Tracks Okayama [W.I.P] scratch made

[LilSki]

Funny how they don't seem to care about this
http://www.racedepartment.com/downloads/okayama-1994.2519/

If you never contacted them in the first place wanting to make money then I am sure it would have never been an issue as it would have never been on their radar.

I am not saying it would make it legal but they would have likely never have known about it. Just as was said on the assettocorsamods.net forum you pretty much shot yourself in the foot.

 

[LilSki]

Yes but if you are making money, they will be much more interested. Mitja offering them a cut of his profits for selling *their* track was not a smart move.

It comes down to money, as always. Low-key tracks would be far less concerned and may see it as some free publicity. For example LFS allows their Blackwood track to be copied for other sims. NJMP probably using their sim version for publicity too. NJMP may not have been too pleased if they were offered a cut of download profits!

Okayama International Circuit is owned by a multinational corporation and will not like amateur versions of their circuit appearing on popular sims potentially damaging the reputation of the circuit and therefore potential ticket sales, etc.

NJMP was only OK with it as long as I was not charging for it. They were OK with voluntary donations. They actually asked if I was going to build the other track too as that is their main track not Lightning.

Funny thing is after it was released I got a call from their advertising department looking for ways to promote the track through my virtual version. So it all depends on who you are dealing with. I know for a fact a few people have since gone to a track day at NJMP because of my virtual version. And people that run there all the time are now able to practice at home between visits and in the off season.

I think overall they were happy someone built the track and were happy for the free advertising. But again they obviously have a different view than the people of Okayama.

 

[BenCollins]

NJMP was only OK with it as long as I was not charging for it. They were OK with voluntary donations. They actually asked if I was going to build the other track too as that is their main track not Lightning.

Funny thing is after it was released I got a call from their advertising department looking for ways to promote the track through my virtual version. So it all depends on who you are dealing with. I know for a fact a few people have since gone to a track day at NJMP because of my virtual version. And people that run there all the time are now able to practice at home between visits and in the off season.

Yes, that makes perfect sense, so beneficial to them. I also recall there was another newly-built track in Pittsburgh, PIRC, where the owners had also shown a great interest in the mod of it's recreation in AC. It's a cracking track too, I don't know if it was ever finished.

 

[schnipp]

@LilSki
Sounds a bit like what happened with Bilster Berg, the track owners made an exclusive deal with the modder.
Sadly for the community it meant that the mod isn't available any more, but it is used for simulation purposes at the track itself.

Though I can understand why the modder accepted this deal.

 

[A3DR]

All this legal mumbo-jumbo makes you want to give a f*ck about making mods.

(Lucky for me and you guys, I don't give a f*ck about all this )

 

[LilSki]

@LilSki
Sounds a bit like what happened with Bilster Berg, the track owners made an exclusive deal with the modder.
Sadly for the community it meant that the mod isn't available any more, but it is used for simulation purposes at the track itself.

Though I can understand why the modder accepted this deal.

Bilster Berg is a slightly different situation. They hired a 'modder' to build the track for them. The 'modder' found Fat-Alfie's version and sold it as his own. The track owners found about Alfie's version and thought he was stealing from them. What turned out was the other way around and Alfie's work is what was being stolen. The owners then did the right thing and offered money to Alfie but in that deal was it had to be exclusive.

So track owners do often commission to have their tracks built. But then it is usually for private use.

 

[Epistolarius]

Oh boy, okay that changes things drastically. Once you want to make money from the mod that's obviously a whole different story and now I understand why you got their attention in the first place. Only two things I have to note - hopefully you made absolutely sure that you made contact with the track owner/management, not someone else. Considering you deal with a language barrier and hard to get by contacts that's very important. And 5000 Euro is very suspiciously low - not that I have any experience with licensing but it feels that way considering how hard/costly it supposedly is for Kunos to get Japanese licenses, and especially when they say they only license to businesses. But yeah, beyond that they're totally in their right here about licensing for commercial purposes.

 

[BenCollins]

And 5000 Euro is very suspiciously low - not that I have any experience with licensing but it feels that way considering how hard/costly it supposedly is for Kunos to get Japanese licenses, and especially when they say they only license to businesses. But yeah, beyond that they're totally in their right here about licensing for commercial purposes.

