RaceDepartment welcomes Team ORSM. Here you will find the new home of the team behind V8Factor, Bathurst and other productions!
Have fun!
Have fun!
Team ORSM
- Thread starter Bram Hengeveld
- Start date
Guys, Gals (mostly Gals),
Krunch and I will be appearing at the AMG/Mercedes ride/drive day being held at Phillip Island GP Circuit from Friday 9/04/2010 to Tuesday 13/04/2010. If you're attending the event please pop in and say hello and try the latest offering from the ORSM Garage. We are set up in the pit complex right next to the AMG SLS Gullwing.
Gav G
Krunch and I will be appearing at the AMG/Mercedes ride/drive day being held at Phillip Island GP Circuit from Friday 9/04/2010 to Tuesday 13/04/2010. If you're attending the event please pop in and say hello and try the latest offering from the ORSM Garage. We are set up in the pit complex right next to the AMG SLS Gullwing.
Gav G
Hey guys.
Great to see some banta on the forum, and you know.. There are some really good points being brought up in here..
The Topic is Feedback and Suggestions, and although some are rambling on writing War and Peace (yeah that's you Flash and Doug lol), the details in these novels is very interesting.
Me, I can say I have ventured to the Dark side, and looked at the FVR mod, and spoken privately to Darth Flash several times, and he is exactly right. Different Mods, Different targets in all aspects (Models, Physics, Forum etc).
But to be honest, I am still interested in his opinion of how he thinks the car should react, even though he runs FVR. We are not really competing for market share. ****... I haven't scored a single dime from my work on V8Factor, and I'd say he hasn't either.
I think the difference is everyone on this forum has asked for Technical Enhancements in one way or another from the ORSM mod, but other mods have people asking for "What you can do in 8 weeks" as their preference. That is the key..... Its an individuals preference for what they want. I know our mod has taken some time to produce, but again... What do you expect for nothing??
rFactor is fun, its challenging, and I really love sharing with others what I love.. And thats motorsport.
So, keep the feedback coming all, and we look forward to you enjoying our work..
Great to see some banta on the forum, and you know.. There are some really good points being brought up in here..
The Topic is Feedback and Suggestions, and although some are rambling on writing War and Peace (yeah that's you Flash and Doug lol), the details in these novels is very interesting.
Me, I can say I have ventured to the Dark side, and looked at the FVR mod, and spoken privately to Darth Flash several times, and he is exactly right. Different Mods, Different targets in all aspects (Models, Physics, Forum etc).
But to be honest, I am still interested in his opinion of how he thinks the car should react, even though he runs FVR. We are not really competing for market share. ****... I haven't scored a single dime from my work on V8Factor, and I'd say he hasn't either.
I think the difference is everyone on this forum has asked for Technical Enhancements in one way or another from the ORSM mod, but other mods have people asking for "What you can do in 8 weeks" as their preference. That is the key..... Its an individuals preference for what they want. I know our mod has taken some time to produce, but again... What do you expect for nothing??
rFactor is fun, its challenging, and I really love sharing with others what I love.. And thats motorsport.
So, keep the feedback coming all, and we look forward to you enjoying our work..
Still_B we had to do something cos you have enough suggestions and feedback to last for a lifetime. As you say - they are different for their differences. I've seen guys race FVR stuff and also race ORSM stuff. Its all cool - I'm not sure why people get so hung up on which is better or worse to drive, if you like it use it, if you don't don't. I'm sure you'd agree. Technically I think both factions feel they are right but who really cares as long as you have fun. We just spotted a forum recently where some guys were comparing FVR mod with F1's. Huh - what do you say to that one. Anyway to keep on topic even though you continued this off_topic thing Still_B so its your fault. How about doing - oh I don't know, maybe do a Highway patrol mod. Yeah that'll do, I've done my bit.
I loved the ORSM version and also loved as much if not the same as the new FVR mod. Yes 3 years is along time and in motorsports thats an eternity. But when its done its done I guess. One thing I would love to see is what FVR did with the dashboard able to add sponsors decals (already mentioned before). When released his will be the mod of the year, will blow everything else out of the water.
