How to upgrade from G920 - Recommendations?

[Eagle Beak]

Long-term goal
Ever since I met RasmusP, and he told me about his personal transformation after upgrading from a G920 to a ClubSport base and BMW GT2 wheel, it has been my dream to get a Clubsport setup. After researching all of their wheels, the Porsche 918 wheel seems perfect for me. I'm also really looking forward to having the authentic feel of a ClubSport H-shifter, the realistic feeling clutch and brake pedals on the Clubsport V3 pedals, and finally getting a handbrake. But all of this is going to be $1700+. Its going to take me at least 1 year to save up enough for this, so I need to make a short-term plan to get me by (my G920 is now nearly unusable).

Short-term planning
My wheel needs to be replaced first, and its all I can afford for now. My Logitech pedals and shifter are still doing great and I've learned how to position my keyboard by my shifter to use as a binary handbrake. So here's the question: do I get a CSL elite wheel system or a ClubSport system?

Argument for the CSL Elite wheel system:
There are no reasonably priced ClubSport wheels. All ClubSport wheels are almost the same price as the base itself. Purchasing a standard ClubSport Wheel to match your ClubSport bases costs $950 total. For $50 more, you can buy a top of the line Direct Drive base AND wheel with the AccuForce Pro V2. I simply do not see why it should cost $300-400 to stick a $130 rim on a base (An xbox controller is only $60, so the argument that "its also a controller" doesn't account for the extra $200). I don't even care if there are no buttons on the wheel. I just want a light (less than 2Kg) yet realistically large wheel (over 300mm) to stick on the base. I know I could use the CSL Elite wheel, but its so small that I can't justify putting it on such an expensive base.
I also understand that upgrading to either the CSL or the ClubSport is a HUGE jump up from a G920, so I feel like I might as well enjoy the CSL for now and sell it later after saving up more money for a better wheel system. I really don't want to use the small 300mm CSL wheel, but at least it's a little bigger than the G920.

Argument for the ClubSport wheel system:
Although I'm not convinced that the ClubSport is a better deal than the AccuForce Direct Drive, I do know that the rest of my racing setup will be Fanatec gear. Therefore, it will save me a lot of hassle just having all my equipment be Fanatec (my gaming rig is a laptop [I can't bring a gaming tower on my military deployments], so I'm limited on USBs [Yes I use USB hubs too]).
ClubSport wheels are the best, hands-down. They are also the only wheels that come in the size that I want (larger than 300mm).
Also, the only reason I will buy a CSL base and wheel are if I determine that the resale value will be high after 1 year of use, at least 60% of the original price. If Fanatec wheels lose value quickly, I'd be a fool to buy something I plan on selling later.
Again, the main thing holding me back here is the cost. There is no reasonably priced wheel for the ClubSport. If I buy a ClubSport base, I will have to buy a puny CSL wheel to go with it, and that will feel wrong. (I'm also not interested in the BMW wheel, its too heavy).

Unless I can find a nice, lightweight, realistic-sized wheel to put on a ClubSport base, I'm probably going to have to get the CSL and save up for a while before getting the ClubSport. Does anyone know of any older wheels for sale that will mate up, or how to use the ClubSport with an aftermarket alternative? Thanks!

Games I play, in order of playtime:
Dirt Rally 2.0
Assetto Corsa
Forza Motorsport 7
RBR
Sebastien Loeb Rally
WRC7

My current setup:

-------------------
Background (you're welcome to skip)
For a year and a half I've been using a G920 wheel, pedals, and shifter. Considering I found the whole setup for $300, I think I got a great value. The pedals and shifter have performed well, my only criticisms are minor things of preference (I could do a separate review of the whole setup another time, considering that I have put in about 500-600 hours of time into this rig). The wheel however, well, I knew early on that I would need a replacement before long. Just looking at it, I knew it was more of a toy than a serious racing wheel. The main thing that always bothered me was the rim diameter. I now understand the reasoning and physics behind the design (smaller wheel = better FFB with cheaper price), but I've always felt like a child using it.
Now, I don't have a choice but to upgrade. After about 6 months with this wheel its gears stated slipping mid-race. At first it was rare, but now it happens 1-3 times per 10 minute race. I mostly play rally games, which is much harder on these wheels, but now it is even slipping when I get into tight corners in Assetto Corsa. No bueno. I'm now reading online that this is a very common complaint with these wheels, and Logitech doesn't give a flying *insert expletive here* to help or fix it.

