Thrustmaster T-LCM pedals

[BrightCandle]

My journey started with a T300 and the basic 2 pedal set, I wasn't sure if the racing bug would really kick in so I wasn't willing to invest all too much early on and ever since I have been chasing my tail in the Thrustmaster ecosystem. The dual pedals it came with sucked and I very quickly ended up getting T3PA Pros to replace them.

T3PA Pros
I bought a set of T3PA Pros and they were a decent improvement. The brake was still positional but the conical brake in the box was OK if a bit stiff. I found the BJS Conical mod about 18 months ago and the green rubber was actually quite a good feeling with a gamma of 1.4. I drove like that for nearly a year and I got a lot better. I had managed to dial in a mostly linear feel but I had two problems at each end. At the top end of braking, there were too few values to give smooth adjustments and secondly, I couldn't really feel where 10% was so coming off trailing was a bit hard. I figured I would work it out in the end but I never got the hang of it consistently.

6 months ago I got an SRS (https://www.simracingsolutions.co.uk/) loadcell mod. Unlike the Ricomotech one, this pushes directly horizontally into the loadcell via rubber grommet. It is really solid, the pedal barely moves with this installed. It's not configurable either, so all you can really do is increase the minimum and decrease the maximum in-game to dial it in. Supposedly it has a 20KG loadcell in it, I was mostly using it at 45% in AC. This took my braking up a notch and made trailing easier, but I couldn't really come off the brake smoothly and slowly, the lack of movement was a bit of an issue. Hitting the points (100, 80, 20) was all fine but if I came off the brake and then wanted a blip of it the minimum was about 10%. There was too much pressure to get things going at all, it felt like 50% to get the first 10% and then linear upwards to 100% and that was the biggest problem. I wanted the trail to be half the pressure I was using at least it was far too heavy from the outset. They did offer to ship me a 10KG loadcell and that might have helped but I think the problem was more inherent to the design than the sensor.

T-LCMs

Enter the Thrustmaster T-LCM pedals. The moment I saw reviews I figured the setup application combined with the configurable springs was likely going to be what I was looking for. I had a loadcell already and it had improved my driving but it wasn't easy to learn to use and I didn't like the pedal feel at all. I got them out of the box 3 hours ago (after leaving them for a week to de virus!).

I tried the initial medium brake setting, found about 60% brake pressure was similar, removed most of the minimum force and went for a drive. I drove the same car/track/grip I drove in an endurance race a few days ago so it was fresh in my mind for comparison. I dropped 1.5seconds at best, but more importantly I had a lap to lap variance of 0.2-0.3s. I managed maybe 0.6s with occasional bad laps with the SRS Loadcell, these things instantly fixed my inconsistency problem. Its one thing to eventually find the pedals help, but to instantly just find them amazing I was not expecting that. The confidence I have with these brakes within minutes of getting them out of the box is incredible.

The initial setup they have too much travel for my taste and I think I want to remove the preload motion, go a bit stiffer and get the throttle further away so I can heel-toe blip easier. But already I can see coming off smoothly is easy, hitting the key points for threshold was easy to learn and trailing was not a problem at all. I am impressed, as a combination its cheaper than the T3PA Pros and the Fanatec loadcell set which I nearly bought until these were announced. It is clearly better in every way than the SRS loadcell. Loadcells are not all equal and having that movement in the pedal helps with consistency just as the loadcell helps the muscle memory, I need both to race well apparently. My pedals were definitely limiting me and Thrustmaster has done a good job with these, hall sensors on the throttle and clutch and that smooth loadcell.

About the only thing that has irritated me is the need to unplug the USB for the pedals if you change a setting, but it's going to be an initial annoyance that disappears once I am done with the setup process.

 

[BrightCandle]

I just leave the pedals connected via USB. they have a higher resolution that way compared to connected to the wheelbase, so you should only use the wheelbase connection if you have to (like using on a console or number of controller limitations).

As to the calibration check in the TM_Sim_Pedals_Calibration_Tool_V2_15 that you can get to 100% on the purple bar. The Green bar is force based on what the loadcell can see and do and the purple "final value" is the range you will utilise in games. Personally I also reduce the lower deadzone on the brake because I was finding 1-2% braking pressure hard to find with it because I run the brakes with the default springs. I set the 100% output max to the point the pedal bottoms out. The default springs are fairly soft and so very low inputs are moderately harder to regulate hence removing the deadzone but I think using the bottoming out as 100% is also a good tip as its quite easy to feel but this is all subjective and I would just go with whatever allows you to hit 100%, 80%, 10% and 1-2% easily with your eyes closed.

Then in game you will need to reset your iRacing braking by calibrating your controls there so it registers 100% when the pedals output 100%. That should be all there is to it and you get the full range. I seem to recall there is a config file you can adjust for braking pressure in iRacing that some people do set to higher values to make 100% pedal output map to about 85% in game to avoid brake locking for certain cars, if that rings a bell then you might need to look that up. I suspect rerunning calibration likely resets that config change however. In iRacing you definitely can't calibrate and then move the pedals to the wheelbase as it stores the peak value the pedals output and that is 32k on USB and 16k from the wheelbase so you would only get 50% in iRacing without a recalibration. Leave the pedals connected via USB unless you have issues.

