AC Classic DTM @ Donington GP - Wednesday 3rd June 2020

[Medilloni]

Apologies for my absence guys, actually had some work to do!

Just wanted to say huge thanks to all for a couple of great races, I had some great races with many of you in both races - I think many of us had to recover from something, at some point And congrats to the podium guys in both races too!

Thank you @Dennis Manke for such fair racing in the first race, there were a few times you could have gone for the pass but then you timed it perfectly, dammit I was in awe that you were on softs, for the last 5 mins my mediums were red, and gone. Went for hards for the second race... big mistake

@Axel Moebius my apologies for surprising you at the 2nd to last hairpin Axel, you were close behind me when I bogged down in the wrong gear, you did well not to hit me!

Once again, thanks to you all and will have the next event up soon

 

[Locoblade]

Yep the tyre behavior was rather odd, I also ran softs in race 1 and although they weren't actually that quick at any point, they weren't on red at the end and I did my quickest time on the penultimate lap IIRC. The mediums I ran in the second race by comparison seem to give more grip than the softs from the off up to about lap 10-12 but then fell away quickly and went red for the last couple of laps.

 

[Erik Axelsson]

@Medilloni

I just realized I missed the race yesterday. I was 100% sure it was today but I was 100% wrong...
I'm really sorry John, It won't happen again.
I hope you all had a good time and that one of the reserves could take my spot.

 

[Medilloni]

If you will also allow me the opportunity to say that we are not all perfect for a 100% of the time, we all do something silly. ( if only I had a clear mind for a 100% of the time )
It’s separating that from someone who is being plain silly and wreaking someone’s race.
I hit John last night, it really was a mistake, two drivers doing opposites at the wrong time, I did not even want to overtake.
I have quite often spent most of a race trying to overtake one person, I can even remember who they were. ( there is a lot to be admired by clever defending )
I see that as racing, to me just as important as any part of the racing, John and I especially have those situations, John is always usually quicker than me so it the normal situation that I am defending. ( must try and sabotage his computer again )
I can race with John because I trust him 100%, normally I get so nervous with people I don’t know too well, I really am expecting the nose of their car to be put where there is no chance of a pass. So often I get punted off in this situation usually not always they never stop. 50/50 ( controlling nerves is a real problem for me )
Of late I have been looking at the replays from other drivers point of view, helped me realise the whole world is not out to get me. This is by far what happens to all of us all of the time. ( I am glad to say the outcome is rarely intentional)
This is quite a complex situation to define, there are so many variables, but basically I am saying, I agree with Denis, if you cannot get your front wheel level with his rear wheel, without lunging then it is a fair opportunity. I try and look at helicorse which is right in the middle of the screen, checking if I have room. I am not always of the mind set to do that 100% of the time.
It’s getting so that all i am trying to do is look for free space in a race. @Medilloni i am so sorry about the unintentional tap. It probably ruined your race.
That’s what we are talking about, ruining people’s race.
Funnily I also hit Erik with the caterhams last week, after spending what seems like a life time of being caught and overtaken or blue flagged by him I just had to overtake, so I can sort of forgive that one.
I usually am weighing up situations before overtaking, like if I get past can I open a gap, how difficult is a overtake, should I wait for a mistake ( I know how nervous I get ) , how many laps left, what am I going to gain or loose, where is my best place on the circuit for a opportunity, will the driver have an incentive to go faster when I pass.
The last one is knowing the driver, @Denis Betty is one of my Achilles heels for that one , just know if I pass he is quite likely to find a lot more pace than I have once I am by.

Sorry about the waffle too much time on hand at present.

PS.
I have this strange idea that the person in front of me earned his place there in qualifying, that I respect, I rarely try an over take until the race is under way.
Why people appear from the back and overtake half a dozen people before the first corner is beyond me. What do they think is going to happen to all those faster drivers, they are just going to re-overtake.? ( now add to that the fact that a load of cars are about to be done before the first corner )

No worries Ernie, you didn't ruin my race at all buddy (it was someone else), and likewise, it's great to race people you can trust - and there are a great many here!

