Hz up...they are glorious.

They are capable of producing full-range audio well into the KHz. I think I noted above that on my aluminum seat standard windows alert tones are clear as a BELL. Obviously different materials will impact that...aluminum is kind of a best case (except perhaps tempered glass).

Your suggestion to use it on the pedal makes the whole thing easier. Im planning 1 for the brake pedal and 2 for the seat in mono mode, this amplifier is capable to do this? Like can it send 2 different signals to the 2 side? If i understand correctly this is the way to use this mounted on the seat.

The amplifier I linked has 4 independent inputs and 4 independent outputs. So, Ch1-input will drive exciter1 output. Similarly with ch2 - ch4.

Each input to the amp comes from one output from your sound card. 7.1 surround has 8 channels, normally described as:

Front Left
Front Right
Front Center
Side left
Side Right
Rear Left
Rear Right
Subwoofer

Each of these channels is mapped to one of the outputs on your MB. Different systems map them differently to each 3.5mm jack. My MB maps 2 channels to every output.

Jack 1 = Front left / Front Right
Jack 2 = Side left / Side Right
Jack 3 = Rear left / rear right
Jack 4 = Front Center / Subwoofer

In this case you can use TRS - RCA cables for all jacks. These have 3.5mm TRS connector on one end, and two RCA connectors on the opposite end (typically colored RED and WHITE).

My 7.1 sound card maps things differently, where I have 3 outputs mapped to two of the jacks.

Jack 1 = Front Left / Front Right
Jack 2 = Rear left / Rear Right / Side Right
Jack 3 = Front Center / Subwoofer / Side Left

In this case you need TRRS - RCA cables for jacks 2 and 3. Again, they have a TRRS 3.5mm connector on one end, and this time three RCA connectors on the other end (typically colored RED, WHITE, and YELLOW).

Both options can be purchased cheaply from numerous places.

Is there any cheaper option for the amplifier? What cables or anything else do i need? It will be plug and play? I have a B450 Mortar Max motherboard with back panel like this.

I don't know if there is a cheaper amplifier. But, $20 USD / channel is pretty low cost. So, I kind of doubt it. I don't know your MB, and cant tell anything from the pic. You'll just have to read the manual to figure out the channel / Jack mapping similar to the above. Purchase cables as required, per my comments above.

Plug and play...well, sorta. Simhub needs some setup. I linked a good starting simhub configuration file above. But, you will still have to figure out which sound card channel connected to which exciter, and where it is located, and which effects should be mapped to that exciter. The more you deviate from RomainRob's personal setup, the more you will have to figure out on your own.

If you follow the link to the discord channel, RomainRob talks about his specific configuration. From there it becomes a journey of discovery for what works, and what you like, and what gives you the feedback you need to drive better.

 

[Tom_Hampton]

I'm a Discord noob. How do I find RomainRob's profile in the channel? I did a search on his name, but not really finding anything relevant.

Its definitely a pain. His post was on 2 Jan 2020. If the link below doesn't work search for " Clutch bite point".

I think this is the link:

Discord - Group Chat That’s All Fun & Games

Discord is great for playing games and chilling with friends, or even building a worldwide community. Customize your own space to talk, play, and hang out.

discord.com

 

[Tom_Hampton]

What's missing for the non-engineering types is a good tactile system theory of operation guide. It seems a lot of people struggle with the overall complexity of the system. Much of the needed info is in this thread....but, good lord, at 141 pages its unwieldy. Sure there's the search function....but, its adequate, at best....like most forum search functions. Besides, you can only search for what you have a-priori knowlege of. Even then, you have to sift through hundreds of hits to find the sequence of discussions, and understand the evolution of the viable solutions.

Hmmm....

 

[FlikenFlaken24]

What's missing for the non-engineering types is a good tactile system theory of operation guide. It seems a lot of people struggle with the overall complexity of the system. Much of the needed info is in this thread....but, good lord, at 141 pages its unwieldy. Sure there's the search function....but, its adequate, at best....like most forum search functions. Besides, you can only search for what you have a-priori knowlege of. Even then, you have to sift through hundreds of hits to find the sequence of discussions, and understand the evolution of the viable solutions.

Hmmm....

At the moment im just reading trough Mr Latte's posts in this thread. Its really hard for me to understand what are you guys are talking about sometimes.

 

[Tom_Hampton]

At the moment im just reading trough Mr Latte's posts in this thread. Its really hard for me to understand what are you guys are talking about sometimes.

Yeah, I know. That's a good place to start....although ScreamingBejesus build thread looks very promising and may end up being a better guide than this thread....certainly more succinct, and represents the culmination of this thread which has evolved considerable since 2017. Going back to the beginning without reading right through to the end may lead you down what turned out to be a blind alley (aka SimVibe).

I've only just started around here. But, I'm a 30 year veteran electrical engineer who has spent the bulk of his career designing signal sensing and processing products (software and hardware) from small scale boxes to entire Aircraft. So, I have somewhat of an advantage over those without a similar background.

I'm mostly musing about how I might be able to assist in providing some clarity, in a moderately complex topic.

 

[FlikenFlaken24]

Yeah, I know. That's a good place to start....although ScreamingBejesus build thread looks very promising and may end up being a better guide than this thread....certainly more succinct, and represents the culmination of this thread which has evolved considerable since 2017. Going back to the beginning without reading right through to the end may lead you down what turned out to be a blind alley (aka SimVibe).