 

[maelstrom]

I just leave the pedals connected via USB. they have a higher resolution that way compared to connected to the wheelbase, so you should only use the wheelbase connection if you have to (like using on a console or number of controller limitations).

I’ve yet to meet anyone who can actually tell the difference between the two resolutions in-game without knowing which connection is being used. It’s easy to think you can notice a difference if you actually know where it’s plugged in but I suspect a lot of it is just due to expectation.

 

[DaveDaBass]

Will remove the dead zone from the brakes and try again permitted time


Or with application you mean iracing itself ?

I meant inside of iRacing. But @BrightCandle described it pretty good already.

 

[Ragnar668]

Thanks guys,
afaik there is no dead zone to adjust inside iracing
Been testing a bit and think now the red springs are to hard for me
When calibrating I can reach 100%, but during practice and races I don't somehow
Instead of blaming the hardware I think I better look at myself
Gonna try the black ones or a red/black combination

About expectations; watched a couple of yt t-lcm reviews, those guys all use both red springs

 

[BrightCandle]

Thanks guys,
afaik there is no dead zone to adjust inside iracing
Been testing a bit and think now the red springs are to hard for me
When calibrating I can reach 100%, but during practice and races I don't somehow
Instead of blaming the hardware I think I better look at myself
Gonna try the black ones or a red/black combination

About expectations; watched a couple of yt t-lcm reviews, those guys all use both red springs

There are two options. The first is you reduce the springs and get a softer feel and calibrate it differently for the 100%, but you can just calibrate 100% for where you want that to happen, there is no necessity to make that when the springs bottom out if you prefer the feel of the heaviest setup.

 

[maelstrom]

but you can just calibrate 100% for where you want that to happen, there is no necessity to make that when the springs bottom out if you prefer the feel of the heaviest setup.

The only problem with that is you potentially end up with very limited pedal travel giving you 100%. I prefer to accept a slightly softer pedal but with more travel. That’s the beauty of the T-LCMs - there are so many adjustments available both through the hardware and the software.

 

[BrightCandle]

About expectations; watched a couple of yt t-lcm reviews, those guys all use both red springs

I noticed this a lot that most of the reviewers like very heavy brakes. I tried everything, softer all the way to the hardest and calibrated 100% about where I wanted it and after weeks of trying all sorts of things I settled on how it came out of the box with the 100% point when the spring bottomed out, which I think is how it comes by default (Black + Grey + Preload)! I prefer a roadcar like feel though rather than a stomp on it 100KG F1 car pedal not least because my left knee is damaged. You can really get a lot of adjustment from these pedals to get the feel how you want and you can even get after market springs that are even tougher than the red springs.

Before the T-LCMs I had a set of T3PAs with a loadcell mod. The problem with the mod is that there was zero configuration and it was just a wall of pressure with barely any movement and I couldn't change the 100% point, I couldn't find low trail inputs when coming off the pedal nor the low amount of braking generally and while it was an improvement from a conical mod it only really solved the 80-100% range with bleed to trail.

I did the driver61 course with the T-LCMs set as I liked with some preload and mid spring setup and 100% at bottom out and I realised I had a problem with some braking scenarios through the course. On Okayama there is a tight hairpin at the top of a hill and to get the car to turn in you need 1% of brake input coming from nothing, its just a hair of hold on the brakes until apex. I couldn't do that reliably with the preload as soft pedals combined with preload I couldn't feel the initial bite of the brakes. How you set them up is personal and I certainly wouldn't follow youtube personalities way, maybe stiffer is right for them but that doesn't mean its right for you (although I suspect you can learn in time just about anything).

So IMO the way to set these pedals up is so that you can do all of the following consistently:

1) Get to 100%.
2) 100% bleed off to 80%.
3) Can bleed off high braking (80-100) to 10-20% smoothly and reliably.
4) Be able to find 1-5% from no braking at all.
5) Hit ~80% from nothing reliably.
6) Modulate the brake input within about 5% of where you are up and down in the 10-20% range and 80% range.
7) Can keep on going for at least an hour.

These are basically what you do the most of and depending on the car type and sim you drive you may not need 100-80 (high downforce cars) or hitting 80% from the outset (iRacing). Finding scenarios where you need all of these types of braking profiles is an important part of the testing as is recording your inputs so you can be sure what you think is happening is. How you have them calibrated at that point doesn't matter, its about how you manage to get to these braking profiles and if a wall of force is easiest for you then do that, if its bottoming out for feel of 100% then do that instead. If you rest your foot on the brake and use preload make sure you can find that light brake point of a few percentage points. I don't dogmatically think the way I have it setup is right at all but I know for certain those 6 areas of input are necessary to use the brakes reasonably well and you also don't want to break your body down too fast.

