@Paul Jeffrey Can this thread be closed and the only person to be able to post in this is @SalamanderSoldier to keep us updated? So people, except @SalamanderSoldier, can still read but not post?
F1 2017 How did a F2002 mod from AC end up in F1 2017???
- Thread starter SalamanderSoldier
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- assetto corsa f12017 f2002
F1 2017 The Game (Codemasters)
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My impression is that the guy who stole the model is now posting on this thread making up stuff to save his a**, I hope Codemasters have higher moral standards than this guy. Ban him from working for Codemasters again and start working with the guy who created this beautiful mod instead.
So I guess the only one that knows how ip works it´s you, because Gergo Panker (game developer), thought otherwise in the previous posts, among with other people. But we all are wrong and, of course, making a free mod is worse ethically than aproppiating of that car and making money out of it because you don´t own a licence of Ferrari... ._.
This model is the same too no ?
https://www.turbosquid.com/3d-models/max-f2002-schumacher-barrichello/1073183
https://www.turbosquid.com/3d-models/max-f2002-schumacher-barrichello/1073183
Yes, he already mentioned about that.
see the post #28
Gergo Panker
pankykapus
Please do everyone a favour and go away. All reasoning seems to have failed with you. You can still make a great president though.
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Thought so too but time zones of the posts don't match up to UK day time hours. I haven't read through all the posts here but I'm guessing said poster is east Aussie or NZ. Most likely NZ. Their's a lot of salty New Zealanders.
lol at the codemasters employ posting
furiously here
stop embarrassing your self, no amount of posts can save your pathetic company practices.
furiously here
stop embarrassing your self, no amount of posts can save your pathetic company practices.
I read all the replies... Damn!
Then it's true that the modding community is a big cancer.
The points here are these:
-The freelance artist couldn't use the model made by OP, that's clear. And he couldn't send it to Codemasters. That's clear too.
BUT.
-Also OP could not use any, and I mean any, design, logos etc. of the Ferrari F2002. They are property of Ferrari S.P.A. (or the respective owners when talking about sponsors)
I think that the bigger issue before resolving the matter with the freelance artist that stole the model, is to accept that the modding community works in a GRAY zone of the law. Almost a black zone, to be honest.
I don't mind if OP created the mod. No, I'm happy because is the best mod out there for Assetto Corsa. Even if I worked for Ferrari I wouldn't mind, because it's out for free. That's why the modding community always worked fine, 'cause the owners of the copyright (car companies) never cared to much about it.
BUT, when you sell the models you made for the mods, you're risking. A lot. Because nothing could stop Ferrari (or any other car company) to take down that model and bring you in front of a court of justice.
So, my advice is: "BE CAREFUL".
I'll also advice anyone to quickly download the latest version of the mod, because if things goes out of hands, the consequences could be bad. Try to work this out with the singular person that stole your model, and try to not bring Codemasters on the matter. Because then the way for the news to reach Ferrari or FOM would be quite short and dangerous.
In conclusion: The soon we accept that we are in a gray zone, the better. And remember: when you are in a gray zone, it becames hard to protect your rights. Very hard.
Then it's true that the modding community is a big cancer.
The points here are these:
-The freelance artist couldn't use the model made by OP, that's clear. And he couldn't send it to Codemasters. That's clear too.
BUT.
-Also OP could not use any, and I mean any, design, logos etc. of the Ferrari F2002. They are property of Ferrari S.P.A. (or the respective owners when talking about sponsors)
I think that the bigger issue before resolving the matter with the freelance artist that stole the model, is to accept that the modding community works in a GRAY zone of the law. Almost a black zone, to be honest.
I don't mind if OP created the mod. No, I'm happy because is the best mod out there for Assetto Corsa. Even if I worked for Ferrari I wouldn't mind, because it's out for free. That's why the modding community always worked fine, 'cause the owners of the copyright (car companies) never cared to much about it.
BUT, when you sell the models you made for the mods, you're risking. A lot. Because nothing could stop Ferrari (or any other car company) to take down that model and bring you in front of a court of justice.
So, my advice is: "BE CAREFUL".
I'll also advice anyone to quickly download the latest version of the mod, because if things goes out of hands, the consequences could be bad. Try to work this out with the singular person that stole your model, and try to not bring Codemasters on the matter. Because then the way for the news to reach Ferrari or FOM would be quite short and dangerous.
In conclusion: The soon we accept that we are in a gray zone, the better. And remember: when you are in a gray zone, it becames hard to protect your rights. Very hard.
Was interested into what Matt Jones actually has to say about F1 2017 and it sounds like from this quote I on Red Bull's site that time pressure and inability to curate accurate mesh data led to the laziness that we're seeing here. I'd be checking the rest of the classic cars because chance's are that if they found an "accurate reference from other sources" of another free classic online, they may have used it too?
"Were there any design details that were particularly difficult to implement?
When the designers said “we’re reintroducing classic cars” my initial reaction was a cheer! But at the same time we also knew that we needed to build them in addition to all of the 2017 cars, so that was a significant challenge. Most of the classic cars predated CAD data and, with the detail required in F1 2017, we needed to gather accurate reference from other sources. To solve this issue we used 3D scanners for the first time. This was new ground for us and a steep learning curve, but ultimately invaluable in recreating the cars accurately, and a great opportunity to meet them in the flesh – or is that composite material?" https://www.redbull.com/au-en/f1-2017-update-interview
"Were there any design details that were particularly difficult to implement?
