AC LMP1/GT3 @ Silverstone - Sunday 3rd July 2022

[Medilloni]

Thanks for organising guys, sry I had to go, we've got a very sick dog, and it was

 

[Kek700]

That was a very pointless 40 minutes of dodging lmp1 cars.

 

[HF2000]

I want to apologise to every GT3 driver who I didn't overtake in the right way.
I know Taj was one of them but there were probably others.
In my defense I can only say that this was the first time for me in a LMP1 car.

 

[demetri]

That was a very pointless 40 minutes of dodging lmp1 cars.

I concur

 

[Alfred Wayne]

Had a great first half battle with Han in the LMP1, but then couldn't catch up post pit. Wild first couple laps

I didn't touch any GT3's but a few of you saw me off track after trying a pass, sorry for the compromised lines. Was really trying to wait for straights but then that meant more braking. Lots to handle all at once.

Enjoyed the LMP1s at Le Mans a lot, but today was a bit of a tight track for it, at least with such a large GT3 field. Maybe less GT3s and more LMP1s would have helped (or made it way worse ) Could see something like Road America or Spa with longer straights maybe working a bit better, maybe trying the less "wild" audi and toyota too. (Or the RSS GT at Watkins Glen )

Thanks for putting it together Brian. Always happy to experiment with new combinations even if they're one offs. Lots of cars to try and drive . See you all next time

 

[Taj Johal]

I want to apologise to every GT3 driver who I didn't overtake in the right way.
I know Taj was one of them but there were probably others.
In my defense I can only say that this was the first time for me in a LMP1 car.

No Problem Han, knew you were behind me, thought I had time to turn in but the LMPs were so much quicker, seemed to appear out of nowhere and there you were

A few hairy moments but it was due to the speed and grip differential, nothing more.

practiced and built a setup on mediums which allowed the car to rotate a bit more to my liking. Put softs on for the race, and I think due to the extra front end grip, hotter rear tyres, boy did the backend want to come around
And chew up the rear tyres.
lesson learned.

Congrats to podiums and all, thanks to Brian for hosting!!

results for geeks: https://simresults.net/220703-m6R

 

[Medilloni]

That was a very pointless 40 minutes of dodging lmp1 cars.

Must admit, it was like a WW2 dogfight at times, looking for the enemy diving from the sun

 

[Kek700]

I was having a great battle with John, it was close for 6 laps.
I could not afford to lose any time with a mistake , so basically drove, I think, a pretty faultless 6 laps trying to hang on.
I was overtaken on the outside and on the inside whilst trying not to lose valuable time.
After that mayhem, then having to face the surviving Lmp1 blocking my racing line, forcing me to use the grass with an eventual spin..
When you cannot overtake, that does not mean you grab an opportunity that is not hope in hell.
Just another race it maybe, but all that effort for now’t.
I sit in my old banger of a gt3 car looking at all the stats , weighing up my pit stop , where others are, trying to guess their strategy .
Only to have it pointlessly taken away, it has nothing to do with my race position, the above is true for all of us.
It is a race in a race, not right of way for lmp1 cars against second class racers.
I take winning and loosing as the same, I do not expect to do well, but I would like the opportunity to fail by my own doing.
Is too much to ask, racing incidents do occur and they can be understood.

I had pretty much guessed Patrick was on mediums with a splash and dash on the cards. I was very keen to keep as big a gap as I could, obviously being faster, I needed that gap.
So not only did I lose my battle with John, I was now in a hopeless situation with Patrick.
I was wrong about Patrick, he was on softs.

In the end I just lost the will to live.

 

[davejevons]

That was great

We were an hour later getting back from the midlands than planned so I lost most of practice And I was a bit rusty to start with. Quali on the softs made me think they might actually be okay for the race. So I gambled the first stint on softs With a plan that if they lasted I would stick and if they didn’t I would swap to the mediums.

I Got a good Start and dodged the spinning Mclarens only for me to then drop it at the end of the first lap A recovery got me back to p15ish via a good battle with Pat, Richard and Colin. Pat was ultimately too quick for me. Colin and Richard did an amazing job wrestling those GTRs which looked a handful. As the tyres faded Colin pitted and I stayed out a lap longer. Annoyingly I spun on pit entry trying to be ‘careful’. Once I got past Colin and Richard it was a case of watching out for lmp1s andtrying to manage the fading tyres.

It was the first time racing the BMW for me. Will I carry on with it? Not sure. The Mclaren seemed a bit safer but the bmw was fun.

