Tactile Immersion - General Discussion - Hardware & Software

[Mr Latte]

Ah, Ok, I thought I read a while back that you couldn't use the c/sub channel. Thanks for giving me the good news.

Simvibe could only support 4 channels per card regardless if you used a 5.1 or 7.1 unit.
Also Simvibe is limited to 4 CM and 4 EM channels = 8 maximum.

Simhub lets you use soundcards with no such limitations and as many soundcards as you want as well as supporting USB which Berney Villers never recommended with SimVibe.

 

[AJ McDaddy]

Thanks @Mr Latte , that's exactly where I got that info from. I can return the external sound card as it will be a while before I add more than 2 more exciters anyway.

 

[Mr Latte]

Thanks for the info on red rings on iNukes, good that I can start searching for more info.

Anyway I started the amp and had the game paused, so it didn't start from cold to high output.

When you got these red rings, have you managed to get your amp fixed? If so, how much did it cost? Should I tell the service center some specifics when asking for quote on repair?

Also there is no point of replacing the fuse and trying to turn it on, if it wasn't just the fuse (just wishful thinking )?

Anyway in the first thread I have found:

"Most of the people that I have seen try and fix these, or.... even send in to have fixed, end up blowing again shortly. Best to just buy a new one. This is the general intention of most manaufacturers when they sell you these type of units in the first place."

If the amp is dead, I will probably get the NX3000D, but that's quite a financial hit .

Regarding exciters, I'm starting to do little bit of research, but they are quite tall at 32 mm. Still need to figure out, if I can attach them directly to the paddles, or I will have to place them outside on the seat.

Regarding SFX, I will keep testing and maybe get into its tactile setup little bit, but it doesn't make too much sense to me to use actuators for tactile effects - the main impacts are going directly to the ground and the rig is 200+ kg, much better to get tactile closer to the body, than have the rig act as high-powered sledge hammer to deliver detailing of the engine.

I have the feet isolated, but we'll see when I crank up RPM to 3000 The rig is already jumping up and down on crashes on 1200 RPM .

I will test more SFX + tactile bumps integration, on 1200 RPM i didn't get that much detailing on saw curbs for example, but I think it will be better on 3000 RPM.

I would recommend to hang on to SFX, it's really great. I also think, that it doesn't require that extensive profile tuning as tactile does. G-Seat also doesn't require that much, I had it setup when I started and still use the same setup with just minor tweaks and each car is unique, due to its suspension / acceleration / deceleration and other telemetry characteristics.

As I said, it really brings new dimension, that's worth exploring, but it comes all to the budget among other considerations, so I get what you mean.

Once I had all the parts for SFX, I built it in 3 days, so that's very little time invested compared to tactile setup / tuning.

I feel I have to keep my focus on the tactile for my own build at the moment, besides I still have new DD Wheel and Pedals to buy and I can see me even buying a new monitor before I would commit to motion. With the current work situation impacting on what money is coming in this also will just lengthen the time it takes. So I am going to sell the SFX components I have in the members market. Impressive that you got yours all built so quickly.

To get amp fixed is close to about £100, maybe yours is still under warranty. Some people sell for parts on eBay then get a replacement which may help. Ive seen 1000 DSP sell @ £130 and it will power dual Concert nicely no problems and they pop up on ebay every so often.

 

[Michal Burisin]

I feel I have to keep my focus on the tactile for my own build at the moment, besides I still have new DD Wheel and Pedals to buy and I can see me even buying a new monitor before I would commit to motion. With the current work situation impacting on what money is coming in this also will just lengthen the time it takes. So I am going to sell the SFX components I have in the members market. Impressive that you got yours all built so quickly.

To get amp fixed is close to about £100, maybe yours is still under warranty. Some people sell for parts on eBay then get a replacement which may help. Ive seen 1000 DSP sell @ £130 and it will power dual Concert nicely no problems and they pop up on ebay every so often.

Yeah, this situation is really bad for those affected

For me, the work is the same luckily. Maybe it's on the contrary, everything is closed, even borders, so my usual ways for spending money (sport and travel) are limited - also due to my recurring injuries past couple years, so beside mortgage and usual living costs, simracing is now my only bigger expense... And also I work more than I would normally if everything was open as usual.

I found one official Behringer service center so I will ask them. If it was around 130 EUR, that would be allright with me. New NX3000D is around 300 EUR around here

I never had much trust in used equipment - used old iNuke model might be just close to the red ring death as well, but it might just be ok, I'll take a look what is on offer.

I hope rest of those iNukes I have won't die...

 

[gnoshme]

Does anyone have any resources on wanting to build your own amp? Or finding a good amp that does 4x100 or 6x100. My goal is to do 4-8 transducers but not sure exactly how I wanna lay them out. I am thinking about getting the Aura AST-2B-4 since they get such an overwhelmingly positive review across the board.