Has anyone done the 2010 or know of anyone doing the 2010 liveries as like the 2009. I know theres a painter on the rfactorcentral site doing a few, but nothing official
Hey ozhandy, cool thanks for that but we were refering to the ORSM version hence the forum name and mod. We know the FVR version for 2010 liveries is complete.
S
slothman
-
slothman
Interesting read. I will try to refrain from commenting on past posts as quite a few have been removed/edited so I will try to give my opinions on some of the subjects.
Interpretation of Real Physics
This one is an annoyance I have with how people percieve what "real physics" are. Having never driven a real V8 Supercar, as I would assume MOST of you havnt if any, my opinions are based on what I see and hear at tracks, on tv and interviews with overseas drivers.
But I want to ignore what people think a REAL V8 Supercar can or cant do and I want to go back to some real basics here. Fundamentally every car, race or road, will behave with quite a few rules and limations that are shared between them. These than will lead into my next point. So what do I percieve as being SOME of those limitations.
- Effects of a brake lockup. When you bring it right back to the basics if someone locks up a wheel bad things will happen. Front lockups will result in the car not being able to turn as effectively, Rear Brake lock ups have a general tendency to turn the ass end into an unstable, squirmy piece of fun.
Brake Lockups will also increase temperature which will change grip levels AND also increase tyre wear.
- Increased Camber will improve CORNERING grip, to a point. Once past that point you should see either increased wear (see bathurst a few years ago when teams where running the risk of higher camber for turn in but destroying tyres because of this, risk reward) and/or decreased mid corner grip. To a lesser degree under braking, due to less rubber on the road, it could effect braking effectiveness. This last comment makes sense from a physics point of view and it works in my head, less rubber on the road under load etc etc.
- Overdriving a car will ALWAYS have a penalty. Now this is a broad statement that covers many things. But essentially overdriving a car usually comes back to the tyres as well know, that is the only part of the car on the road. This will usually mean more wear, more heat, more bad things.
So for me the three big things that I find very very hard to get past in MOST mods is the fact that overdriving the car wont hurt me. Tyre lockups do nothing to me, increased camber does not penalise me enough OR will not allow me to go past the point where it hurts and overdriving the car is more than encouraged, its mandatory.
LIMITATION OF RFACTOR
Disclaimer: I am not a physics guru and infomation below is what I understood from conversations with someone who is
Oh yeh. Here we go. I am going to post something here I am sure we have all heard, and pretty sure read in this thread.
RFactor cannot simulate this or Rfactor is not capable or Rfactor is limited.
Right. RFactor does have SOME limitations just like ANY game. No game will every truly be able to simulate a real world race environment (well not in my lifetime). But...and here it comes.
The points above CAN be overcome in rFactor. I have played and seen the proof of this in some physics created by a friend of mine who has created some amazing results with a mod.
I am here to tell you the following ARE possible.
- Lockups will give severe penalties in terms of loss of control, tyre heat which gives less grip etc etc. Done WELL!!!
- Increased Camber WILL find a point and give off penalties. In this case loss of grip and loss of stability under braking. So you need to find your own point of balance that goes with your skill under braking and cornering.
- Overdriving the car WILL hurt. In this case heat will build up QUICKLY. Once past a point it will be harder to drive so you need to take care of the car for a turn or two to bring it back. Over extended runs, as the tyre wears, that point becomes less and less. Let me tell you, changing your driving style makes a MASSIVE difference.
- Brake behaviour..this was awesome when I saw it. A driver was riding the front brake too much and overheating the front brake. Comes down conrod, brakes hard. Car dips to the front, brake discs glow which means, careful. Comes to last corner and brakes havnt cooled down enough. Goes in hard and the brake discs are now beacons of light, front brakes fail, rear comes around on him. At first we couldnt explain it until the physics guy explained what and how. I was gobsmacked.
So YES. These things that are currently not being simulated by a LARGE proportion of mods (not just V8 Factor) but THEY CAN.
