Vanilla Balance Mod Beta - Testers Wanted

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This mod has now been released. All the changes are listed in the above link. If a Forum Admin is reading this, if you could remove the "Testers Wanted" and change it to "Development Discussion" thread, it would be appreciated.

UPDATED TO WORK WITH 1.3

Note: In attempts to fix the interviews and dilemmas, I have temporarily removed all non English languages from those two files. I hope to reinsert them into a later version (but when I do, they'll still be the vanilla text as I am unable to translate in any other language).

 
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There seems to be something up with my tyre life tweaks where everyone's soft tyres has more life than they should. William Evans has 8-10 laps on Softs in my assets, yet for some reason has 14-16 in Red's. I'm going to compare my SSDD to his and see if there is anything off in it.

EDIT: It seems singleseater tyre life has all reset to vanilla values for some reason, I've spoken to Red and I'm going to revert to an older version of my tweaks.

Luckily we found this wasn't the case,

Instead, Evans Predator went from having the worst tyre wear - to the best - as my chassis changes means that the default predator was much better in tyre wear then in tyre heating. As such, his tyre life was greater then Brian's version, which didn't have my Part Suppliers.txt

On another note, Simulation Settings has weather curve amounts in it... these values are 1-3 (1 being for short races, where rain comes and goes quickly, 3 being long races where rain lingers and it takes laps and laps to dry)

All the practice and qualifying sessions are set to 1 or 2... which means they have the more extreme weather changes - exacerbated by the fact that the sessions are in minutes, not laps,

I've set them all to be Curve 3 in all practice and qualy sesssions. - which should alleviate the extream weather change rate a bit.
 
Hi FlamingRed, do you know how to help AI with the money w/o tweaking dll files ?
i like this changes: "GetDesignCosts. AI gets a 80% discount from the development of parts." but can't find any help in database(
I have no success editing assembly (well i can;t even find development parts in this file :redface:)

Yeah, this only works because I added in a "if Not player team, then divide design costs by 5" in the dll. .

You can not do that in the database.
 
The first Investor gives the best chassis, so basically if we start with it we will have the best Tyre wear for the first season and with that even with a bad drivers stint will last longer then the others.

And by the way the investor is my favored. Extra cash and scouting facility is better then a 3 star chassis in the start of the game. At least that's my opinion.

I hope that Brain and you continue to release your mods together. I can see the changes in the game and their effects are amazing. I actually feel like a new Backmarker team on the grid.

And watching the races in the new zoom mod (thanks Coops again) is thrilling.
 
Luckily we found this wasn't the case,

Instead, Evans Predator went from having the worst tyre wear - to the best - as my chassis changes means that the default predator was much better in tyre wear then in tyre heating. As such, his tyre life was greater then Brian's version, which didn't have my Part Suppliers.txt

On another note, Simulation Settings has weather curve amounts in it... these values are 1-3 (1 being for short races, where rain comes and goes quickly, 3 being long races where rain lingers and it takes laps and laps to dry)

All the practice and qualifying sessions are set to 1 or 2... which means they have the more extreme weather changes - exacerbated by the fact that the sessions are in minutes, not laps,

I've set them all to be Curve 3 in all practice and qualy sesssions. - which should alleviate the extream weather change rate a bit.

ah thats great, a positive change in the direction i was looking for :)
 
I think some of the dilemma results need looking at from a gameplay perspective - I got a dilemma for a practice session, yet the driver will pick up Mean or Nice Guy if I pick Dont Go or Go respectively. I'm not sure it makes sense for the driver to suddenly become a total git for the rest of their career over not going to a practice session a whole one time, nor does it to have them be really nice. Maybe look at not going as having no effects, or a temp trait like Angry, with the more expensive option adding something as well as the track expert trait (a moderate temp like Happy (+2 Overall for x weeks) would do). One also gives Team Player or Selfish, which also feels like a bad fit.
 
I have done 2 seasons of testing with Predator and 2 seasons with my own team. I notice that when you make your own team the first choice now gives you a 5 star chassis, is that correct? Because you just sail without issues to the APC and it isn't really a challenge. Can even set your car to attack without burning through your tires.

I have noticed that in both play-through that driver morale is messing around. Both my Predator drivers had 90/80 morale at the start of the race, we finished 3rd and 4th. My first driver went to 100% my second driver dropped down to 10%

So during the after-race interview I just say my 2nd driver is the best driver since sliced bread to get him back to 50% morale. Next race he finishes 5th with my 1st driver 4th and he goes back to 10%. Result is I keep losing my 2nd driver mid season because he is an unhappy twat.

