Is VR dead?

[RCHeliguy]

Something about lenses.

Supply Chain Analyst: 2022 Oculus Headset Will Have New Lenses

Android Central says it viewed a note from Ming-Chi Kuo claiming Facebook & Sony have ordered high quantities of new, more expensive VR lenses for 2022. Kuo is a TF International Securities analyst mostly known for predicting Apple products & moves over a year in advance. Apple Track gives...

uploadvr.com

Now THAT is economy of scale! PS VR and the Oculus Quest represent the lion's share of all VR headsets sold. Deals like this will help drive manufacturing costs down and get VR into the hands of even more people.

And yet F1 2021 is being released yet again without VR.

 

[Gelly916]

Received my Vive Pro 2 yesterday. Will be testing it out today and report back here.

 

[Gelly916]

Well, not a great start for the VP2. Testing on a variety of different resolutions and I just do not think the image clarity is all that great for a headset at this price point, claiming to have these crazy great lenses. Lateral FOV is pretty good, I'd say on par with the Index. But the vertical FOV is noticeably smaller. Luckily for me, I have the Index, VP2, and G2 all in my household. So I can switch back and fourth between the three pretty quickly. I think edge-to-edge clarity on the VP2 is somewhere in-between the Index and the G2. Better than the G2, but slightly worse than the Index. I have a test that I run on Assetto Corsa to measure this. There is a sign in the pit boxes at Brand's Hatch that says something along the lines of "no one under the age of 16 permitted...." I read that sign from the same pit box with all three headsets and the G2 is the obvious winner, VP2 in second, then Index in third. I then go about doing my regular racing to measure things like performance, audio, clarity, and comfort.

Audio is much better than the G2, but not as good as the Index. The bass is just not as deep, and while I prefer on-ear audio, I felt like the VP2 sounded hollow. The volume of the audio was fine though.

When it comes to comfort, I think the VP2 is the least comfortable between the three headsets. Now this is of course debatable, as everyone's heads are different shaped, but I felt like the VP2 dug into my forehead quite a bit. Probably something I need to play more with and just get used to, but I was not happy with that at all.

I think the colors on the VP2 are a little bit better than that of the Index. Darker colors specifically have more depth to them.

Vive software was easy to navigate. No real big deal here. But I still dislike how SteamVR settings are still not completely taken out of the equation. Like, I think that the Vive software should automatically take priority over SteamVR settings when it comes to resolution. It's confusing when you're running Vive settings at "high" or "ultra" and then you have to go back to SteamVR to change the supersampling to match whatever settings you're using from Vive. It's just a headache, but at least it's not WMR lol!

Build quality again put the VP2 somewhere between the Index and the G2. One issue I had with the VP2 immediately was that the setting for pulling the lenses closer to your eyes doesn't really lock into place that strongly. When I take the headset off, I could hear the gear inside (sounds like a ratchet strap) click, and the lenses would move further away. Again, this is when I'm grabbing the front part of the headset to lift it off my face. I had to readjust that distance with the lenses, and take care of not grabbing that specific part when removing the headset. I felt like that was kind of janky. But my GREATEST disappointment when it came to build quality was that the facial interface and back head pad are all made of foam. Like c'mon, it's 2021 and this is a 800 dollar headset. Give me the smooth pleather type material that the Index uses over that crappy foam material. The Index is built like a damn tank, the G2 is built like a CV1, and the VP2 is somewhere in-between.

If someone asked me if I would recommend the VP2, I'd say no. I'd absolutely recommend the Index or G2 over it. As much as I dislike the G2, the lenses and clarity on that thing are still leading the market. I just wish it didn't lack in so many other areas. The Index is the exact opposite. It's top of the market is every imaginable way, except for its lenses. If they could literally make an Index and replace the lenses with that of the G2, it'd be the best headset on the market, no questions asked. Pretty disappointed in the VP2, but I'll give it a couple more days before I make a decision on whether to return or not.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Audio is much better than the G2, but not as good as the Index.