The reason I was thinking of building an amp is that it seems like there is some decent cost savings there.

If you are of that mindset of actually building you'll find this useful and is of more practical value that the typical response of being waterboarded with stats and links to specs. This is based on real life testing with the AST-2B-4. The only push back you'll hear about them is by someone who just can't deal with how cheap they are and therefore assumes they aren't good but hasn't actually used them. I don't think you could buy the components cheaper than these boards which is crazy.

https://www.vanagony.com/buttkicker-amps-bass-shaker-cheap-amp-alternatives-driving-chair-sim/

 

[vanka472]

If you are of that mindset of actually building you'll find this useful and is of more practical value that the typical response of being waterboarded with stats and links to specs. This is based on real life testing with the AST-2B-4. The only push back you'll hear about them is by someone who just can't deal with how cheap they are and therefore assumes they aren't good but hasn't actually used them. I don't think you could buy the components cheaper than these boards which is crazy.

https://www.vanagony.com/buttkicker-amps-bass-shaker-cheap-amp-alternatives-driving-chair-sim/

This was perfect and will definitely go on my bookmarks to reflect back to. I like the breakdown of different amps and what they mean.

I decided on doing 8 exciters on the seat itself, and for the amps, I ended up ordering 4 of these since they do 2x50. Considering the price, they reflect quite well to what was mentioned int the thread. I will have to see how to work out, but they do contain the 3166 chipsets which I know it highly regarded for the 50W range.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32897770205.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.27424c4dqklk0I

I have plans for many more transducers and exciters along the way, so I know there will be a spot to make/use more amps as the build continues!

 

[Mr Latte]

If you are of that mindset of actually building you'll find this useful and is of more practical value that the typical response of being waterboarded with stats and links to specs. This is based on real life testing with the AST-2B-4. The only push back you'll hear about them is by someone who just can't deal with how cheap they are and therefore assumes they aren't good but hasn't actually used them. I don't think you could buy the components cheaper than these boards which is crazy.

https://www.vanagony.com/buttkicker-amps-bass-shaker-cheap-amp-alternatives-driving-chair-sim/

My issue isn't with the price, or that decent results cannot be achieved by what you recommend. Its that most people coming into tactile find it confusing and bringing the d.i.y amp approach makes it even more confusing. Very few people coming into this, I think will be electronic hobbyists or consider saving a few $ with the additional risks of them doing something wrong with the approach you offer.

Your own blog is unfair, it chooses a much higher priced amp than other suitable units that are available. So this makes your own approach look even more appealing. Yes, savings can be made, are they really worth it, that may depend on the user, for most I'd say no even though your intentions here are good.

Although I did find it amusing how you went into BMI and tell people stuff like this regards tone generated tests...

"You'll notice that your setup can't hit 5hz, but if you send it a 30hz and 35hz signal at the same time, you'll get a 5hz "experience".

I won't even bother showing you the results of applying 30Hz & 35Hz combined and this compared to a 5Hz response for a repeatable effect like Gearshift. If you don't have hardware that can properly produce the lower bass and you can only feel the generated harmonics from the 5Hz output. Well then its easy to say things like you did and think you are accurate but on a unit that can generate the 5Hz bass then it would feel very different.

What this does, is you give people the impression that you can still get a 5Hz "experience" from budget tactile.
Man, that's kinda misinforming folk as, errrr no you can't...
Fake News

 

[Brutal Deluxe]

It looks like I've damaged one of my Dayton exciters. It started rattling half way through a race and seems like it's definitely damaged. I've been running it close to max for rumble strips and it's obviously been too much for it

I'm about to order a replacement now. I'll try to identify the VHB tape they use once it arrives, hopefully later this week. I'll be back back to confirm.

EDIT - Can't tell which tape it is from the product images so have emailed Dayton.

Heard back from Dayton Audio - The 3M VHB tape that they use is 3M 9473 (also known as F9473PC).

It's readily available in the UK and there are some sellers on eBay selling short lengths of it if you don't need a 50m roll (similar to what I do with other 3M materials and tapes).

Hope that's of help to anyone looking to relocate their exciters.

 

[EsxPaul]

Heard back from Dayton Audio - The 3M VHB tape that they use is 3M 9473 (also known as F9473PC).

It's readily available in the UK and there are some sellers on eBay selling short lengths of it if you don't need a 50m roll (similar to what I do with other 3M materials and tapes).

Hope that's of help to anyone looking to relocate their exciters.

Thanks very much for the info. I've just found some on Amazon UK and the prices are very reasonable.