I really get the nerves thing, I was shocked at my quali time... sat on the grid thinking of a lot of swear words - indeedy, I surprise myself with how little I breathe and how white my knuckles are

Before I forget... I can hardly hear you on TS the last few weeks, not sure if you have a problem with your mike? Missing your dulcet tones 'is all

 

[karan733]

Yeah I really struggled to hear most people on Teamspeak - is there a way to turn the volume up? I was sure I heard my name mentioned but probably for the best I couldnt tell what was being said

 

[GeekyDeaks]

I was in the same situation on my first race with the group. I ended up going into the sound mixer and putting assetto corsa and crew chief to about 20% and ensuring teamspeak was at maximum. This means the chat now completely drowns out the game, but that is perfect for me

 

[Locoblade]

Yep I had to do similar, turned the master game volume down from the Audio app (when sitting in the pits) so I could turn up Windows volume and hear TS

 

[RasmusP]

That's because TeamSpeak is using raw voice recordings. Due to the dynamic range of our voices, even when we talk very evenly and stick to thr position in front of the microphone, we'll never be as loud as edited and mastered audio.
The simple solution is to ramp up the microphone level into clipping but it sounds like crap and I hate when people do it...

So you have to lower everything else like the others mentioned. Sadly this also means getting your ears pierced if some sets his mic level to full on clipping. Luckily barely happens on rd

Ps: I wonder why nobody is bothered by this.. Wouldn't be too difficult to implement a simple compressor, eq and maximizer into standard windows sound drivers...

 

[Medilloni]

.......Ps: I wonder why nobody is bothered by this.. Wouldn't be too difficult to implement a simple compressor, eq and maximizer into standard windows sound drivers...

Exactly. that's what I thought Rasmus

...on a serious note, really appreciate your input here buddy, wish you could race with us more often too

 

[GEO147]

@Denis Betty That incident in turn 1 really annoyed me, so I just reviewed it in the replay. It looks like a bit of a chain reaction type if thing, but either way I believe that the driver who hit us could have been more cautious, and certainly should have waited.

@GEO147 The incident in race 1 where I ran into you when you were rejoining at turn 4 I can only put down to understeer under heavy breaking. When I initially saw you were off the road I figured you'd wait for me to pass, but in fairness to you the gap was quite large between me and the car in front, so when I realised you were getting closer to the track I tried to brake even heavier while still trying to make the corner and I bloody under-steered straight into you, so I'm very sorry. Maybe I should have been more cautious but I was still frustrated by the turn 1 incident.

Regarding the incident in Race 2 at the same corner, after a good and clean start I was tapped in the rear while breaking for the turn and the inevitable happened, so although I don't consider that one totally my fault, I am indeed sorry. I believe that the driver who tapped me should also have waited in this case too.

It's so frustrating that coming here to learn and improve that I end up basically lapping on my own each time following silly, avoidable incidents. I am much faster when racing with the group than when just circulating on my own, and barring those bloody hairpins I can keep up with most of the guys (in the midfield at least). I enjoy a close battle on track but I always try to keep it as clean as possible, and if someone is clearly faster I will let them through and try to watch and learn from them.

I enjoyed driving the Alfa, but I don't think I ever drove it in a way to maximize the 4WD aspect and I suffered heavily at those bloody hairpins!

No bother Joey. In race one I was right behind Ernie. I think the guy in front of him slammed on for whatever reason and so did I but I put it off track in an effort to avoid taking Ernie out. Then I was watching my mirrors and waiting. Several cars passed and I saw you coming down the hill and decided I'd just get her going on the grass ready to rejoin after you passed. And bam lol. It was more funny than anything and as I said at the time just unlucky. You couldn't have rear ended me there on purpose of you tried. So no problem pal.
The other incident I was more annoyed with but if you were pushed into me not your fault either. So again no worries.

I have to say in general though the last few mid week races have become a bit of a free for all. Some of us are cautious and do out best not to ruin others races at our own expense and loose places and time over it. Others are gung ho foot to the floor with no consideration.

The main thing I see is people all over the track. Swerving from one side to the other. Trying to take hotlap lines in traffic.

It's just not feesablie in a mid pack race and will continue to cause accidents.

I'm at a point now where it's pretty much if you don't get into the top 5 cars then it's very likely you will be taken out in lap one. Ok for the really quick guys and those with loads of time to practice but not so for the majority.

Denis is right and the ban hammer will have to be swung more often.

 

[Denis Betty]

Some of us are cautious and do out best not to ruin others races at our own expense and loose places and time over it. Others are gung ho foot to the floor with no consideration.

Exactly this. We have a big talk about taking it easy a turn 1. So you're kinda holding station and sticking to your line (my buddy Rupe Wilson called this staying in a lane), you almost have to queue for T1 because of the concertina effect, and every time, some joker squeezes between two cars to gain a couple places. OK it's racing, and in RL racing maybe it's ok. But we just had an instruction not to do anything dangerous in T1 and to take it easy.

