PC1 Reaction to the newer builds

[Randy Winston]

I have been avoiding pCARS for a while, because of problems with input lag and laggy graphics at the lowest settings. I decided to give it another try this evening as I had nothing to do. I'm glad I did, as it is massively improved since I last tried it a couple of months ago. I think some fine tuning with regards to my ffb settings and this could be great fun. I'm looking forward to this game, mostly on the consoles, because if there isn't going to be modding, I'd rather have it on there anyway. So to the detractors, I urge you to give it another shot. They are getting there.

 

[Super Koala]

I found him on twitter and asked the question but he's on holiday. I wouldn't think he will reply anyway but worth a try.

I'm sure I've heard him mention Forza though or heard of him and Forza.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

I'm thinking that b272 is the best yet, as all round, some of the cars{L78/DTM} drive well for a simcade, but when I did my usual Zonda vs Zonda comparison between pcars and Simbin GT power pack, the pcars version still feels centre mounted[vs the more independent feel of Simbin zonda], and lacks the fidelity on the front end and braking.

Also, unless I'm mistaken, the FFB doesn't seem to load much around corners and such, it is well weighted as you exit the pits, but seems to maintain that load, but Simbin does a great job a dialing in weight transfer via FFB loading, and that's on medium FFB settings.

I've never particularly liked the rear grip levels of simbin Z, but pcars is strange, it feels like both rear wheels are stuck to the road, and if you try and accelerate, the whole rear end almost bounces across the track vs a progressive and more independent feeling slide from even the simbin z which has ordinary rear grip behaviour IMO.

Given that rf2's best cars and GSC 2012 tintops are the no1 sims IMO, we can see the problem pcars has from a sim POV if even an ordinary sim car from older GTR evo can still expose many weaknesses in the physics and FFB.

Ok, this is supposedly the console physics/FFB, fair enough, I can wait, especially if things do improve and the BMW's and Fords are amongst those improvements, however, I thought it pertinent to mention my views as people at WMD and elsewhere are still saying silly things like pcars Lotus is comparable to rf2's F1's......but this is simply an outrageous amount of nonsense.

I don't like rf2'S 60F1, I think it's a crazed machine, but it still has a very detailed front end, though it's prone to obscene amounts of understeer in general and in comparison to the magnificent F2{probably the best sim car in existence}, it still has excellent brakes etc, but IMO, doesn't properly transmit power to the chassis.

Between rf2's F2/3/F3.5, BT20, GSC 2012 Camaro, F1 modern, V8SC, and many cars in the simbin range, we have numerous benchmarks to compare any racing game/sim to.
That said, pcars precision with my G27 is close to perfect, though clearly, FFB isn't finished, and they claim wide ranging changes are still on the way.

 

[Kjell Eilertsen]

Good to hear (and a breath of fresh air might I add? ), can´t wait till I get home and try it myself.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

Good to hear (and a breath of fresh air might I add? ), can´t wait till I get home and try it myself.

You don't have the GT power pack yet

 

[Kjell Eilertsen]

For Race07? Got it and most other addons already.
Edit: Actually I went to check, bar GT Legends I have every official addon/version for/of Race07.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

http://au.gamespot.com/the-elder-sc...kyrim-modding-panel-at-quakecon-2012-6390320/

Bethesda and Valve nerds discuss the role of modding.....

 

[Nathan Robinson]

http://au.gamespot.com/the-elder-sc...kyrim-modding-panel-at-quakecon-2012-6390320/

Bethesda and Valve nerds discuss the role of modding.....

Lmao. David, the guy on the far left, thats you right? Lol

 

[David Ignjatovic]

Lmao. David, the guy on the far left, thats you right? Lol

tbh, I thought of you after listening to him speak and watching his general composure, LOL.

 

[Ryan Vickery]

Think you're doing a bad choice in comparing the Zonda R, it is an early beta (beta1?) stage car and is well known as not being right yet, so you perhaps picked one of the worst cars in Project CARS to test. I notice you talk about Rfactor 2 best cars, not sure what cars those are (Clio/370z?) but to me Rfactor 2 is very rough at the moment in many different areas, when I compare it to NetKar, Rfactor 2 feels so far away from it in terms of driving physics and that is my opinion, especially with the modern F1 car or Formula Renault.

The reality is that we all have different opinions on what is realistic and what feels right. I would never consider Project Cars as a "Simcade". When I hear someone label it as that, it comes across in a very negative way, people using their favourite titles in what they call "real" sims as a comparison, whether it be Rfactor, Race 07, iRacing, Netkar or any of the other popular ones.