 

[jamescarruthers]

This looks like a good shot from eBay UK — nice and wide; https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3M-VHB-9...698407?hash=item2d05ac2e27:g:Ku4AAOSwOJVeX5-a

 

[EsxPaul]

Slight change of hardware plan for me. The EPQ304 seems to be climbing up in price since I first made my shopping list so I've just ordered the Douk M4 amp to work alongside the t.racks DSP unit.

Shipping might take a while (20-40 days estimate) but I thought £55 with free shipping from Ali Express wasn't too bad of a price.

 

[Brutal Deluxe]

Thanks very much for the info. I've just found some on Amazon UK and the prices are very reasonable.

I've just removed my damaged exciter and unsurprisingly, this adhesive is very strong!!!

If you attempt the same, do not try to pull the exciter away from the seat, the exciter will easily split in to two before the adhesive fails. It's best to carefully prise it away with a small screwdriver. Being careful, I managed to do this without scratching the seat and it seems like the best option.

Thankfully I was doing this to a damaged shaker and it was heading for the bin anyway. If you pull at the exciter it will easily break in to two parts!

 

[EsxPaul]

Thanks for the tip

I do use a sort of similar 3M tape in my job and normally have to drip a little bit of alcohol on it before attempting to prize it away. Like you say, it really is surprising just how much this stuff will grip on a clean and flat surface!

 

[jamescarruthers]

I've been looking at the Douk M4 but then realised that it's only really 108W with the provided adapter.

Realise that is an issue with all these amps — they don't come with the adapters to full extort them.

What adapters are people using? All I can find are the "bare" ones. I've used those before... but don't fancy them too much...

 

[jamescarruthers]

Then again, I guess the real question is... does the amp ever use full power. I doubt it...

 

[Mr Latte]

Then again, I guess the real question is... does the amp ever use full power. I doubt it...

Even with setting the soundcard to 50%, most people should not need to run 50W amps at full.
Just because a tactile unit is rated for a supported wattage does not mean you have to run it at full constantly to get the best from it.

 

[Mr Latte]

Even with setting the soundcard to 50%, most people should not need to run 50W amps at full.
Just because a tactile unit is rated for a supported wattage does not mean you have to run it at full constantly to get the best from it.

@Brutal Deluxe nice work

@EsxPaul great price

Edit:
I have a query, @Brutal Deluxe does this VHB have the cutout center hole.

Not sure we even need that but another option I had tried a while back was a 3M/Velcro 2 piece VHB. I had to hunt and find one of the old units I had used when sticking to different places for testing. This solution might help with more curved surfaces lads.



This was an exciter that gave its existence to testing and fought hard with early tests I did last year.
You can see the velcro, simply peel off the exciter and then remove the 3M stuck to the seat. It might be easier if wanting to try different positions. This also had no center hole and is a bit thicker but I dont recall that it impacted the operation of the unit even if it may dampen a little some of its output.

I'm not sure of the model number...

 

[jamescarruthers]

Even with setting the soundcard to 50%, most people should not need to run 50W amps at full.
Just because a tactile unit is rated for a supported wattage does not mean you have to run it at full constantly to get the best from it.

Also guessing that if the power supply is 60W — and I have a 2 x 50W capable amp — then one channel could pull 50W and the other 10W if that were the requirement.

 

[Mr Latte]

Also guessing that if the power supply is 60W — and I have a 2 x 50W capable amp — then one channel could pull 50W and the other 10W if that were the requirement.

If the amp had independent volume controls yes probably but volume doesn't quite work in the mentality that if you have a 50w amp then volume dial at 50% will necessarily be 25w.

I'm not a qualified/technical expert on such matters but you may find good resources Here.
You will likely find a dial position on the amp with the soundcard set to its own output level (I use only 50%) that gets the felt response you want. Basically this is input level and output level from the amp we can vary.

If you were running your amp a bit too hard then increase the soundcard output that goes into the amp but the soundcard itself may not perform at its best when it is set to 100%.

 

[AJ McDaddy]

@Brutal Deluxe nice work

@EsxPaul great price

Edit:
I have a query, @Brutal Deluxe does this VHB have the cutout center hole.

Not sure we even need that but another option I had tried a while back was a 3M/Velcro 2 piece VHB. I had to hunt and find one of the old units I had used when sticking to different places for testing. This solution might help with more curved surfaces lads.



This was an exciter that gave its existence to testing and fought hard with early tests I did last year.
You can see the velcro, simply peel off the exciter and then remove the 3M stuck to the seat. It might be easier if wanting to try different positions. This also had no center hole and is a bit thicker but I dont recall that it impacted the operation of the unit even if it may dampen a little some of its output.

I'm not sure of the model number...

This is exactly what I did with mine - worked a treat on the slightly curved part of my seat.