Doesn't G2 shares speakers with Index?

 

[Gelly916]

I think they're the same design philosophy, but not the exact same hardware. First thing I did with the G2 was remove the speaker pods and use an actual audio headset (Astro A40), I thought they were that bad. 100% volume sounded like 60% volume compared to the Index.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

I think they're the same design philosophy, but not the exact same hardware. First thing I did with the G2 was remove the speaker pods and use an actual audio headset (Astro A40), I thought they were that bad. 100% volume sounded like 60% volume compared to the Index.

Did you try FW upgrade https://support.hp.com/us-en/drivers/selfservice/hp-reverb-g2-virtual-reality-headset/33835976

 

[Gelly916]

I didn't. The G2 actually belongs to my dad. Bought him it as an upgrade from his old CV1. He prefers over-ear audio anyways, so I just gave him my old A-40s. So I don't even think he wants to go back even if the FW update fixes things. Are the audio pods the exact same as the Index? I was entirely sure they weren't when we first received the headset, based on their performance.

 

[HoiHman]

3 days ago i received the Pro 2 and i did a back to back comparison to the Index.
2 hours later the Pro 2 was packed up and i put the request to send it back

For me personally the Index is still the better headset

I make my preparations and already bought a set thinner face pads and only tried the Vive pro with the 6mm one but the for me personally:
- The FOV is significant smaller than Index ( horizontally and vertically )
- The smaller vertical FOV is not an issue, but a smaller horizontal FOV is disappointing
- The sweet spot is very small
- There A LOT of distortion at the edges of the display.

I tested this at longbeach in AMS2 on the starting grid after a view reset and looking straight ahead i looked at the billboards at the edges of the display by moving my eyes only. With the Index i could see more of the Billboard and i could actually read it. With the Vive Pro 2 the billboard was a blurry unreadable mess
- Performance issues: To achieve the same 90fps in AMS i had to drop the steamvr resolution to 50% (RTX3090)
- There's no steamvr smoothing, so 45fps gives A LOT of artifacts - Comfort on the Index is much much much better for me.
- The Index gave me much better edge to edge clarity
- Overall sharpness (in the distance) is better on the pro2








Image on the Index







Image on the Vive Pro 2




So this evening just before making the shipping label to send everything back, i did the same test again and ended up packing everything up again and i will send it back tommorow.

The experience is personal and based on my headshape ect ect

I have add also that i have modded the face gasket on my Index which makes the comfort and FOV much better for me than the stock solution.

I hope Valve will release an Index 2 with only upgraded screens and nothing else, that would make me happy

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Quite pathetic showcase of upcoming VR titles from E3. Sniper Elite from 2017 VR mode is the only one more or less interested, bet will be gutted like Doom VR.

 

[RCHeliguy]

Have you seen Population: One released last October ?

 

[RCHeliguy]

Not the first Varjo review, but it is still interesting. Lots of technology that will hopefully be refined and priced better by competitors by the time the 40 series GPU's are released.

Notice it requires two displayport cables since the 30 series does not support the latest displayport standard. Hopefully NVidia will resolve this issue with the 40 series GPU's.

It appears that the Varjo checks all the boxes except wide FOV, being able to be driven by current GPU's, weight, headphones and price. He even mentions that it has a large sweet spot. When he says his 3090 does a good job "considering the resolution" that tells me that current GPU's are just not up to the task to run these yet at least for racing sims. Half Life Alyx is very well optimized and he described hiccups at 90 fps. The fact it uses Steam base stations is something I consider a plus. Interesting that they recommend 4 base stations, although he says it ran smoothly with just 2.

Both the Pro 2 and Varjo are called professional products. For users who are viewing the interior of a car or a home or for CAD/CAM use they may both be perfectly fine. I think they were classified properly and will sell in low volumes, but they are pushing forward, the Varjo much more than the Pro 2.

