Tracks LA Canyons 1.2

[guidofoc]

Hi everyone, it's been a while, hope you're all doing well...
I unfortunately have to make some news final and official.

Due to so many illegal ports, texture / asset thefts on my and others work, there will be no LA Canyons update, all other projects are now cancelled (at least publicly) and I'm now leaving the modding scene. I don't fancy doing any more work just for low lifes to steal it.
...

That's horrible news my friend. Have you considered doing Patreon? It is a formula that seems to work (check for instance Shutoko, Peter Boese, Abulzz, No Hesi.. not to mention x4fab). I mean stopping people from stealing digital assets is almost impossible but at least you would have an official channel where you can communicate with your supporters, bring the updates and have a somewhat regular revenue for your work.

Whatever you decide, thanks so much for your fantastic tracks and for just being a good guy!

 

[bongady]

Sad news but I fully support your decision.
I would like to thank you for all your contributions to the AC mod scene.
LAC is still my go to track for road cars and is easily the track I have covered the most miles on.
It was truly groundbreaking when first released.
When I need to unwind I like to drive at night with the two-way traffic layout in a 60/70/80s supercar listening to some atmospheric opera, stopping off and walking through the trees in VR to visit the UFO.
Bravo, and best wishes going forward.
VR Sim Racer

 

[Phoenix77]

I have never had the pleasure of downloading your amazing work (I have barely time to play plain vanilla AC And nave no mods), let alone drive it, but I have been wanting to do so for YEARS.

I am extremely sad to learn of your immense frustration and am very sorry to see you go.

Thanks man, yes time is the main thing... While modding (just about had time with work / pandemic / inflation costs etc over the last few years) there wasn't time to drive, so I understand your not being able to get the time.

But if I remember correctly, you have sent some great messages which all helped with morale, shame it's been countered by scum charging (per month) for servers, while giving away other peoples work elsewhere.

Very sorry to read your leaving the modding scene and I'm sure everyone who uses your work will also be sad.
It’s a beautiful legacy you leave us with and hopefully some of the pond life who stole your work will maybe (although I doubt they care) realise the harm they do.
Best wishes for your future endeavors and maybe sometime we'll see you return.

Thanks Kenny, you sir are one awesome dude, keeping in check some rowdy forum behaviour Race Department are lucky to have you on their team. I salute you!

Thanks for saying "a beautiful legacy" that's a great way of putting it! It all started with trying to honour my Brother with Pacific Coast with over 370,000 downloads, and almost 500,000 downloads for LA Canyons... I'd like to think I've gone some way to achieving that

That's horrible news my friend. Have you considered doing Patreon? It is a formula that seems to work (check for instance Shutoko, Peter Boese, Abulzz, No Hesi.. not to mention x4fab). I mean stopping people from stealing digital assets is almost impossible but at least you would have an official channel where you can communicate with your supporters, bring the updates and have a somewhat regular revenue for your work.

Whatever you decide, thanks so much for your fantastic tracks and for just being a good guy!

Thanks Guido, you've shown great support along the way mate... That's why you've got the shout out up by Newcombs Ranch It's been great driving with you on the few occasions I got the chance! Thanks for making me look slow on my own tracks

Thanks for the Patreon idea, although despite having a 'store', my work on tracks was never about the financial side... The store only exists because of some people (back in this thread) saying why don't you 'Name a Price' and cornering me into it... because the manual way of sending out VIP became unmanagable when thousands of people started wanting it... Sending out links to people mainly hit their spam filters... and I chose NOT to go with Patreon (despite it being free, and my store is a cost) as their payment system was a bit awkward for people... I didn't like the idea of a monthly 'fee' either.

I'm not going into this too much, but I'm not sure how I feel about the whole SRP thing... I can admire the amount of work it's taken them. But isn't a large portion of it RIPPED from the Tokyo Extreme Racer game? Isn't that why it will never be a download on Race Department? Also the reason why it's free? along the way, I'm pretty sure they've gained financially from other peoples work. I will leave that there!

Sorry dude... 'No Hesi' I cannot stand that term, once you see how the real life 'No Hesi' behave on public roads, risking other road users lives for their little thrills... Maybe others will understand my dislike. I'm not sharing any video links... But they are searchable on youtube!

Ok I know canyon racing is a thing, but I like to think this happens up in the mountains on deserted canyon roads far away from busy freeways.