Some other little bits I have seen just to give mod teams somewhere to look
- Undertrays. Some mods I have seen have very little (if any) penalty for lowering the car. Dragging ass is encouraged. That is because they have the points of the tray set outside the wheels. So as the wheel lifts, so does the tray, hence no drag. By moving those points inside the wheel, viola. The mod I have tried is one of the First (TPSCC was another from memory) where lifting the car is a FIRST step of setting the car up. Not dropping it on its ass and than maxing camber with soft suspension.
- Downforce makes a difference.
- Tyre pressure and camber have to change continously with other setup changes for optimum tyre heat and grip.
These are just a few small things I noticed.
My brain just stopped...BUT as this thread is about V8Factor feedback and suggestions.
- Please fix the ability to turn under brake lockup and have penalties that apply in relation to it. Got very tired very quickly of following cars into corner and losing my line of site due to smoke than watching those cars drive off into the distance.
- Please look at camber penalties/advantages and balance.
- Please look at undertray properties to encourage me to raise the car instead of lower to max.
- Please fix the fact I can run around at your lowest rear brake setting with no penalties.
- Please make me drive WITHIN the limits of the car, not outside what should be considered physically impossible by increasing overdrive penalties.
- Please look at engine braking as the moment I can slam the gears and have no penalty.
Sorry for the long post....hope it makes sense. No offence intended here for ANYONE, I hope noone has taken any and I hope this post can inspire teams like ORSM and others to look deeper into the possibilites of this fantastic game
Interpretation of Real Physics
This one is an annoyance I have with how people percieve what "real physics" are. Having never driven a real V8 Supercar, as I would assume MOST of you havnt if any, my opinions are based on what I see and hear at tracks, on tv and interviews with overseas drivers.
But I want to ignore what people think a REAL V8 Supercar can or cant do and I want to go back to some real basics here. Fundamentally every car, race or road, will behave with quite a few rules and limations that are shared between them. These than will lead into my next point. So what do I percieve as being SOME of those limitations.
- Effects of a brake lockup. When you bring it right back to the basics if someone locks up a wheel bad things will happen. Front lockups will result in the car not being able to turn as effectively, Rear Brake lock ups have a general tendency to turn the ass end into an unstable, squirmy piece of fun.
Brake Lockups will also increase temperature which will change grip levels AND also increase tyre wear.
- Increased Camber will improve CORNERING grip, to a point. Once past that point you should see either increased wear (see bathurst a few years ago when teams where running the risk of higher camber for turn in but destroying tyres because of this, risk reward) and/or decreased mid corner grip. To a lesser degree under braking, due to less rubber on the road, it could effect braking effectiveness. This last comment makes sense from a physics point of view and it works in my head, less rubber on the road under load etc etc.
- Overdriving a car will ALWAYS have a penalty. Now this is a broad statement that covers many things. But essentially overdriving a car usually comes back to the tyres as well know, that is the only part of the car on the road. This will usually mean more wear, more heat, more bad things.
So for me the three big things that I find very very hard to get past in MOST mods is the fact that overdriving the car wont hurt me. Tyre lockups do nothing to me, increased camber does not penalise me enough OR will not allow me to go past the point where it hurts and overdriving the car is more than encouraged, its mandatory.
LIMITATION OF RFACTOR
Disclaimer: I am not a physics guru and infomation below is what I understood from conversations with someone who is
Oh yeh. Here we go. I am going to post something here I am sure we have all heard, and pretty sure read in this thread.
RFactor cannot simulate this or Rfactor is not capable or Rfactor is limited.
Right. RFactor does have SOME limitations just like ANY game. No game will every truly be able to simulate a real world race environment (well not in my lifetime). But...and here it comes.
The points above CAN be overcome in rFactor. I have played and seen the proof of this in some physics created by a friend of mine who has created some amazing results with a mod.
I am here to tell you the following ARE possible.
- Lockups will give severe penalties in terms of loss of control, tyre heat which gives less grip etc etc. Done WELL!!!
- Increased Camber WILL find a point and give off penalties. In this case loss of grip and loss of stability under braking. So you need to find your own point of balance that goes with your skill under braking and cornering.