 

[RCHeliguy]

I hope Valve will release an Index 2 with only upgraded screens and nothing else, that would make me happy

I've read some estimates that the Index 2 will be announced around Dec 2021 and released around April 2022. If it's like the last launch that would mean pre-orders in April and deliveries starting in May-June, but who knows. Still it will likely be another year with all eyes looking to the upcoming 40 series release a few months later.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Notice it requires two displayport cables since the 30 series does not support the latest displayport standard

Which standard is that, DSC? Works fine here.

 

[RCHeliguy]

Which standard is that, DSC? Works fine here.

The 30 series does not support Displayport 2.0 yet which would allow plenty of bandwidth over a single cable for something like that Varjo and not require them to use 2 cables.

While the standard had been around long enough for NVidia to incorporate it into the 30 series and would have made the 30 series more future proof, Displayport 2.0 monitors were supposed to have been here by the end of 2020, and are still coming. So no one is screaming about this yet.

Once Displayport 2.0 monitors arrive this year, NVidia will be forced to support this much faster specification when the 40 series are introduced.

DisplayPort 2.0 monitors are delayed until later this year due to the pandemic

You won’t find any DisplayPort 2.0 monitors for a while yet.

www.theverge.com

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Nice, wonder why they didn't just go for already supported DSC on DP 1.4. It does 3:1 compression which with 26gbps bandwith of DP 1.4a can theoretically transfer 78gbps of data, while new DP 2.0 standard offering 80 gbps uncompressed.
If it's pin compatible it might be just FW upgrade from NVidia to support new protocol, they have done it in the past with Maxwell.

 

[RCHeliguy]

Nice, wonder why they didn't just go for already supported DSC on DP 1.4. It does 3:1 compression which with 26gbps bandwith of DP 1.4a can theoretically transfer 78gbps of data, while new DP 2.0 standard offering 80 gbps uncompressed.

I'm going to guess that whatever hardware the 8KX etc.. use to decompress the video signal isn't currently rated for the bandwidth needed. I was going to guess latency for compression/decompression and that is possible, but it seems unlikely.

I am throwing darts. The Varjo is sending more data than the 8KX, G2 or Pro 2, so it may have reached some limitation that those others haven't hit yet. What the limitation is, I can't be sure.

Whatever the reason is, it doesn't change the fact that the 40 series will have to support the new Displayport 2.0 devices out there and that future VR devices will use that specification.

I had originally said that I thought the 8KX was DOA because it couldn't run 90 fps over a DP 1.4 cable, but they added compression and can now increase the frame rate assuming you have hardware to run that frame rate.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

I remember there was a way to use PSVR on PC, here is another candidate if nothing better comes out before that.

PS5 VR Headset To Launch Holiday 2022 With OLED Display - Report

A new report from Bloomberg claims that the PS5 VR headset will launch in the holiday 2022 period with an OLED display. The article, which largely covers Japan Display Inc’s shift to making LCD VR displays, cites “people with knowledge of the matter” in saying the device will launch

uploadvr.com

 

[Pixelerate]

I tried vr and it blew my mind. Extremely immersive. My only concern is there are no study on the long term effects on the eyes. It's not like I can replace my eye balls. Folks who have been using it for a while, do you guys have any side effects?

 

[RCHeliguy]

I tried vr and it blew my mind. Extremely immersive. My only concern is there are no study on the long term effects on the eyes. It's not like I can replace my eye balls. Folks who have been using it for a while, do you guys have any side effects?

I've been using VR since I got a Rift November 2017 and currently use a Valve Index.

It's no worse than focusing on a computer monitor in front of you for hours at a time, except the VR focal point has your eye's focusing at about 5-6 feet ahead of you.

I've heard some suggestions that it may not be a good idea for young children, but there is little actual evidence. It's all conjecture.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

It strains eyes more than monitor that's for sure. Things are blurrier, IPD can be slightly off, eyes move out of sweet spot, all that cause vision struggle to keep things in focus.
Getting dry eyes after prolonged use is also quite common, eye drops help.