But anyway, I'll leave that rant there... Thanks for your support dude!

 

[Phoenix77]

Sad news but I fully support your decision.
I would like to thank you for all your contributions to the AC mod scene.
LAC is still my go to track for road cars and is easily the track I have covered the most miles on.
It was truly groundbreaking when first released.
When I need to unwind I like to drive at night with the two-way traffic layout in a 60/70/80s supercar listening to some atmospheric opera, stopping off and walking through the trees in VR to visit the UFO.
Bravo, and best wishes going forward.
VR Sim Racer

Thanks dude, for the kind words, support and cool videos!
In my opinion it still is pretty ground breaking... Pretty huge, Pretty accurate... and unlike another well known track... Scratch built and allowed on RD! (enough said)

I love it when I hear about people unwinding and relaxing in the Canyons, and seeing a 30 car, respectful cruise is a sight to behold. One thing I didn't really expect was those that respect the double yellows, and apart from excessive speed, drive fairly legally

I also loved it that I managed to get 1.2 out just before the pandemic rolled in (otherwise it possibly wouldn't have happened) allowing people to virtually get out on the road, when in real life they were locked down and isolated.

Thanks man, Best wishes to you too, it's been a tough few years... hopefully things are on the up

 

[Michael Krone]

Damn shame.. I came across the guy you named earlier and couldnt believe it. I could go on and on about how I feel about that but ill keep to myself. No good will come from it. Pretty much agree with everything else youve pointed out. Hey, thanks for everything and good luck in the future.

EDIT: Small suggestion, edit out the guy's name. Dont give him any attention or income. Most of us have heard about him already.

 

[Phoenix77]

Damn shame.. I came across the guy you named earlier and couldnt believe it. I could go on and on about how I feel about that but ill keep to myself. No good will come from it. Pretty much agree with everything else youve pointed out. Hey, thanks for everything and good luck in the future.

EDIT: Small suggestion, edit out the guy's name. Dont give him any attention or income. Most of us have heard about him already.

Thanks Michael, yeah fair point about editing out the scum...

EDIT: Took your advice, cheers

I won't share the where stuff is given away... anyway if people want to download a Virus or Trojan, let them fill their boots.

Anyway, as you say... not worth going on (literally)... Good luck for the future mate

 

[CS0CS0]

Shame but if they arent making other tracks for the same games u create mods for -while i know it sucks but i dont see why u need to "punish" everyone by stop making doing mods. We love your work and dont get me wrong; I do understand u don't owe us anything but illegal shares and mods an inevitable. Do they sell stuff on patreon that includes stollen parts of your work? If so u should be able to do something no? Anyway. I hope u sleep on it and think it over.

 

[Wanderkröte]

Damn, that is sad to hear. Still my favorite tracks with having driven 22300 km on it...since my hard disc died last year and the counter was rest... and before there was probably about the same.

I was really hoping for some 3D trees or any update.

 

[Phoenix77]

Shame but if they arent making other tracks for the same games u create mods for -while i know it sucks but i dont see why u need to "punish" everyone by stop making doing mods. We love your work and dont get me wrong; I do understand u don't owe us anything but illegal shares and mods an inevitable. Do they sell stuff on patreon that includes stollen parts of your work? If so u should be able to do something no? Anyway. I hope u sleep on it and think it over.

Thanks & I completely understand your opinions.... and in an ideal world that's how it would work. When the original supporters generously showed their love & support, voluntarily... I felt I owed them. So I held back the 'extra' roads (approx 40 miles worth) as a nice surprise to say thanks. Word got out there was more, my message got lost, then to some it appeared I was asking for something. Never how it was intended to be.

It's a case of 'the few' spoiling it for 'the many', like I've said they're part of the reason. By no means the only reason. When 'spare' time is too difficult to find, and real world work is a priority... These days effectively working twice as long for half as much (as likely everyone knows now). Simply put, payback for all the excess money printed by governments during the pandemic.

Illegal shares are inevitable, I know, and as you say I can issue DMCA's, but they're time consuming. For example I've spent 3-4 hours getting illegal BeamNG ports removed just over the last few days. It probably takes the original creator as long as the port took... Simple for the uploader, more long winded for the original creator to prove they own the rights. If things are not taken down swiftly then they proliferate like wildfire. unfortunately I can't be everywhere at once.