Personally, I enjoyed having the lmp1s whooshing past and they did a good job of not being too aggressive. Thanks for organising a fun event @Interslice

 

[Medilloni]

I was having a great battle with John, it was close for 6 laps.

On a brighter note (I hope), was great to race with you again Ernie ....well, apart from your bus blocking the fecking sun out

Meant to say... congrats to the winningest guys, and fantastic lap time from from @pattikins Patrick, nearly went for the same strategy 'meself, but the softs lasted so well, which is not like me

 

[demetri]

I was having a great battle with John, it was close for 6 laps.
I could not afford to lose any time with a mistake , so basically drove, I think, a pretty faultless 6 laps trying to hang on.
I was overtaken on the outside and on the inside whilst trying not to lose valuable time.
After that mayhem, then having to face the surviving Lmp1 blocking my racing line, forcing me to use the grass with an eventual spin..
When you cannot overtake, that does not mean you grab an opportunity that is not hope in hell.
Just another race it maybe, but all that effort for now’t.
I sit in my old banger of a gt3 car looking at all the stats , weighing up my pit stop , where others are, trying to guess their strategy .
Only to have it pointlessly taken away, it has nothing to do with my race position, the above is true for all of us.
It is a race in a race, not right of way for lmp1 cars against second class racers.
I take winning and loosing as the same, I do not expect to do well, but I would like the opportunity to fail by my own doing.
Is too much to ask, racing incidents do occur and they can be understood.

I had pretty much guessed Patrick was on mediums with a splash and dash on the cards. I was very keen to keep as big a gap as I could, obviously being faster, I needed that gap.
So not only did I lose my battle with John, I was now in a hopeless situation with Patrick.

In the end I just lost the will to live.

If you're referring to the Loop and the next left-hander incident I don't think that LMP driver did anything wrong. There were 4 car widths between you guys when he was passing you, and giving the speed those beasts drive away from you in a GT3 that's hardly blocking your line. I had a much closer call in T1 with an LMP diving on the inside at the very last moment and also went wide out of precaution (wasn't really necessary as I later saw on the replay), but I didn't keep my right foot floored on the grass, so it cost me just about a second lost. Not ideal, but nothing to be mad at. Having to go off the optimal line and losing time is a part of multiclass racing regardless of the class you're in, you just have to accept it. It's part of the fun

I think most of the LMPs behind me were often way too timid to go for an overtake. I watch my mirrors, and will give your faster car space if you make a determined move.

 

[Kek700]

“I am not saying any one did anything wrong”, it is very disconcerting when you are trying to negotiate a set of close bends, not knowing if you are going to be hit, these set of bends I have been through 100’s of times without a problem.
Going through this series of short connected bends with a car on the outside and one on the inside is no fun, especially as you cannot judge where they are going to be due to their very fast acceleration.
It is not that you have all the time in the world to sort the exact position of everyone around you.
From my, maybe unlucky point of view, massive differences in car speeds seem to lead to all sorts of last second problems.

 

[Interslice]

I had a much closer call in T1 with an LMP diving on the inside at the very last moment and also went wide out of precaution (wasn't really necessary as I later saw on the replay), but I didn't keep my right foot floored on the grass, so it cost me just about a second lost. Not ideal, but nothing to be mad at. Having to go off the optimal line and losing time is a part of multiclass racing regardless of the class you're in, you just have to accept it. It's part of the fun

I think most of the LMPs behind me were often way too timid to go for an overtake. I watch my mirrors, and will give your faster car space if you make a determined move.

I had a quick fast flick through the replay last night and came across that one at T1. Lmp was 2 lengths gap when you turned in for the corner. 3 to 4 car length off a safe overtake imo.

I am thinking now we need to replace the 'safe overtake' with some more detail for mutliclass racing, where multiple warnings for divebombs could result in a ban. I think going forward a good rule for multiclass club racing is to get full overlap at the turn in when passing the slower class.

Only a quick sacn, but verything else i seen was normal multiclass stuff. Please report or friendly PM the offenders for any dodgy stuff. Particularly dives or getting pushed off track incidents.

As you say Dmitri, alot of it is part and parcel of multiclass. I got murdered by a GT3 car reentering the track who didn't see me coming, but it is just something that can happen in any race if folks don't check whats coming.