Not sure if this is one of those Motorsport bugs or comes from the mod.
 
Some feedback from my playtime:

The starting chassis for Dragon, Predator, the Create Your Own Team and other bad teams largely sucks the challenge out in the first season. This is a total swing from before where starting as Predator meant getting 16th place finishes was hard, but now I'm back to deliberately gimping myself to keep from overperforming. Maybe the starting chassis needs rebalancing.

Although it's a vanilla issue, it might be something worth looking into - AI fixing every part every time they pit for part fixes. They spend over 60 seconds there every time and they can never recover. I remember Zampelli from a previous playthrough having hilariously unreliable but fast cars, and while they pitted 2 or 3 extra times in a race, they still remained competitive - they were the team that should have won the championship for 3 years straight, but their reliability kept them from reaching it yet they still remained top 3. Right now, once the AI pits for part repairs, their race is done. We did talk about this last night and you came up with a potential remedy.

Safety car is a little too common and the tendency to have a large amount of crashes is a little high.

The first two combined I think is the main issue right now, as you have a midfield car even with 0 in every non-spec part, which starts off with high reliability, and the AI spend forever in the pits. Even with my drivers being up to 4.6 seconds slower on most tracks in ERS, I'm able to repeatedly get into the top 10.
 
Just want to add that it seems certain traits have their duration extended where it shouldn't. I have 1 driver with a 32 races neck injury and my second driver just now with a 24 races cracked rib.

Also have to agree on the crashes and retirements, second season the first 2 races we only had 7 drivers left the rest all crashed or retired.
 
Yes and no. Red set the time ranges around the fixed times they were in vanilla. I looked at changing the ranges when I was implementing my other traits, but I thought 'these are people who are going to do something that'll put a lot of strain on their body, thus recovery time would be extended to ensure no repeat injury'. They also needed to retain a tangible impact on the game, otherwise they may as well have been removed.

Maybe I'll do a review of trait durations and balance some things up some more.
 
I have done 2 seasons of testing with Predator and 2 seasons with my own team. I notice that when you make your own team the first choice now gives you a 5 star chassis, is that correct? Because you just sail without issues to the APC and it isn't really a challenge. Can even set your car to attack without burning through your tires.

I have noticed that in both play-through that driver morale is messing around. Both my Predator drivers had 90/80 morale at the start of the race, we finished 3rd and 4th. My first driver went to 100% my second driver dropped down to 10%

So during the after-race interview I just say my 2nd driver is the best driver since sliced bread to get him back to 50% morale. Next race he finishes 5th with my 1st driver 4th and he goes back to 10%. Result is I keep losing my 2nd driver mid season because he is an unhappy twat.

Not sure if this is one of those Motorsport bugs or comes from the mod.

Hmmm, well, the two Easy Pressure challenges are meant to be very easy, while the hard offers a different kind of challenge.

If you're after more of a Predator starting situation, aim for the one with the middle pressure, :)

As for morale, that's interesting, are you taking note of your car opinion?
 
it may seem that I'm rushing you, but it's not and when to wait for an update about your wonderful fashion. And will be updated intervyu foreign languages? and whether the complexity of 4 Challenging? You once said about the complexity and it says, but the difficulties of translation does not allow me to fully understand. Thank you.
 
Hi everyone, hope all of you are fine. ;)

First this is not a bug, just a opinion. I think that the negative morale effects are too much stronger then the positive effects. For instance; APS - MRT Valbuena they are the 4-5 team in car aspect. There driver gets 30-39 negative morale for finishing in the middle while gets only 9 positive morale for comming 1. in race. I looked up all the other team drivers and approximately 80% of the drivers have morale under 60 (even the top three teams in their own leagues).

Also I think that the negative temporary traits probabilities are high. Again around half the drivers had one or two (a little group even 3) negative traits before the start of the 3rd race.

Are the morale changes consider the teams and drivers estimated positions? For example I got a new team that is expected to be 10th. Drivers who are expected as 19th and 20th. Most parts are in the 1 digit number area. Even so I manage to come as 4th team and my drivers came 10-11 and get only +5 morale. As the MRT Team mentioned above if you miss even by 1 or 2 place you get 30-39 negative morale.