- Overdriving the car WILL hurt. In this case heat will build up QUICKLY. Once past a point it will be harder to drive so you need to take care of the car for a turn or two to bring it back. Over extended runs, as the tyre wears, that point becomes less and less. Let me tell you, changing your driving style makes a MASSIVE difference.
- Brake behaviour..this was awesome when I saw it. A driver was riding the front brake too much and overheating the front brake. Comes down conrod, brakes hard. Car dips to the front, brake discs glow which means, careful. Comes to last corner and brakes havnt cooled down enough. Goes in hard and the brake discs are now beacons of light, front brakes fail, rear comes around on him. At first we couldnt explain it until the physics guy explained what and how. I was gobsmacked.
So YES. These things that are currently not being simulated by a LARGE proportion of mods (not just V8 Factor) but THEY CAN.
Some other little bits I have seen just to give mod teams somewhere to look
- Undertrays. Some mods I have seen have very little (if any) penalty for lowering the car. Dragging ass is encouraged. That is because they have the points of the tray set outside the wheels. So as the wheel lifts, so does the tray, hence no drag. By moving those points inside the wheel, viola. The mod I have tried is one of the First (TPSCC was another from memory) where lifting the car is a FIRST step of setting the car up. Not dropping it on its ass and than maxing camber with soft suspension.
- Downforce makes a difference.
- Tyre pressure and camber have to change continously with other setup changes for optimum tyre heat and grip.
These are just a few small things I noticed.
My brain just stopped...BUT as this thread is about V8Factor feedback and suggestions.
- Please fix the ability to turn under brake lockup and have penalties that apply in relation to it. Got very tired very quickly of following cars into corner and losing my line of site due to smoke than watching those cars drive off into the distance.
- Please look at camber penalties/advantages and balance.
- Please look at undertray properties to encourage me to raise the car instead of lower to max.
- Please fix the fact I can run around at your lowest rear brake setting with no penalties.
- Please make me drive WITHIN the limits of the car, not outside what should be considered physically impossible by increasing overdrive penalties.
- Please look at engine braking as the moment I can slam the gears and have no penalty.
Sorry for the long post....hope it makes sense. No offence intended here for ANYONE, I hope noone has taken any and I hope this post can inspire teams like ORSM and others to look deeper into the possibilites of this fantastic game
Doug62
Premium
Well this post hits on some very fundamental aspect of all cars. Wether there race cars or road cars. The road car we all drive every day to go to work or go to the footy match. We were all young and stupid, In fact some of you still are. Young I mean! We've all done stupid thinks in our cars at times so now we know the reality of a cars capabilities race car or not. This post points out these thing to be what we would call realism.
The question here is, Is rFactor in it's current form capable of simulating these things? If you read my earlier post then you will see that I to think, In fact know that YES they are possible. There are many mods out there. Does anyone have them all? Big asked I would think. In these mods there's a set of physics some one has done for this mod and I'm shore if you know what your looking for you may find some have actually achieved one or more of these things but not all in one physics set. From my understanding to achieve what is being said here it requires a full suspension points overhaul, Tyre grip curse to be reviewed. Aerodynamics to be looked at in more fundamental ways are just some points I see here.
The question to you all is do you want the cars you drive in rFactor to have this POSSIBLE degree of realism?
P.S. People if for some reason that I misted, You feel that either this post or the one above is BAGGING this mod or others. I wish that you go away and think on the post for what it is in it entire fullness not focus on one line.
The question here is, Is rFactor in it's current form capable of simulating these things? If you read my earlier post then you will see that I to think, In fact know that YES they are possible. There are many mods out there. Does anyone have them all? Big asked I would think. In these mods there's a set of physics some one has done for this mod and I'm shore if you know what your looking for you may find some have actually achieved one or more of these things but not all in one physics set. From my understanding to achieve what is being said here it requires a full suspension points overhaul, Tyre grip curse to be reviewed. Aerodynamics to be looked at in more fundamental ways are just some points I see here.
The question to you all is do you want the cars you drive in rFactor to have this POSSIBLE degree of realism?
P.S. People if for some reason that I misted, You feel that either this post or the one above is BAGGING this mod or others. I wish that you go away and think on the post for what it is in it entire fullness not focus on one line.
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