It's pretty shocking what people charge for on Patreon, car rips from GT7, Forza, track RIPS from other games etc... These companies have large legal teams but they can't even police the internet. It is Rife! Even when the cool @Mike Smith stood up to injustices with SDD he almost lost his YT Channel and all the hard work he's put in. (If anyone reading this likes the good guys give him a sub)

I will always want to thank the people who have been loyal, loving with their support and just awesome, but ultimately I have to be realistic.

Damn, that is sad to hear. Still my favorite tracks with having driven 22300 km on it...since my hard disc died last year and the counter was rest... and before there was probably about the same.

I was really hoping for some 3D trees or any update.

Thanks man, always blows my mind when I think of how many miles people have done on my virtual roads, everyone combined it's literally astronomical distances! I'd have to say the real pioneer of the epic 'big track' was Lake Louise by Lucas . Imagine an update of that track with 3D trees, Grass FX etc.... It would be phenomenal! But sadly it's not happened as of yet.

I think the thing is, with huge projects like these, unless you're constantly working on them and have to leave it for weeks or months (because of real life commitments)... It takes time to get back up to speed each time you return, keeping on top of which files are the latest etc (LA Canyons required a Huge amount of Max Scenes). When I have had the chance to 'get back on it' I find I'm wasting this time chasing the dodgy upload crowd.

Like they say with relationships, don't be sad it's over, be happy it even happened in the first place Cheers dude! Thanks for your great comments along the way!

 

[Davide Nativo]

Weeds are incredibly damaging to crops. They're pests, they're incredibly tough and resilient, there's no way you'll ever "weed" them out once and for all. Every farmer hates them and wonders why they exist. But alas, they exist and there's not much that can be done about them.
You can choose to leave them as they are, and they will slowly eat up your field.
You can choose to burn the entire field, but this will destroy your crop and everything good in it as well. By doing so you are denying the fruit of your labor to yourself and those who deserve it, appreciate it and value it correctly. By trying not to deal with the damage, you may end up inflicting it yourself on those who don't deserve it (including yourself).
Third choice: be patient, and continue to eradicate them, finding a reason to keep working hard (as you have).

Spoiler: A quote from Luke, if you don't mind me quoting the Bible.

From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked. (Luke 12, 48)

In any case, thank you for everything you have done thus far out of selflessness and genuine passion to so many people

 

[McGherkin]

I'm really sad to see you're quitting. Your work is incredible and I was looking forward to seeing more. LAC is an astounding achievement.

If you paywalled your mods, the people who enjoy your content like myself will gladly pay, and those who will inevitably still rip your mods - well at least they had to give their pound of flesh. As much as I like RD it's open season for the rippers. Unfortunately as you say it's just whackamole so you almost can't get worried about it - just dig in and create for those who want to enjoy your content. Who wants to drive LAC in BeamNG anyway!

Thing is everybody knows who the real creator is. And in a way those crappy rips will ultimately guide people to you in the end once they realise why what they're driving is garbage.

 

[Johnr777]

We all have many reasons why we create downloadable content for our racing games. Some do it for a few extra bucks, some do it for fun and a few laughs, others do it for recognition, or maybe a private project that gets shared because the owner wanted others to experience it as well.

At the end of the day, there was time, skill and effort spent on it, tools and materials used - yes, all virtually but no different than someone going to a hardware store, then proceed to build... lets say... a playground for children in their own neighborhood.

Society sucks in general, so when using this playground example, we all know:

- People in this neighborhood will complain about their free playground not having enough swings, and that they are entitled to more free swings and slides

- People will add half a shovel of sand in the play area, claiming its just a big contribution and want the playground named after them

- People will want another playground, closer to their home.

- And my favorite, people will steal the playground so they can have it in their own neighborhood.

------------------------------

It wont be a surprise for the residents in this neighborhood to not ever see another playground being built by the same big hearted person....

So why are there expectations from this community - for content creators to just "ignore" what goes one and keep providing, or as said earlier... keep working hard

 

[Davide Nativo]

So why are there expectations from this community - for content creators to just "ignore" what goes one and keep providing, or as said earlier... keep working hard

John, since I believe it's pretty obvious you were referring to my message, I can tell you that you completely misunderstood my point. That doesn't surprise me however.
I'll try and put it in different words: I was telling him that he shouldn't give up on something he thoroughly enjoys for a plethora of reasons, including because it makes other people happy, 'cause of malicious individuals (which funnily enough, come in many shapes and forms, one must always be wary). I was suggesting he should find in that happiness he feels the reason to keep pushing, IF he finds it there. Otherwise, there's obviously no reason to continue and he should absolutely stop.