When the designers said “we’re reintroducing classic cars” my initial reaction was a cheer! But at the same time we also knew that we needed to build them in addition to all of the 2017 cars, so that was a significant challenge. Most of the classic cars predated CAD data and, with the detail required in F1 2017, we needed to gather accurate reference from other sources. To solve this issue we used 3D scanners for the first time. This was new ground for us and a steep learning curve, but ultimately invaluable in recreating the cars accurately, and a great opportunity to meet them in the flesh – or is that composite material?" https://www.redbull.com/au-en/f1-2017-update-interview
Codemasters has a lot more to lose than this guy if it goes viral. Worst thing that can happen to the guy is Ferrari telling him to remove the files (you are delusional if you think that Ferrari will go to court when there are 100000000 things on the Internet using Ferrari ip), but Codemasters public image can be heavily damaged for bad practices.
Its a gray area, because you, the purchaser, agree on using the model in the terms Turbosquid set up
https://blog.turbosquid.com/royalty-free-license/#Editorial-Usage-tip
- Products may not be used on any item/product for re-sale, such as a video game or t-shirt.
- Products may not be used as part of billboard, trade show or exhibit display.
- Products may not be used in any defamatory, libelous or otherwise unlawful manner whether directly or in context or juxtaposition with specific subject matter.
- The material may not be incorporated into a logo, trademark or service mark. For example, you can’t use Editorial content to create a logo design.
- The material may not be used for any commercial, non-news related purpose.
Ofc once you have the model files neither Turbosquid nor the original modeller can really control what you do with it. Even if Codemaster now would got through with that "deal", buying the model on Turbosquid, they would void the terms by retrospectively buying the model for commercial usage, even if they have the FOM and Ferrari licence.
OK...I understood that purchasers need to be careful about usage of those 3d Models.
but what about sellers. they don't need to worry about copyright(patent?) issue even if they're selling 3D models of Ferrari F1 machines?
Sorry if I'm asking a dumb question but, I'm not familiar with this type of topic...
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Sorry, but I don't think that Codemasters has nothing to lose. In the end, they didn't even know that the model was stolen in the first place. That's why I'm suggesting OP to solve this matter with the person responsible for the thief. Codemasters could then symply fire him and replace the model with a Patch. But we will never know if that happens.
EDIT: If Ferrari asks him to remore the model, we will have to say bye bye to the mod too... And I would be really sad if that happens.
Well 1 positive thing to reflect upon , if you are a 3D artist and AAA companies are stealing your work I would not really see it as a bad thing , yes the guy was selling it on turbosquid that is most likely where they bought it , but if you are a 3D artist and you have never actually used 3D as reference at some point something is wrong somewhere everyone does it somewhere its the best blueprint , but what codemasters did is basically just use the entire model , they probably looked at it and thought you know what I could waste weeks of time here and in the end still wouldnt be as nice as it is now lets just import it and hope no one notices
Ghoults
Lasse Luisu
If codemasters is planning to fix this then they also need to go back and and check probably every other model (not just cars!) that this contractor has made for them. Because if there is one rip then it is not impossible that there are others. Maybe other game companies need to check this as well if this person has created contract work for them. In worst case there are several and this ferrari is just the tip of the ice berg. Codemasters also need to take a hard look at how they verify the originality of the models they are buying. Stealing someone else's work is just really bad.
Apparently its the lead internal codemasters artist who made the content ,
there is no right and wrong here ,
Yes codemasters have the license from FOM to create official 2017 cars do they get official data from all the teams to create these 2017 cars for example ?
maybe they do maybe they do not maybe they get basic 2d reference drawings maybe they get 3d cad data but I do not think the level of the quality is anyway near the Kunos F1 2017 in which is the nicest open seat race car ever produced in my opinion the quality is just impeccable .
but back to what I was saying there is a big assumption that all these games get official resources , when in reality they get hardly anything at all , specially for older cars there is simply no resources ,
go look on Ferrari official website the older cars they have not even got nice reference themselves going back to even 2000 era ,
so if Ferrari have not got insane data to even show the public then going even further back in time your even more limited ,
every single games company use 3d reference if possible if its accurate , they also use photomatching techniques to make sure the cars are accurate everyone does this ,
codemasters have done nothing wrong here at all doing things this way , its standard practice to do things using these techniques ,
the only thing that is wrong here instead of simply using the model as reference as the guy as an exceptional eye for the details , instead of using it as a base to get the shape ect ,
they used and imported the complete car which been honest is pretty outrageous to say the least ,
someone somewhere must have thought it to be a good idea maybe they have done this quite a few times in the past who knows ,
they took a model they got as reference and simply just added it to a game and promoted it as been internally built and not compensated the guy for doing so ,
this is the only thing thats happened all this talk about using cars for reference from online or anywhere else for that matter is simply nonsense its standard practice as I say .
How so?
Right above the list you noted on editorial usage is the following statement from the Turbosquid terms:
"However, in certain very limited instances, you may otherwise have the rights to IP in content that is labeled Editorial. For instance, you may be the advertising agency for a brand/IP owner or you may be the brand/IP owner itself purchasing content. If that is the case, you may use the Editorial content commercially, assuming you have the rights clearance through other means."
This sounds like the exact situation we have here with Codemasters having licensing rights to the IP, minus the fact they have yet to purchase the asset.
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