Higher brake force is more realistic for race cars, but that doesn't mean you have to do that given most of us have only driven roadcars we may find roadcar feel works a lot better as our brain is wired currently. Play around with it, definitely test my 7 things and then once you are thereabouts leave it the hell alone and just practice.

Now I use Black + Grey and all the washers in for no preload. Calibration is 45% and deadzone is on 0.0. Throttle is 0.0 to 95.7 and clutch is 2.5-94.0.

 

[dcully]

Will these work out of the box with a G29?

 

[stigs2cousin]

Will these work out of the box with a G29?

If you are on PC yes, just plug them into an USB on your computer.
If you are on console you will need an adapter but I´m not sure if there is one currently..

MFG Carsten

 

[Dani Martinez(Chechum)]

If you are on PC yes, just plug them into an USB on your computer.
If you are on console you will need an adapter but I´m not sure if there is one currently..

MFG Carsten

Yes, I have this combo and I can't be happier! Everything working. Just make sure both wheel and pedals are connected to the game (AC and ACC in my case), sometimes you need to unplug and plug again the pedals especially.

 

[rafaeldamas04]

Hello, I have been thinking about whether to buy the tlcm or the csl elite with the load cell. Of all i have read, my only concern is that the plastic casing breaks or has reliability issues, has anyone had any big problem with the tlcm in terms of reliability. And can I use both of these pedals without hard mounting it or do i have to find a solution to keep them from sliding
Rafael Damas

 

[stigs2cousin]

Can´t answer your question in regard of reliability but you´ll need a solution to keep your pedals from sliding and your chair from moving.

You wouldn´t be the first to ty your chair to the wheelstand with safety straps.

MFG Carsten

 

[rafaeldamas04]

Can´t answer your question in regard of reliability but you´ll need a solution to keep your pedals from sliding and your chair from moving.

You wouldn´t be the first to ty your chair to the wheelstand with safety straps.

MFG Carsten

Okay, thanks for your help, probably i wil have to buy the pedals stand, that is what im going to do

 

[stigs2cousin]

Well, if your "desk racing" for now there may be other DIY soultions to fix pedals and chair.
Many people just put a box or a piece of wood between pedals and wall to keep them from sliding.

MFG Carsten

 

[rafaeldamas04]

Well, if your "desk racing" for now there may be other DIY soultions to fix pedals and chair.
Many people just put a box or a piece of wood between pedals and wall to keep them from sliding.

MFG Carsten

I agree with you, pretty sure I'll find a solid solution for my problem. Thanks for the reply and the help, really appreciate it

 

[blekenbleu]

You wouldn´t be the first to ty your chair to the wheelstand with safety straps.

More to the point, chair strapped to wheelstand is less needed than chair to pedals.
A board bolted to the back (far) bottom of pedals tilting pedals towards the chair
and sticking out either side of the pedals allows a strap to wrap around those board ends to the chair.
A cargo strap with hooks and ratchet speeds and simplifies sim deployment.

 

[download]

Hello, I have been thinking about whether to buy the tlcm or the csl elite with the load cell. Of all i have read, my only concern is that the plastic casing breaks or has reliability issues, has anyone had any big problem with the tlcm in terms of reliability. And can I use both of these pedals without hard mounting it or do i have to find a solution to keep them from sliding
Rafael Damas

They will move and tip backwards when pressing the brake pedal especially with the harder springs. I mounted mine on a piece of plywood and made two holes for my desk chair wheels to hook into works great, my chair doesn't roll backwards and pedals don't move or tip when I press them. And I haven't had a single issue with them at all since I bought them when they first came out.

 

[adie_the_badie]

Thanks for this. Ordered them today and I look forward to the more "permanent" mounting solution!

Update on my purchase. Beware of these brackets as the set I bought broke within a month of receiving them. The weak point for these brackets is the area where they begin to curve to fit around the tubing. After using them for my practice and subsequent Sunday club races the plastic broke in this area. I think the stress of the LC was too much for them. Unfortunately, I was a bit too peeved and tossed them into the garbage before I could snap a picture. The positives are that they solidly hold the pedal set to the frame and there was zero lift when braking. That being said the velcro strap that comes with the Playseat is plenty strong to hold the pedals to the frame while driving and folded.

Hope this helps/helped anyone considering the purchase.

 

[ao1977]

Update on my purchase. Beware of these brackets as the set I bought broke within a month of receiving them.

Oh dear. I just checked mine and noticed that one of the four brackets is broken as well. Bummer.

At least I still have a spare set since I accidentally ordered two of them.

I guess I'll try to find thingiverse files for these brackets and have a friend of mine printing them with 100% infill. These look promising.

 

[adie_the_badie]

These look promising.

They sure do! Might have to follow suit and reach out to my friend and have him print me a set.

Bummer that the brackets failed on you as well... a good thing they were inexpensive!