Hopefully that's clearer now. I must say that I almost immediately did regret not writing to him in private though. Was sure that there would be people misunderstanding (as you put it yourself, society sucks) and I was right. I learned now.

 

[Johnr777]

John, since I believe it's pretty obvious you were referring to my message, I can tell you that you completely misunderstood my point. That doesn't surprise me however.
I'll try and put it in different words: I was telling him that he shouldn't give up on something he thoroughly enjoys for a plethora of reasons, including because it makes other people happy, 'cause of malicious individuals (which funnily enough, come in many shapes and forms, one must always be wary). I was suggesting he should find in that happiness he feels the reason to keep pushing, IF he finds it there. Otherwise, there's obviously no reason to continue and he should absolutely stop.

Hopefully that's clearer now. I must say that I almost immediately did regret not writing to him in private though. Was sure that there would be people misunderstanding (as you put it yourself, society sucks) and I was right. I learned now.

I get what you are saying and agree 100%!

But from a content creator point of view, it does stop being fun… something we do out of enjoyment becomes a headache and stressful. A break, or “change of scenery” most often does a good reset in my experience!

 

[Davide Nativo]

it does stop being fun

I really hope it didn't truly come to that, because that would be the biggest loss in this whole situation, for a man to lose something he's truly passionate about (or, even worse, be robbed of it).

 

[Ipsem Lorum]

That's really sad to hear that you've decided to quit the modding scene entirely because of some idiots. In the last few years we've seen several modders quit for the exact same reasons, it's a shame to see this trend continuing, but of course I fully understand and respect your decision. In case you change your mind later on we'll be glad to welcome you back! From my experience the majority of the sim racing community is very kind, respectful and also willing to spend money for quality mods, so I'm as upset as you are that a few guys have to ruin it for the whole community and especially for you I wish you all the best @Phoenix77 and thank you so much for some of the most legendary tracks Assetto Corsa has ever seen!

 

[Phoenix77]

You can choose to leave them as they are, and they will slowly eat up your field.
You can choose to burn the entire field, but this will destroy your crop and everything good in it as well

Thanks Davide for the wise words (Never thought LA Canyons thread would see a bible quote). Unfortunately when the weeds are almost as high as the crop... Smokeys word is final

Who wants to drive LAC in BeamNG anyway

Turned out around 20,000 people downloaded the illegal ports in a month or so! Like I said, it's a game of whack-a-mole. Cheers mate

We all have many reasons why we create downloadable content for our racing games

Well my reason for making tracks was to honour my Brother after his death in 2016... Shame my reason for leaving is 'partly' because of people who couldn't even dream of being a fraction as good a man as my Brother!

So why are there expectations from this community - for content creators to just "ignore" what goes one and keep providing, or as said earlier... keep working hard

You can only ignore something for so long...

But from a content creator point of view, it does stop being fun

I have to unfortunately agree... Thanks mate! I've made a couple of big enough playgrounds!
If I hadn't, I'd be asking you... Playground Mod When? Is it laserscanned?

Cheers!

From my experience the majority of the sim racing community is very kind, respectful

I have to agree, most people (on here)... around 90% have been awesome...
Although when my tracks have had a few downloads... the remaining 10% of undesirables is a large number!

Here on RD with the amazing admins policing as well as they can, it's a far nicer place than many on the internet... Anyone who can afford to support RD with going Premium... Please do so. Help top their fridge back up... or at least help get them a step ladder! Cheers RD!


747 ratings on LA Canyons I think confirms my decision is the right one...

"Leaving... on a jet plane, don't know when I'll be back again"

Cheers to all the decent people on here, you know who you are, and so do I...
Until next time, don't cross on double yellows

 

[Ben O'Bro]

Every message you write is like nice and well written and sounds like a (sad) conclusion to an era.
Yet people keep replying, and you keep replying, and here i am replying. But you don't have to reply, you know whatimean? : D
(we're just trying to squeeze a bit more time with you mate)

Idiots or not, modding seems to mostly be a matter of time frame in life.
At some point you are curious enough about modding, you start investigating, allowing time in your agenda, and before you know it you release your first v0.1 mod. One thing leads to another version, another release, or another project altogether etc.
But life moves on. And that modding time frame is only temporary. If you look at all the first modders here in RD, or in any other community. Modders come and go.
Look at the_meco and his Cobra, or A3DR and his NFS cars for example.
And look at all the never finished mods etc. Time, motivation, plenty of real life reasons getting in the way really...