 

[turen009]

I see 3DRap also has some very affordable upgrades for the Clutch and Throttle pedals. A Simple rubber piece that fits in the spring housing to harden the pedal presses.

I have been using the SHH shifter for about 6 months or so and I must say I like it a lot compared to my old Fanatec one. The SHH has enough resistance, and the resistance is also adjustable. Its also a breeze to switch between H and sequential. It definitely punches above the price point. Highly recommended.

 

[GeekyDeaks]

If you have access to a 3D printer, there are some that may be easier:

Have you tried any of those mods yourself @blekenbleu ? Curious if they are worth it as I have finally ordered my own printer so I can stop pestering my buddy. I'm actually looking to replace the pots with hall sensors, but anything like this is also interesting.

 

[blekenbleu]

Have you tried any of those mods yourself @blekenbleu ?

Nope, that's why "may" was italicized..
..I fabricated mine using metal.

I'm actually looking to replace the pots with hall sensors

I have yet to research that; clutch and gas pots still work OK and
fabricating a better motor shaft clamp for AccuForce DIY was only just completed.

 

[Eagle Beak]

If you have access to a 3D printer, there are some that may be easier:

• REALISTIC LOGITECH CLUTCH DIY HOW TO YouTube video and Thingiverse link
• another Thingiverse Logitech G25 degressive clutch mod and how-to video
• this one gets points for novelty..

One can carve plastic wine bottle "corks" to suit...

That first mod looks very easy to install! Thanks a bunch man.

I don't know anyone with a 3D printer, so I'm going to research where is the best place to order 3D prints from.

 

[blekenbleu]

I'm going to research where is the best place to order 3D prints from.

I have good experience with parts from Shapeways.

 

[Eagle Beak]

I have good experience with parts from Shapeways.

Awesome. People online are also reporting good experiences with them.

Thanks Blekenbleu.

 

[Eagle Beak]

For everyone's information, I have ordered a 3D print of Iggy_82's degressive clutch mod on thingiverse:

Logitech G25 degressive clutch mod by Iggy_82

Edit: added a pic with some measurment of my pedal extensions as there seems to be an interest in those. Choose view original to get the correct aspect ratio.Logitech G25 degressive clutch mod.This simulates the feel of a real clutch mechanism in the same way as some of the more proffesional...

www.thingiverse.com

I shopped around for hours getting quotes from lots of 3D printing sites, but many wanted around $100 to make this relatively simple design. The author of the design said he got his printed locally for $20, so I kept searching. Finally a found a site called www.treatstock.com, where you can upload your 3D print files and they'll immediately send you quotes from 3D print shops from all over the country. I ordered mine, with 100% infill, for only $24 shipped.

 

[Ray Dann]

Dude, your in the military so keep the g920 until it dies. Order the true brake and install that, works wonders and is plug and play. Retired from navy and I wouldn’t take a big CSL on any deployment, but I’d throw the g920 in a bag and take it on the sub or even to one of the narmy deployments.

 

[blekenbleu]

I wouldn’t take a big CSL on any deployment

Accuforce signal connectors at its controller box are also less than confidence-inspiring.

 

[Eagle Beak]

Dude, your in the military so keep the g920 until it dies. Order the true brake and install that, works wonders and is plug and play. Retired from navy and I wouldn’t take a big CSL on any deployment, but I’d throw the g920 in a bag and take it on the sub or even to one of the narmy deployments.

You were able to bring, your sim racing setup on a sub?!? That's hard to believe, man. I've talked to a few submariners, and I can't imagine where you'd be able to install your setup. I won't be bringing my wheel on deployment with me. I've no doubt my Airmen would not respect that.

I don't intend on selling my G920, I'll keep it as a backup. I've installed a new 320mm rim on mine and its working great (although I now have to use my keyboard for nearly all button input)

Since my last post I've received a SHH shifter (which is AWESOME), and I'll be installing my 3D printed clutch mod and Truebrake soon. I plan to start a new thread with my reviews once I've used them for a month or so.

 

[mrexcitement71]

Definitely i would have gone for the Fanatec CSW V2.5 as the G920 is crap in comparison , i gave my old G920 to my friend and he was trying to play WRC 9 and he really really struggled driving with the G920 compared to my Fanatec CSW V2.5 he would use when he visited , he said there is just no comparison , the G920 is vague with a huge dead zone in the middle and not precise compared to the CSW V2.5 , so much so that i ended up selling him my CSW V2.5 and i upgraded to a DD1.
The CSW V2.5 is the best wheel you can have before getting a direct drive wheel and with what i know now i would have just got the CSW V2.5 first and been happy with that.