I've only just started around here. But, I'm a 30 year veteran electrical engineer who has spent the bulk of his career designing signal sensing and processing products (software and hardware) from small scale boxes to entire Aircraft. So, I have somewhat of an advantage over those without a similar background.

I'm mostly musing about how I might be able to assist in providing some clarity, in a moderately complex topic.

As i said my english is not good, so you are saying that simevibe is good now but was bad back at 2017?

 

[Tom_Hampton]

As i said my english is not good, so you are saying that simevibe is good now but was bad back at 2017?

No the REVERSE. Back in 2017 when Mr. Latte started this, SimVibe was "the solution". Then simhub (well...ShakeIT...which merged into Simhub) came along, and changed the game with fully custom, unlimited effect profiles, channel mappings, sound cards, etc. It opened up a world of control (and complexity) that didn't exist previously.

 

[FlikenFlaken24]

No the REVERSE. Back in 2017 when Mr. Latte started this, SimVibe was "the solution". Then simhub (well...ShakeIT...which merged into Simhub) came along, and changed the game with fully custom, unlimited effect profiles, channel mappings, sound cards, etc. It opened up a world of control (and complexity) that didn't exist previously.

Oh ok, i missed the part that there is a simvibe and a simhub. in my head the software was something simXXXX....

 

[FlikenFlaken24]

Yeah, I know. That's a good place to start....although ScreamingBejesus build thread looks very promising and may end up being a better guide than this thread....certainly more succinct, and represents the culmination of this thread which has evolved considerable since 2017. Going back to the beginning without reading right through to the end may lead you down what turned out to be a blind alley (aka SimVibe).

I've only just started around here. But, I'm a 30 year veteran electrical engineer who has spent the bulk of his career designing signal sensing and processing products (software and hardware) from small scale boxes to entire Aircraft. So, I have somewhat of an advantage over those without a similar background.

I'm mostly musing about how I might be able to assist in providing some clarity, in a moderately complex topic.

ScreaminBejesus guide is awesome, very complex, but its not for my budget, i think i will start the 2 exciter on the sides and missing out on the frequencies below 40hz. I only need road, curbs, and wheel lock if i understand this correctly and i assume those are higher than 40hz or i hope

 

[Tom_Hampton]

ScreaminBejesus guide is awesome, very complex, but its not for my budget, i think i will start the 2 exciter on the sides and missing out on the frequencies below 40hz. I only need road, curbs, and wheel lock if i understand this correctly and i assume those are higher than 40hz or i hope

As noted above, I have 4 exciters, only. No BK's. Mine are on the 4 corners of my seat. I thought the same as you....don't need many effects....just the driving feedback related effects. Then I turned on Engine Vibe, Speed, etc....They are very good for the immersion, and general feel of driving a real car.

I'm already plotting another 8 exciters, because 4 is not enough for all of the effects (without getting muddy or overworking the exciters), and I want to drive the pedals too (mostly for wheel lock). Then it will be onto the BK based effects.

Note I drive a real racecar, so this whole motivation is to fill in practice time when I can't be at the track. So, I'm NOT looking for artificial effects any more than I can help it.

 

[FlikenFlaken24]

As noted above, I have 4 exciters, only. No BK's. Mine are on the 4 corners of my seat. I thought the same as you....don't need many effects....just the driving feedback related effects. Then I turned on Engine Vibe, Speed, etc....They are very good for the immersion, and general feel of driving a real car.

I'm already plotting another 8 exciters, because 4 is not enough for all of the effects (without getting muddy or overworking the exciters), and I want to drive the pedals too (mostly for wheel lock). Then it will be onto the BK based effects.

Note I drive a real racecar, so this whole motivation is to fill in practice time when I can't be at the track. So, I'm NOT looking for artificial effects any more than I can help it.

Okay i think i get it now. I dont really know what effects can i get from simhub, im just guessing. One exciter can only used for 1 effect otherwise they will overlap each other or something? In that case i might need to go with 4 but then im missing out on the pedal.
I assume for 5 exciter i need a different amp? Possibly more expensive?

 

[vanka472]

I'm a Discord noob. How do I find RomainRob's profile in the channel? I did a search on his name, but not really finding anything relevant.

If you click the link it should bring you right to it, just make sure you have already joined the discord server first.

 

[vanka472]

Okay i think i get it now. I dont really know what effects can i get from simhub, im just guessing. One exciter can only used for 1 effect otherwise they will overlap each other or something? In that case i might need to go with 4 but then im missing out on the pedal.
I assume for 5 exciter i need a different amp? Possibly more expensive?

An excited can run more than one effect, it can just get muddy if you start putting too many effects on them. For example, if you have engine RPM, Road Textures, and Kerbs, the exciter would essentially be on at all times, which makes it difficult to isolate any of those effects that you are trying to feel in particular.

Exciters are a great and cheap way to get into tactile, without have to buy a BK and an inuke. Don't get me wrong, those are the correct direction if you want the ultimate feedback experience, but the beauty of this entire setup is that they work well with the exciter setup as is.

The Dayton audio DAEX32EP-4 are great for the price and the direction that I would start with. First, figure out how many you want on your seat. On my bucket seat I will be running 8 exciters (still waiting on another shipment of those). Each one of those runs on 50w. Nobosound makes quite a few great amplifiers that can run those exciters. I went with the NS 01-G. They were about $25 and each amp can support 2 of those exciters.

I would say first focus on either just the seat or the pedals and start tuning that in. With both the amps and exciters being so affordable, its not too bad to get them whenever works best for you. I ordered my amps from China, and it been a month and I still haven't gotten them so keep that in mind when ordering, depending on your location.