I suspect that was a suggested figure to scare him away from getting involved. A real licence, I would think, would be more like a royalty figure based on sales and moving from title to title, year to year. It would be very unlikely to be a flat one-off payment in my opinion.

I suspect if he agreed, a full contract would have been drawn up including royalties, etc.

 

[BenCollins]

All this legal mumbo-jumbo makes you want to give a f*ck about making mods.

(Lucky for me and you guys, I don't give a f*ck about all this )

Although they are very boring, the legal terms are usually morally right.

Let's say if you had spent hundreds of thousands to built a motor racing circuit, for example Rockingham in the UK, built in 1999. You would be delighted to see it in a sim like LFS. If they asked you, could they model it, scan it, develop it and sell it, with a proportion to you. Win-win.

If a modder made a free version, you would think mmmm, how good is it? It's great? Let's use it to promote the circuit. If it's awful, maybe you would block it. There are choices here.

If a modder made a version, start selling it for $x a download, and offered you a cut of their earnings, you would be angry.

 

[Mitja Bonca]

Something to make us feel batter

 

[mantasisg]

Think of bright side, you had great time making it, and definitelly improved yours skills


This is weird situation, definitelly not the best example of negotiation. However, 5000Euros really does seem low price, maybe they scalled it down understndably that it is a mod of one person. 5K is still much for one guy, and very unlikely to come back. Even if track would be made up to the official, or Miseluk, Thomson Road, or Riverside quality level

Miseluk 1.0 is being sold by @Lemax, and I wonder how it is going, it might be best addon track for AC, in my opinion.

 

[Mitja Bonca]

Think of bright side, you had great time making it, and definitelly improved yours skills


This is weird situation, definitelly not the best example of negotiation. However, 5000Euros really does seem low price, maybe they scalled it down understndably that it is a mod of one person. 5K is still much for one guy, and very unlikely to come back. Even if track would be made up to the official, or Miseluk, Thomson Road, or Riverside quality level

Miseluk 1.0 is being sold by @Lemax, and I wonder how it is going, it might be best addon track for AC, in my opinion.

Who said I am mad? Some ppl here think so, but I am not really. I have definitely improved my skills and knowledge about 3d modeling and I will surely continue on. Thinking what would be the next project?
And idea maybe? Some not so know and not F1 track?! And optional, that there won`t be such a bitch about licensing

 

[schnipp]

Miseluk 1.0 is being sold by @Lemax, and I wonder how it is going, it might be best addon track for AC, in my opinion.

Since Miseluk is public roads closed for a racing event there probably isn't a license holder there other than the city itself maybe.
I don't know if they could prohibit lemax from selling it, but I doubt that they would.

 

[aphidgod]

You seem disappointed (and rightly so) but not mad, IMO...

Shame about this. It's an unlikely thing in the mod scene but not unheard of. I wonder if you called their bluff and agreed to $5k in licensing fees if they'd honor that.

It's simple enough to register yourself as a LLC in the US to make yourself a "company," but I don't know your local regs. Unless they're only interested in doing business with "OEM" software publishers and not a 3rd party content creator. (But in that case why even offer you the 5k number?)

Anyway... I love your work and I hope you start up something new. I'll look forward to it.

 

[Gevatter]

Thinking what would be the next project? And idea maybe? Some not so know and not F1 track?! And optional, that there won`t be such a bitch about licensing

I'm still looking for well done versions of Mid-Ohio and the Norisring

 

[Warsaw]

Who said I am mad? Some ppl here think so, but I am not really. I have definitely improved my skills and knowledge about 3d modeling and I will surely continue on. Thinking what would be the next project?
And idea maybe? Some not so know and not F1 track?! And optional, that there won`t be such a bitch about licensing

Thats good Mitja!
Thanks for whole work, i would surely donate you for a good okayama.

What you think about a version of the Eurospeedway Lausitz?

Road and Speedway?
I think it would be nice to have an european Oval.

 

[aphidgod]

If you want to stick with a Japanese track, Fuji is open again as Malagoli's version is dead now, no?

 

[Thiago Moya]

Assen would be great too

 

[Uff]

What about Magny Cours? Too bad Okayama is gone, I was waiting for this track a lot.

 

[mantasisg]

http://fastestlaps.com/tracks So many tracks.... and if we would add historics, which are not used anymore.... many choices haha

I like Dijon layout, aka French Fuji