 

[Eagle Beak]

I've installed Truebrake, and Iggy_82's degressive clutch. My first impressions are outstanding.

The install took way longer than planned, because the pieces for the clutch mod require mounting the pedal to a new surface (they don't fit in the stock pedal housing). But, luckily I had an old crate, some plywood, and a drill lying around. I successfully pulled off my first DIY inverted pedal setup, as well.

Looking forward to writing a full review in the future.

 

[Michael Krone]

I successfully pulled off my first DIY inverted pedal setup, as well.

Pics??

 

[Eagle Beak]

Pics??

I didn't post the image because I'm not really proud of it, but here you go. Its a total kluge-job because I actually wasn't planning nor prepared to do it. But, I was determined to finish the project that night, and once I realized that the degressive clutch wouldn't fit in back into the pedal base, I knew that the only way was to random pieces of wood to screw together. I also realized that I might as well make a degressive base while I was at it.

Its not pretty, but it actually works great.

 

[blekenbleu]

Its not pretty, but it actually works great.

Congrats; for those using VR HMDs, pedal looks do not count at all.
Since your Truebrake mod presumably leaves the original Logitech brake potentiometer unused,
consider removing it now, to avoid wear, for use later as a throttle pot replacement if/when it gets noisy,
if you don't go for a Hall sensor throttle mod.

How pronounced is degressive feel with Iggy_82's clutch?

 

[Michael Krone]

I didn't post the image because I'm not really proud of it, but here you go. Its a total kluge-job because I actually wasn't planning nor prepared to do it. But, I was determined to finish the project that night, and once I realized that the degressive clutch wouldn't fit in back into the pedal base, I knew that the only way was to random pieces of wood to screw together. I also realized that I might as well make a degressive base while I was at it.

Its not pretty, but it actually works great.

View attachment 420766

Looks better than mine... Mine are painted now and look a little more acceptable,.

 

[Eagle Beak]

Congrats; for those using VR HMDs, pedal looks do not count at all.
Since your Truebrake mod presumably leaves the original Logitech brake potentiometer unused,
consider removing it now, to avoid wear, for use later as a throttle pot replacement if/when it gets noisy,
if you don't go for a Hall sensor throttle mod.

How pronounced is degressive feel with Iggy_82's clutch?

I like the degressive clutch so far. It doesn't quite have the pronounced bite point like a real clutch, but it does have a pronounced degressive spring feel. The degressive clutch really just seems to make the feeling more realistic and enjoyable. The only thing it might help in regards to performance is if you already have set your clutch to a smaller band, it is helpful in finding the bite point.

 

[Eagle Beak]

Good idea for the potentiometer. And thanks again for the TrueBrake recommendation. It is a big advantage over the stock Logitech pedal. I know its not a real loadcell, but I think it has to be a far better value, as it works just like a loadcell for 1/3rd the cost.

 

[TedBrosby-]

Dude, you made G29 pedals look sharp. Be proud of it. The best solutions are DIY.
I say keep the pedals as is and focus your attention for now on the wheel.
You can do Arduino + D-sub to convert your pedals to USB.
And if you're feeling brave, there's a DIY direct drive wheel that uses a $400 servo motor and flashes the AASD controller with MMOS firmware (what the original OSW's used to be).

https://www.xsimulator.net/community/threads/450-mige-direct-drive-wheel-using-mmos-and-aasd.14657/

If you buy the board from Thanos, best part about it is that because MMOS supports G25/27/29 pedals/shifter, you don't need to use the USB connection. You can plug the G29 pedals and shifter directly into his board.

 

[blekenbleu]

The only thing it might help in regards to performance is if you already have set your clutch to a smaller band, it is helpful in finding the bite point.

That. Before modification, the G29 clutch just felt distractingly wrong.
Now, feel is no longer distracting, despite bite point feeling less distinct than real clutches.
My non-adjustable hacked metal linkage resulted in a bite point lower than I would have preferred,
but within the range of fresh clutch installations.

it works just like a loadcell for 1/3rd the cost

For DIY makers, 50kg body load cells can be had for about US$7 and combined with e.g. a $5 INA333 instrumentation amplifier
and a couple of resistors to replace the brake potentiometer.