Yes it is sad for us players that these guys stopped doing mods, yet i'm pretty glad it happened in the first place, and how i enjoyed driving those cars.
In your case, it's a pretty annoying fact that the termination factor was the a*holes out there. But truly, it was just a matter of time before life was moving on enough that you would have seen yourself moving away from modding anyways.
So let's accept this early retirement from modding. And who knows what happens when AC2 (or 3) comes around the corner

So all in all, thank you for your time and your services to your country. Thank you for all those hours on discord, letting me help on your stupidly big tracks, and letting me go nuts with my trees
And please know i'll always find time to help you, if you ever find yourself wanting to recreate yet another piece of road heaven.

 

[Phoenix77]

@Benobro ......
Thanks mate... my replies, well written?... when did that happen?
Well how can I not reply to a legend, and someone who has been the most selfless, passionate, dedicated modder on here, and there are many who are dedicated. You never asked for anything... Ever! (ok maybe you asked for some huge terrain meshes)

It has, and will always be an honour sending you over Van-loads (boot-loads, trunk-loads) of beer/coffee even if everytime I do, you call me a crazy man, someone compensating for all of those people sending you 0.01 for all of your hard work, on all your free mods.

Anyway lets drop any of that talk, as I know there are some people on here who don't agree with mods being in any way paid for. (even though some have worked in the 3D industry all their life). They know who they are, I know who they are, sometimes silence is louder than words.
------------------------------------------
Line drawn! Moving on!

End of an Era? Yes most certainly, but bearing in mind the meaning of the Phoenix (in greek mythology), sometimes things have to get burned to the ground, only to rise again in another form from the ashes. I think I mentioned before about the house fire I was involved in... almost losing everything... (77 isn't my birth year, it was a door number)

While other people ask for this, ask for that, you stepped up and generously offered your talent, skills, ideas, knowledge and general awesomeness. I may have lost my Brother 7 years ago last week... But I like to think I gained an O' Bro along the journey (ok that was tough to type )
Cheers dude!

Please don't thank me for my time, thank you for yours. While I appreciate your offer of trees for any future road. I don't think I could put you through that again...

Anyway, replying to you brings a calm finality for me....

Don't be sad the sun is setting, be glad you've got working headlights

 

[Phoenix77]

I'll leave you with one 'what may happen' project, if I ever decide to 'pull the trigger' on it... This is Wyoming 0.01... Made from 956 1x1km lidar 'tiles' at (10cm resolution whatever arc seconds that is) Data obtained from the awesome USGS website (so much better than UK data), If my quick calcs are correct... 95 billion elevation points, and working (as a test) in game in around 5 hours not including the time bulk downloading overnight. (I've spent longer getting things taken down).

The road is 35 miles long, tightest corner is 200m, and a 918 can do all 35 miles in a fraction over 8 minutes. with only minor lifting. makes the Nordschleife seem slow. With traffic / online this would have been insane.

If the 'Ripping', 'Porting' and 'Share WTF they like' gangs ever grow up and put on their big boy pants, then maybe this will happen, but I doubt I'll ever make this a public download. I now have a nice long list of emails of people who I Really appreciate... And now know of plenty of people I don't!

Forget the road textures in Max etc etc... and the road is floating (no terrain cuts) in a Lake Louise style, the road is still fully spline adjustable. and takes one bank angle for corners (auto banking as a modder that's golden)... from the Lidar. This was only testing my Lidar processing techniques, eventually the road would need to be 'conformed' down onto the terrain and cuts made.

This is the area I chose... Note around 70-80 miles of dirt trails / rally stages. (at a guess)

For scale, the yellow area is the main 35 mile highway.

I'd open it's own thread, but no point if it doesn't progress any further.
I'll still be about on RD from time to time, but for now anyway. I no longer consider myself a modder.

Thanks again to all the awesome people, I hope one day I can give you the chance to experience this. Until next time... Take care! Phoenix