The more carefull LMPs is to be expected with peoples inexperience with them. But I do get what you mean. From driving alot in the GT4s you often just want the GT3 to go for it rather than having a look and pulling out, costing both cars time. On the flip side, some GT3s last night seemed to be getting out of the way, moving off the racing line mid corner, which created doubt on whether to go inside or outside.

All in all it wasn't too bad I thought. As is the internet way, the bad stuff gets the air time. I'll probably go back to the toyota/audi for any of these in future. A more rewarding drive from the toyota i felt. It is mostly depending on driving standards of course, but the 10ish second lap time difference also seems to be the sweet spot for multiclass.

 

[Interslice]

Anyhow, I enjoyed that alot. Fairly sloppy driving from myself. Some unforced slides and lockups on kerbs cost me alot of time. There is a lot of luck involved in when you catch the gt3 cars but i guess it balanced out for most over an hour. Also lucky for me the 919 offroads pretty well and can take a slap of a gt3 car


Had a few bad lockups on left hand side braking zone kerb on stowe this week. It comes at you fast! Nearly cost me P2. Super battle with andreas for the second half of the race! Luckily won the position swap lottery by getting in front at T1 on the last lap leaving not enough time for @640er to get P2 back again.

Congrats to the podiums and winners. See you next week!

 

[RFE3rd]

That was a fun one.
I only had about 20 minutes of practice in the Nissan before the race and was doing slow lap times. Something clicked in qualy and I learned that there were a few places i could shave quite a few tenths. Still qualified last, but as the race wore on I got more consistent at least. I managed to avoid all off roads and carnage early on and found myself ahead of @davejevons and a few others. Dave was too fast in the beamer and easily overtook me. Somewhere Colin made a mistake and allowed me to get behind him. He was definitely faster in the first stint, but i managed to stay close as I made very few mistakes (Difficult to make mistakes when you are driving like a snail ).Colin and I pitted on the 30min mark and came out of the pits at the same time, both of us ahead of Dave again. Don't know if he made a mistake on his in lap. He caught us quickly and led to me and @JamKart22 having a good little battle for 5 laps or so. I managed to pass and got the car home safely, with one spin towards the end. Glad I could find a race with Colin, as I thought i was in for a lonely one at the back.
Thanks everyone and thanks @Interslice for organising.
Well done to all podiums.

 

[HF2000]

My first race in a LMP1 car in a multiclass was intense and I had a lot to learn. I was way off the pace of the frontrunners and it was hard to estimate if you could overtake a GT3 before a corner without divebombing. I'm afraid that my estimation was not always correct but such things are learning on the job.
One thing I noticed is that some GT3 drivers use a different raceline than I would in my Nissan so there were moments where I thought that they left space for me to overtake.
It would be nice if I could have seen that in practice instead of in the race.

Had a really nice battle with Robert in the first stint. We were both sometimes unlucky with the GT3's so we stayed close. I went first for my pitstop and Robert an few laps later. But after that the gap was about 8s which was enough to keep 4th.

I enjoyed the race though. It was nice to lap Aki and Dmitry for a change .
Congrats to the podium, thanks all for racing and Brian for organizing.
Personally I think I prefer the 919 as the LMP1 car because the KERS/MGU-K is simple in this car.

EDIT:
I just saw my replay and I think I did quite well.
Maybe an late overtake on Pat in the chicane and a moment in Aintree with Ernie but the rest of the overtakes looked like the GT3's didn't have to loose time.
But I can imagine that they sometimes were surprised by an incoming 919.

 

[davejevons]

Colin and I pitted on the 30min mark and came out of the pits at the same time, both of us ahead of Dave again. Don't know if he made a mistake on his in lap. He caught us quickly and led to me and @JamKart22 having a good little battle for 5 laps or so. I managed to pass and got the car home safely, with one spin towards the end. Glad I could find a race with Colin, as I thought i was in for a lonely one at the back.

Yeah, I spun entering the pits by trying to be 'careful' which let you and Colin get ahead.

On the flip side, some GT3s last night seemed to be getting out of the way, moving off the racing line mid corner, which created doubt on whether to go inside or outside.

I was guilty of this. The high speed differential made me quite risk averse and I knew if I stayed on the racing line the lmp1 could lose a huge amount of time waiting for me. Particularly at the end of the hangar straight going into Stowe I often took a wide line to let a lmp1 past. Perhaps it would have been better for the lmp1s for me to stick to the racing line and make them wait.