I don't think that is right. But as I said before it's just an opinion. I can keep some how my drivers morale above 50 but from what I saw the AI definitely can't handle that.
 
Thinking back to the climate curve changes, and just wanting to clarify

You say curves are split into 1=short 2=medium 3=long
unless I miss read you said the curves are more gradual on 3 and you applied them to 1 and 2

Surely the default game has them the wrong way around.
A more flucentent curve should by on 3 (as over a longer period it will get from dry to monsoon and dry tack again.
But a gradual curve going from wet to remain inter for rest of curve, would be better for short.

Hope this makes sense i couldn't think of a batter way to explain.
 
Does that mean we can safely start a new career save as further tweaks will be "save game friendly"?:)

Well, for the most part. No one has reported massive crashes, and a few major issues are easy to fix.

But this mod is forever going to be WIP until the devs stop working on it. Something will always need balancing better - which I'll only know by playing several season myself and getting feedback from testers. And that's a process that takes weeks (and the devs are reliably updating the game monthly). There's still issues in the Vanilla game which may prevent some enjoyment. As Brian said, the AIs repair strategy is woeful - making progression easy. There's also issues with the AI and their tyre choices in intermediate conditions. Both are allowing Predators to get unusually good race results. And as such, the races aren't balanced how they should be.

These issues should be patched by the devs, and my balance changes will be patched my be. Both our patches are save game compatable, so it should be safe to start - but the experience isn't as perfect as it was in 1.2g (which was a great experience because there were no massive bugs and the patch had been out a long time allowing me to make the balance tweaks needed).

I have done 2 seasons of testing with Predator and 2 seasons with my own team. I notice that when you make your own team the first choice now gives you a 5 star chassis, is that correct? Because you just sail without issues to the APC and it isn't really a challenge. Can even set your car to attack without burning through your tires.

I have noticed that in both play-through that driver morale is messing around. Both my Predator drivers had 90/80 morale at the start of the race, we finished 3rd and 4th. My first driver went to 100% my second driver dropped down to 10%

So during the after-race interview I just say my 2nd driver is the best driver since sliced bread to get him back to 50% morale. Next race he finishes 5th with my 1st driver 4th and he goes back to 10%. Result is I keep losing my 2nd driver mid season because he is an unhappy twat.

Not sure if this is one of those Motorsport bugs or comes from the mod.

The starting chassis issue is a pain, as for some reason, your starting Chassis in a create your own team is generally good anyway, I think I may get rid of any and all chassis from that file p, as the RCD is enough.

70% morale drop is unheard of though. It's major.

Can you confirm that your Second Driver "leaves" during the season? Because that's never happened before! (They only get poached at the end of the season as far as I know). If that's true, I may have to look at Morale a bit closer - as that's game changing.

Some feedback from my playtime:

The starting chassis for Dragon, Predator, the Create Your Own Team and other bad teams largely sucks the challenge out in the first season. This is a total swing from before where starting as Predator meant getting 16th place finishes was hard, but now I'm back to deliberately gimping myself to keep from overperforming. Maybe the starting chassis needs rebalancing.

Although it's a vanilla issue, it might be something worth looking into - AI fixing every part every time they pit for part fixes. They spend over 60 seconds there every time and they can never recover. I remember Zampelli from a previous playthrough having hilariously unreliable but fast cars, and while they pitted 2 or 3 extra times in a race, they still remained competitive - they were the team that should have won the championship for 3 years straight, but their reliability kept them from reaching it yet they still remained top 3. Right now, once the AI pits for part repairs, their race is done. We did talk about this last night and you came up with a potential remedy.

Safety car is a little too common and the tendency to have a large amount of crashes is a little high.

The first two combined I think is the main issue right now, as you have a midfield car even with 0 in every non-spec part, which starts off with high reliability, and the AI spend forever in the pits. Even with my drivers being up to 4.6 seconds slower on most tracks in ERS, I'm able to repeatedly get into the top 10.

There's a new element to crashes that if it's wet, the crash amount increases, I'll look to dial it back. And odd about SC amounts, they reduced the Chance by 50% and I only raised it by 35% - meaning it should be less frequent then it used to be.

That pit stop for repair issue needs to be looked at.