Again, some people understand that it's club racing and you don't have to grab any chance to overtake, regardless of the risk, as if your life depends on it.... and some people don't really belong in our clubs.

 

[Medilloni]

......Denis is right and the ban hammer will have to be swung more often.

For the one causing mayhem in this race, the ban hammer was swung George - not something I liked doing at all, but for the small number of people that ruin it for the considerate majority I hope it serves as notice.

 

[Kek700]

It is difficult to be too critical, looked at the replay today for fun, jumped into different cars out of interest.
Axel was about to do a overtake on me, I was in his car ( not literally of course ), all went wrong, immediately he hit the brakes and avoided hitting me up my posterior.
My point, when you have high skill levels, they have in hand some spare thought processes, they have just a bit more clear thinking time.
It is hard to be too critical of some who have a lot to learn to act the same, it will come with time and practice.
That's why I always talk about close racing with john, looked at many replays, he always instinctively knows when and what to do in virtually all close racing circumstances. I say that because when I look at replays of my incidences with some other drivers were I have been punted, I can see they just did not get the obvious of what not to do and when to and when not too, I can almost see their brain disengaging and blindly going for something that was just not on, then almost not have the time left in their minds to react. I sort of know it was avoidable, but not to them at that moment in time. that is why I rarely get upset with being hit, unless it starts to become bleeding obvious.

 

[RasmusP]

It is difficult to be too critical, looked at the replay today for fun, jumped into different cars out of interest.
Axel was about to do a overtake on me, I was in his car ( not literally of course ), all went wrong, immediately he hit the brakes and avoided hitting me up my posterior.
My point, when you have high skill levels, they have in hand some spare thought processes, they have just a bit more clear thinking time.
It is hard to be too critical of some who have a lot to learn to act the same, it will come with time and practice.
That's why I always talk about close racing with john, looked at many replays, he always instinctively knows when and what to do in virtually all close racing circumstances. I say that because when I look at replays of my incidences with some other drivers were I have been punted, I can see they just did not get the obvious of what not to do and when to and when not too, I can almost see their brain disengaging and blindly going for something that was just not on, then almost not have the time left in their minds to react. I sort of know it was avoidable, but not to them at that moment in time. that is why I rarely get upset with being hit, unless it starts to become bleeding obvious.

Very true words my friend!

About this: whenever I was part of an incident. Being at fault or not, I watch it via the f7 free cam a few times. From my perspective, from heki view, the other driver's onboard.
Then there are the following paths of thoughts:
1. What did I do wrong (and what would've been correct)

2. What did the other driver do wrong (and would would've been correct so I can learn from his mistake for myself)

3. How could I have avoided the incident although the other driver did something wrong

With this mentality and doing it for every incident, every race, I now am a very clean racer that is also able to fight hard and sometimes a bit cheeky.

Most incidents could be avoided if the driver that has the "thinking time to spare" gives clear signals to the driver who might be totally overwhelmed by everything that's going on.

It's easy to blame someone if he crashes into you. But maybe instead of blaming someone after every bloody race, it would be a nicer overall experience if you'd adjust yourself to avoid the incidents.

For example if I go side by side in the inside on a straight and I'll have the inside for the next corner, I always squeeze the guy on the outside right up to the outside kerb.

Not because I want to have more space or because it's faster for me.
It simply completely minimizes the risk of clashing into each other at the turn in point because the other driver sees you in the side mirror, maybe sees your nose in his screen, helicorsa will be bright and clear and even if he turns into you, the impact will only be a light touch, side against side.

If I stay at the inside, you will only be "somewhere far away" and then boom, contact at the apex.

Same for defending on a straight. You decide for one side and before the overtake you do the block. Clear signal, moving across the track and blocking the line.
No slow crawling from one side to the other and then oops, his nose was already at your rear and you spin

 

[Kek700]

Well put @RasmusP was going to do a follow up, but you have saved me and everyone else from that.

Just out of interest I must apologise to @stribbeck . looking at the replay, I came across to set myself up for the next bend we collided and he shot off the circuit, I was so overloaded by the corner and from 4 or five cars around me did not have a clue about what happened until viewing the replay. luckily Simon took as a racing incident, he could have had just cause to have a go at me. QED

 

[stribbeck]

Well put @RasmusP was going to do a follow up, but you have saved me and everyone else from that.