You can look at every single one of those sims and say you know what, because of "xx" this isn't realistic or isnt right and therefor it is now a "simcade". And I really think that can be applied to any and every sim on the market right now, because In the reality of comparing it to driving a real car none of them are anything like the real thing. We should perhaps reserve the title sim for actual simulators that you find in racing team factories?


WMD/SMS have said they are making a sim, none of the cars are finished, the tyre, collision, suspension, damage etc models are not complete yet. The game has a properly working clutch (something many "real sims" do not have), a telemetry and realtime monitoring system, many of the games systems are not complete or haven't been put in at all, and the game is a year away from being released.


I know Project CARS is the cool to hate game, so most of this will fall on deaf ears to those who have already made up their minds, but give them a chance to finish making it!

 

[David Ignjatovic]

Rfactor 2 feels so far away from it in terms of driving physics and that is my opinion, especially with the modern F1 car or Formula Renault.
I know Project CARS is the cool to hate game,

rf2's front end and brakes are some of the best in the business, and in some cars{F2/3/F3.5/BT20/370} they also have excellent rear end behaviour, but it's unfinished as well, but IMO the cars I mentioned are good enough already but modders inform me that there are some things missing, but as you know it's a beta and this type of sim can be subject to physics updates even after full release.

I don't hate pcars, and I hope the BM's and Fords hit the spot, so then I can trade paint with all the WMD nutters.....think of how much fun that'll be, lol.

 

[Mapu]

[...]
You can look at every single one of those sims and say you know what, because of "xx" this isn't realistic or isnt right and therefor it is now a "simcade". And I really think that can be applied to any and every sim on the market right now, because In the reality of comparing it to driving a real car none of them are anything like the real thing. We should perhaps reserve the title sim for actual simulators that you find in racing team factories?
[...]

This is a bit blue eyed, don't you think. More of a desperate attempt to justify the sim qualities of pcars; smooth-talking.

Yes pcars is still not ready, just like criticizing its current status, often frowned upon, it is not appropriate to promote it as something what it may or may not become when it is released. Both strings of the discussion are run on the same level and sphere.

 

[Farrell Hudjik]

Hey everybody. I'm a pretty hardcore sim fan and I've been signed on to this Piss on Cars project for children since OCT.

I play all the Gmotor sims. Personally feel rF2 and GSC2012 and the Kuno's sims are top notch. Enjoy iRacing somewhat, but the physics and NTM (neverending tire model) is a beta in progress for over 4 years now. Love the Simbin Race 07 series as well.

Got a cockpit with a Fanatec CSR with Clubsport pedals, but I must say I love my Logitech G25 far more then that Forza made wheel.

Just started up a sim racing channel on Youtube and wanna share a funny vid I did this last friday testing the new 277 build. It's funny, but you'll see after 9 months and their plans to get this to market early next year is gonna just end up being another Shift series simcade.

I'd like to know if I can get my money refunded back, but probably been on it to long. Maybe if I show this vid on a new thread on their they'll beg me to take my refund.

This new channel is new. I still haven't finished a lot of the editing I wanna do with it, but It will be focused on the harcore REAL sims with Gameplay vids, news, and commentaries..

I consider myself and have been told i'm a pretty funny guy, but you can judge that for yourself by watching the vid. Again even tho funny, I do make some very truthful facts that definately any of you that have given up on this project and dislike it will agree..

For those who do like it in this thread, all I can say is I'm sorry and hope you take it with a grain of salt. I will not stand for promises SMS have given us about Sim racing from Shift 1 on and be lied to and I will NEVER support them again..

Anyways hope some of you sub my channel. It will be an interesting and fun channel. Like I said, I have no content up yet and still working on a few things before I start adding content. It should be a fun ride. I'm new here on RD as well and am loving the atmosphere here. You can actually speak your mind and most are civil here. Best Sim forum I have come across.

Anyways enjoy the vid and leave your comments here or on the vid comments on the channel.. Enjoy.

 

[Kazumi]

The reality is that we all have different opinions on what is realistic and what feels right. I would never consider Project Cars as a "Simcade". When I hear someone label it as that, it comes across in a very negative way, people using their favourite titles in what they call "real" sims as a comparison, whether it be Rfactor, Race 07, iRacing, Netkar or any of the other popular ones.