Hi everyone, hope all of you are fine. ;)

First this is not a bug, just a opinion. I think that the negative morale effects are too much stronger then the positive effects. For instance; APS - MRT Valbuena they are the 4-5 team in car aspect. There driver gets 30-39 negative morale for finishing in the middle while gets only 9 positive morale for comming 1. in race. I looked up all the other team drivers and approximately 80% of the drivers have morale under 60 (even the top three teams in their own leagues).

Also I think that the negative temporary traits probabilities are high. Again around half the drivers had one or two (a little group even 3) negative traits before the start of the 3rd race.

Are the morale changes consider the teams and drivers estimated positions? For example I got a new team that is expected to be 10th. Drivers who are expected as 19th and 20th. Most parts are in the 1 digit number area. Even so I manage to come as 4th team and my drivers came 10-11 and get only +5 morale. As the MRT Team mentioned above if you miss even by 1 or 2 place you get 30-39 negative morale.

I don't think that is right. But as I said before it's just an opinion. I can keep some how my drivers morale above 50 but from what I saw the AI definitely can't handle that.
I wonder if I've made the car opinion too strong, I'll check with the previous version to what numbers I used exactly - as it was spot on last time. If it's the same, then there is a different morale change system going on - I'll have to look at that.

As for negative trait occurances, I've not had a chance to test the game yet, I'm not overly worried at this early stage, as negative traits of drivers always bring in obsticals for the player to deal with, but I'll keep my eye on it.
Thinking back to the climate curve changes, and just wanting to clarify

You say curves are split into 1=short 2=medium 3=long
unless I miss read you said the curves are more gradual on 3 and you applied them to 1 and 2

Surely the default game has them the wrong way around.
A more flucentent curve should by on 3 (as over a longer period it will get from dry to monsoon and dry tack again.
But a gradual curve going from wet to remain inter for rest of curve, would be better for short.

Hope this makes sense i couldn't think of a batter way to explain.

Well, I guess it depends on how they define weather change and weather 'blocks'.

When weather is generated, it is generated minute by minute I think.

Let's say that the game decides that in a short session (curve 1) it decides to rain heavy every few minutes, and the dry completely... so in the time it has, itwill start dry, and there will be two short storms and then finish dry. Quick up down up down of drain amounts,

Let's say that in a long session, the same weather pattern, minute by minute pattern is used. But it has three times as much time to fill... so rather there being two storms... there'll be six... which is probably by curve 3 exists, to prevent there being so much of s change on a mo invite by minute basis.

If it was generated by blocks, then you're explanation makes sense. But I really think it's minute by minute, as the bars of the weather don't a
Start exactly at the start of the lap.

Another note, it would be awesome if the weather report was wrong sometimes.
 
Well, I guess it depends on how they define weather change and weather 'blocks'.

When weather is generated, it is generated minute by minute I think.

Let's say that the game decides that in a short session (curve 1) it decides to rain heavy every few minutes, and the dry completely... so in the time it has, itwill start dry, and there will be two short storms and then finish dry. Quick up down up down of drain amounts,

Let's say that in a long session, the same weather pattern, minute by minute pattern is used. But it has three times as much time to fill... so rather there being two storms... there'll be six... which is probably by curve 3 exists, to prevent there being so much of s change on a mo invite by minute basis.

If it was generated by blocks, then you're explanation makes sense. But I really think it's minute by minute, as the bars of the weather don't a
Start exactly at the start of the lap.

Another note, it would be awesome if the weather report was wrong sometimes.
Yeah was thinking the curves were stretched or squeezed depending on the session.
So it is minute to minute cause i saw a theory once it changed each lap the leader completed
 
Yeah was thinking the curves were stretched or squeezed depending on the session.
So it is minute to minute cause i saw a theory once it changed each lap the leader completed

Minute to minute, or lap to lap... there's only 30 seconds between them or so :) what I don't think it is is Block to Block.

ON ANOTHER NOTE:

I found where the AI are getting their 1 minute Repair All parts pitstops from. Brian's helped me do a successful test which has eliminated that behavior (by bascially bypassing their new behaviour), so the cars behave like they did in 1.23 - which while not perfect, is a lot better then lots of cars being in the pit for over a minute during each pitstop.

Want to run another few tests, but it looks like I'll include some sort of fix for that in 1.2b

A SECOND NOTE:

I did make the Car Opinion Morale change too strong. A full 0.5% per point for so-so and a little unhappy (0.5% * point number). This should return to normal for 1.3b - to make it how it was in 1.2h. However, if the game has changed morale a little, I'll refine it further in later builds.
 
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