Cars Fordmans Revival

[Shaun Clarke]

Not sure what you are on about?
Ferrari licensed out their brand to both Kunos and SMS, both can use Ferrari models... modders don't have a license so really should not be making any mod cars that tread on eithers toes, regardless of using their actual models or scratch made....fact...
Ford own the Ford brand logo which is on the transit mod, Garry has no license agreement with Ford to use that logo.
All modders are in a grey area, but yes some push that envelope further.
Garry's issue is purely down to his massive ego though...

Woo Woo woo calm down please, and let me explain something here, as I was in direct contact with Ginetta. They not only liked what I did (as somebody kindly told them about it, didn't come from me) they loved everything about it, and said basically, fill your boots, because I was not selling / making a profit from it, and for a UK Manufacturer its free advertisement.

When you sell it, then it becomes a license issue and yes, they can ask you to pull the plug, but for free content, there is really not much they can do, as it's classed as a hobby. Now if you go running around all the sims in the world, ripping their content and posting it as your own, yes, then this is a serious no no (which I haven't done)

So modders can do / create and post what they like, they just cannot sell it without a license. Why do you think so many modding groups, post mods for sale but have changed the name of the car, but we are no fouls, we know what they look like

Shaun

 

[apex11]

I'll leave you all to it, Jesus its like schizophrenia this community. I was sticking up for you...

I have 580 mods on AC......... i am on the modders side, hence why i stuck up for you.... my issue was with Garry 'the ego'.
Garry can mod for sure but sadly they are always stupid, IMO, mods like a bloody van....wish he'd do some racing cars FFS...

 

[Peter Kerényi]

Some people look at modding more as art, some people look at modding more as a mean of creating/getting more content.

I am a part of the latter "group". As far as the quality is there the mod stays installed. Unfortunately most conversions and the majority of scratch mods don't make it. However I think I see the point members of the first group make.

We need to look at things from different perspectives. And respect the opinions of others, however alien they might be to us.

I am a car enthusiast and sim racer who wants quality content. Period. Reasonable? I think yes. The artists know how much work is in those models and feel for the creators who's work is being used without permission. Reasonable? I think yes.

Shaun, good luck with your project, I will try it wherever it will be released and whatever origin it has.

 

[Shaun Clarke]

I'll leave you all to it, Jesus its like schizophrenia this community. I was sticking up for you...

I have 580 mods on AC......... i am on the modders side, hence why i stuck up for you.... my issue was with Garry 'the ego'.
Garry can mod for sure but sadly they are always stupid, IMO, mods like a bloody van....wish he'd do some racing cars FFS...

Don't get me wrong, I know what you was doing, I was just trying to explain the license thing, that's all

 

[garyjpaterson]

i am on the modders side

Lol so am I...
I'm on the side of those who put the effort in, I'm on the side of those who spend months working hard creating content instead of taking the easy route and just stealing it.

If you want to support stealing, awesome. But don't do it here. RD is one of the few places that make clear that they don't support that, but there are plenty of other outlets that do. By all means go and fill your boots there.

Garry can mod for sure but sadly they are always stupid, IMO, mods like a bloody van....wish he'd do some racing cars FFS...

Formula Student car, designed to go round a specific type of circuit as fast as possible? Sounds like a racing car to me. Racing Lawn Mower, hint is in the name
But seriously I've done racing cars, few for RSS. Plus got another 2 on the way coming... i don't know when actually. One finished, another in progress. Non of which would be possible without those "stupid" mods...

 

[Gevatter]

Garry can mod for sure but sadly they are always stupid, IMO, mods like a bloody van....wish he'd do some racing cars FFS...

Yeah Gary, do a race car for once, maybe a Ferrari?

 

[Shaun Clarke]

Some people look at modding more as art, some people look at modding more as a mean of creating/getting more content.

I am a part of the latter "group". As far as the quality is there the mod stays installed. Unfortunately most conversions and the majority of scratch mods don't make it. However I think I see the point members of the first group make.

We need to look at things from different perspectives. And respect the opinions of others, however alien they might be to us.