 

[Interslice]

I was guilty of this. The high speed differential made me quite risk averse and I knew if I stayed on the racing line the lmp1 could lose a huge amount of time waiting for me. Particularly at the end of the hangar straight going into Stowe I often took a wide line to let a lmp1 past. Perhaps it would have been better for the lmp1s for me to stick to the racing line and make them wait.

Ye, if the timing is right, you can send the LMP1 around the outside there, if you can trust the GT3 will stay on the racing line. Otherwise they can wait and get to the next corner first without any issue.

 

[JamKart22]

That was a fun one.
I only had about 20 minutes of practice in the Nissan before the race and was doing slow lap times. Something clicked in qualy and I learned that there were a few places i could shave quite a few tenths. Still qualified last, but as the race wore on I got more consistent at least. I managed to avoid all off roads and carnage early on and found myself ahead of @davejevons and a few others. Dave was too fast in the beamer and easily overtook me. Somewhere Colin made a mistake and allowed me to get behind him. He was definitely faster in the first stint, but i managed to stay close as I made very few mistakes (Difficult to make mistakes when you are driving like a snail ).Colin and I pitted on the 30min mark and came out of the pits at the same time, both of us ahead of Dave again. Don't know if he made a mistake on his in lap. He caught us quickly and led to me and @JamKart22 having a good little battle for 5 laps or so. I managed to pass and got the car home safely, with one spin towards the end. Glad I could find a race with Colin, as I thought i was in for a lonely one at the back.
Thanks everyone and thanks @Interslice for organising.
Well done to all podiums.

Frustrating stint after the pit stop. I was congratulating myself for modifying the pit stop tyre pressures down hanger straight only to find I'd accidentally put on meds instead of softs. So not only had the wrong tyres I also had the wrong psi. Cost me a few seconds a lap. Another new cock up for me. I thought I'd found every way to screw up a race

 

[demetri]

I had a quick fast flick through the replay last night and came across that one at T1. Lmp was 2 lengths gap when you turned in for the corner. 3 to 4 car length off a safe overtake imo.

I am thinking now we need to replace the 'safe overtake' with some more detail for mutliclass racing, where multiple warnings for divebombs could result in a ban. I think going forward a good rule for multiclass club racing is to get full overlap at the turn in when passing the slower class.

Only a quick sacn, but verything else i seen was normal multiclass stuff. Please report or friendly PM the offenders for any dodgy stuff. Particularly dives or getting pushed off track incidents.

As you say Dmitri, alot of it is part and parcel of multiclass. I got murdered by a GT3 car reentering the track who didn't see me coming, but it is just something that can happen in any race if folks don't check whats coming.

The more carefull LMPs is to be expected with peoples inexperience with them. But I do get what you mean. From driving alot in the GT4s you often just want the GT3 to go for it rather than having a look and pulling out, costing both cars time. On the flip side, some GT3s last night seemed to be getting out of the way, moving off the racing line mid corner, which created doubt on whether to go inside or outside.

All in all it wasn't too bad I thought. As is the internet way, the bad stuff gets the air time. I'll probably go back to the toyota/audi for any of these in future. A more rewarding drive from the toyota i felt. It is mostly depending on driving standards of course, but the 10ish second lap time difference also seems to be the sweet spot for multiclass.

I respectfully disagree about that T1 encounter. An LMP car has to be much closer to make a proper dive in that fast corner. It was more like 4 car lengths actually (depending on where you spot the turn-in, I do when the steering wheel starts turning towards the corner):

At this moment below, I already had widened my normal line by half a car width to make room for the LMP:

But I could've held it a tighter and closer to my optimal line because the LMP proceeded to cut the corner, but if he didn't there would've been no way to avoid a collision without me going off the racing line. You can see that even with the speed difference there was not enough space for both cars to fit there, hence why I think 4 car lengths is too much for a safe dive in this particular corner:

But that's OK, as I said it's all part of the multi-class. I should've trusted that LMP driver more, because it looks like he knows what he's doing. I really have no complaints about the race, and when I concurred that it was pointless I meant the fact that it was a lonely race for me. Aki bogged down on start and lost many positions right away, Patrick didn't practice at all and couldn't post his normal qualifying lap, so he was down the grid as well. So the only fun left was navigating corners together with LMPs and it wasn't bad at all. I'd do it again. Someone complained about the track not suited for these two classes, but I disagree, it is wide enough to go side-bye-side in almost all corners and there're enough straights for those who are not comfortable with passing in the corners. If that was something like Magione, it would've been a different story