You can look at every single one of those sims and say you know what, because of "xx" this isn't realistic or isnt right and therefor it is now a "simcade". And I really think that can be applied to any and every sim on the market right now, because In the reality of comparing it to driving a real car none of them are anything like the real thing. We should perhaps reserve the title sim for actual simulators that you find in racing team factories?

- rFactor 1, even including their favorite mods . GSC which kinda is heavily modded rFactor 1 with years of mod and dev experience. NkP and iRacing which both had some major updates through the years.

As annoying "it's WIP" is, in research, development, tweaking and so on time can never be underestimated.

- Yet, in a "simcade" many features can be missing, some vehicle handling characteristics can be compromised, and it's still a good racing game.

In a pure sim, all important things (sure, we can argue which are important and which not so much ) must work out, and if not then it's not as good as it could and/or should be.

 

[Peter]

Here is the newest build, it has a little bug from the early builds still in it.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

-
- Yet, in a "simcade" many features can be missing, some vehicle handling characteristics can be compromised, and it's still a good racing game.

This is important, as I don't think SMS can afford to cock this game up even if it's pure simcade despite the PC upgrades.
If SMS can get most of the BMW's and Fords to drive well, and MP is active on PC, I'll be happy, but the current carlist does nothing for me, it's a weird bunch that's for sure.

 

[gh69]

Here is the newest build, it has a little bug from the early builds still in it.

Why don't you also point out that that bug only appears in replays rather than incinuate it's something worse than that.

It's a no win situation for SMS, people say they should concentrate on physics then complain about non important graphical bugs not being fixed.

Basically the problems seems to be that many people just cannot handle seeing software in development and don't understand the development cycle.
They see lies where there are none just their own misunderstanding of what was said.
They cannot comprehend the difference between developers and publishers and who has control in that relationship.

Far from bringing WMD, pCARS, or SMS down it strikes me that these threads do far worse for the people who continually work on the theory that if they fling enough **** some of it with stick. In most cases to me and probably 100s of others they seem to be flinging **** into a headwind.

 

[Kazumi]

Here is the newest build, it has a little bug from the early builds still in it.

[vid]

That bug with small wheel/tire (somewhere < 30 cm overall base diameter) is there since Shift 1. It should be only in replay though. On the other hand maybe it would be magically fixed with proper "suspension" chassis flex anyway.

 

[Peter]

That bug with small wheel/tire (somewhere < 30 cm overall base diameter) is there since Shift 1. It should be only in replay though. On the other hand maybe it would be magically fixed with proper "suspension" chassis flex anyway.

They only need bigger wheels from a truck or Jeep.

 

[Kazumi]

Or probably a very high center of gravity.

Both will influece physics in a way you don't really want though...

 

[DrJustice]

...Anyways enjoy the vid and leave your comments here or on the vid comments on the channel.. Enjoy.

Ahh yes, the old game of sim discrediting vids. You know full well that we could fill the rest of this thread with videos proving the wonkiness of any sim.

Of course pCARS (and rF2) is in development, whereas those other blooper videos would be of mature products that has been several years on the market and that has had much patching and updates.

That "blooper" video seems to be made by someone with an unhealthy hang-up for pCARS dissing. The tone of the commenter is that of a highly agitated individual at work; forced snickering, mocking voice, arrogance, making things out to be what they're not etc.. E.g. a comment about a "wheelie": the car hit a transverse bump inside the curb - F1 cars do take off in similar sitiations. Then a comment about "suddenly" spinning: the car was in a slide on the grass, of course it spun. The damage is mainly visual ATM, so losing body panels has no effect until the damage model is extended. So you spotted some unfinished things in an unfinished sim - amazing!

Edit to add: I think this fresh quote from another forum is quite apt (not specifically for Farrell, but in general):
"...you know as well as I do that this is the era of "scorched earth" opinions. It isn't enough to just say you don't like something anymore. In order to feel you've made your point you must destroy everything in your path. It's pathetic in the real world, politics for example, and an order of magnitude more pathetic in the gaming world."

Here is the newest build, it has a little bug from the early builds still in it

The kart replay thing is a known bug that will be fixed when the devs come to that point on their list.

Now to hammer down the point, here's "bloopers" from most of the highly regarded sims that has been on the market for a good while. It took me 5 minutes to find these random vids, and there's heaps more. Just for the record, I've got nothing against any of them, I understand that there are glitches, even in "mature" games. Knock yourselves out (could only post 5 vids, so had to drop the GTR2, Race 07 and GPL bloopers):