Just out of interest I must apologise to @stribbeck . looking at the replay, I came across to set myself up for the next bend we collided and he shot off the circuit, I was so overloaded by the corner and from 4 or five cars around me did not have a clue about what happened until viewing the replay. luckily Simon took as a racing incident, he could have had just cause to have a go at me. QED

No worries there was alot of cars in one bend and its hard to know where everyone is was just a racing incident imo, had a cracking race anyway

 

[Medilloni]

nothing here

It is difficult to be too critical, looked at the replay today for fun, jumped into different cars out of interest.
Axel was about to do a overtake on me, I was in his car ( not literally of course ), all went wrong, immediately he hit the brakes and avoided hitting me up my posterior.
My point, when you have high skill levels, they have in hand some spare thought processes, they have just a bit more clear thinking time.
It is hard to be too critical of some who have a lot to learn to act the same, it will come with time and practice.
That's why I always talk about close racing with john, looked at many replays, he always instinctively knows when and what to do in virtually all close racing circumstances. I say that because when I look at replays of my incidences with some other drivers were I have been punted, I can see they just did not get the obvious of what not to do and when to and when not too, I can almost see their brain disengaging and blindly going for something that was just not on, then almost not have the time left in their minds to react. I sort of know it was avoidable, but not to them at that moment in time. that is why I rarely get upset with being hit, unless it starts to become bleeding obvious.

I think we know each other too well Ernie

...and I'm guessing the 'art', the wheel to wheel stuff is where we get our kicks, a damn good 'n fair dice anywhere in the field is super-enjoyable for me, but then I'm not a young bull and will take any cow good result I can get.

The anticipation, working out potential moves/chess game that could take a lap or two to execute, imo is the most satisfying, as opposed to; 'there's a gap, I'm going for it', where actually they'll often (both) lose a chunk of time gathering it all together scrabbling over an apex or running wide (re your bit in bold above). Or even worse, someone who is so intent on blocking 'n weaving, you both lose seconds per lap, then that person has to deal with other cars that have caught up into the battle I guess there's a few camps in this, those that defend whatever the cost, those that choose to lose the least momentum... and the inbetweenies. Depending on the stage of the race, I'm one of the last two Obviously, I'm talking as an earthling, not an alien that can fight hammer and tongs throughout!

With @Dennis Manke behind me in the first race, my tyres were shot, and before Dennis was on my derrier I'd made the decision to not fight (I couldn't any longer), 'cos Aki was closing at a second per lap - I mean, I wasn't fighting for 1st, I was fighting not to be 3rd, if that makes sense!

 

[HF2000]

nothing here

I think we know each other too well Ernie

...and I'm guessing the 'art', the wheel to wheel stuff is where we get our kicks, a damn good 'n fair dice anywhere in the field is super-enjoyable for me, but then I'm not a young bull and will take any cow good result I can get.

The anticipation, working out potential moves/chess game that could take a lap or two to execute, imo is the most satisfying, as opposed to; 'there's a gap, I'm going for it', where actually they'll often (both) lose a chunk of time gathering it all together scrabbling over an apex or running wide (re your bit in bold above). Or even worse, someone who is so intent on blocking 'n weaving, you both lose seconds per lap, then that person has to deal with other cars that have caught up into the battle I guess there's a few camps in this, those that defend whatever the cost, those that choose to lose the least momentum... and the inbetweenies. Depending on the stage of the race, I'm one of the last two Obviously, I'm talking as an earthling, not an alien that can fight hammer and tongs throughout!

With @Dennis Manke behind me in the first race, my tyres were shot, and before Dennis was on my derrier I'd made the decision to not fight (I couldn't any longer), 'cos Aki was closing at a second per lap - I mean, I wasn't fighting for 1st, I was fighting not to be 3rd, if that makes sense!

Although I'm a relatively new simracer, I think these are very wise words. Thanks for sharing, John.

 

[Dennis Manke]

Apologies for my absence guys, actually had some work to do!

Just wanted to say huge thanks to all for a couple of great races, I had some great races with many of you in both races - I think many of us had to recover from something, at some point And congrats to the podium guys in both races too!

Thank you @Dennis Manke for such fair racing in the first race, there were a few times you could have gone for the pass but then you timed it perfectly, dammit I was in awe that you were on softs, for the last 5 mins my mediums were red, and gone. Went for hards for the second race... big mistake

@Axel Moebius my apologies for surprising you at the 2nd to last hairpin Axel, you were close behind me when I bogged down in the wrong gear, you did well not to hit me!

Once again, thanks to you all and will have the next event up soon

Thanks mate, That was Racing. I had so much fun in both races that was amazing. I love these cars. I hope for more Races like that with the old DTM cars. Maybe next Time the Nordschleife ?

 

[stribbeck]

Old btcc cars would be cool not seen a mod for them tho