I am a car enthusiast and sim racer who wants quality content. Period. Reasonable? I think yes. The artists know how much work is in those models and feel for the creators who's work is being used without permission. Reasonable? I think yes.

Shaun, good luck with your project, I will try it wherever it will be released and whatever origin it has.

I am also the latter group, but this is because there really isn't much support for the racing that I find interesting, the lower levels as I see it, UK Grass routes racing, but thank you for your honest and true words.

Shaun

 

[Shaun Clarke]

What I fail to understand is that, yes I have said from day 1 where the shell came from, no regrets, but I was honest and up front, so why all the negativity, as I haven't released it on here and will not just showed you pictures, that's all I done.

I get it, no showing of anything you have worked on if it is not scratch made, and I mean scratch made from the first triangle...

I always thought RD was a place that you can talk about openly and freely, just as long as you didn't release anything that you stated was yours, but guess I was wrong

 

[Johnr777]

Shaun, I think it was how you presented that post... maybe unintentionally came across as you plagiarizing someone else’s work. People do get a bit tense here but it’s one of the reasons this place hasn’t turned into a Forza flea market lol

As it was said a few posts earlier, time to move on peeps

 

[Shaun Clarke]

Shaun, I think it was how you presented that post... maybe unintentionally came across as you plagiarizing someone else’s work. People do get a bit tense here but it’s one of the reasons this place hasn’t turned into a Forza flea market lol

As it was said a few posts earlier, time to move on peeps

Arr ok, understood, never intended it that way as I am not that type of person, so I will apologise.

Shaun

 

[Porsche962C]

Is there any improvment to the Ginnetta's physics in PC1 compared to PC2? I find the cars natually very over sterry for some reason. Can't recover some cars as easily as AC.

 

[garyjpaterson]

Shaun, its nothing personal. I just enjoy the fact RD keeps its modding sections free from ripped content, allowing quality scratch made content to shine.

I don't want to equate what you are doing with the hundreds of Forza rips out there, as there really is no comparison in terms of work put in.
But once you start allowing WIP updates on ripped content, suddenly the lines become very blurred, and at that point I see nothing stopping folks coming from FB to advertise their tat.

What RD has now is a very clear stance on stolen assets. And imo it just makes sense to stick to it regardless of whether you plan on releasing it here, as it keeps things nice and simple for everyone involved.
That way you don't have people having to scroll back 20 pages to work out whether this excellent model they are seeing is eligible for release according to RD's ToS.

 

[Shaun Clarke]

Is there any improvment to the Ginnetta's physics in PC1 compared to PC2? I find the cars natually very over sterry for some reason. Can't recover some cars as easily as AC.

Now for me, you are opening a can of worms, but from my personal opinion I will give you my feedback on this, as I have had the luxury and my own hard work with working with Ginetta teams, GT4, Supercup and Junior.

For this car and this car only, PC1 and PC2 are way off, way way off with everything, handling, physics, gearing you name it, everything, which is sad to say as they have the official license, and coming from a fan, it was very dissapointing as they have access to any details they want, details I could (as a modder ) could only dream off, but like I said, I had that luxury to spend time with real teams, and like another discussion, this is something software houses need to do, not relay on Manufactures information, but speak to real teams.

Shaun

 

[Jebus]

What I fail to understand is that, yes I have said from day 1 where the shell came from, no regrets, but I was honest and up front, so why all the negativity, as I haven't released it on here and will not just showed you pictures, that's all I done.

I get it, no showing of anything you have worked on if it is not scratch made, and I mean scratch made from the first triangle...

I always thought RD was a place that you can talk about openly and freely, just as long as you didn't release anything that you stated was yours, but guess I was wrong

Remember that none of these guys are admins, they do not make rules or enforce them. All they can do is to state their opinion, and noone is obligated to agree with them. As long as you don't brake any points in the ToS you're good to go.

 

[Fat-Alfie]

Not judging one way or the other, but can I ask why the model wasn't scratch built?

If you have made and released other scratch-made mods for AC, what prompted the decision to use a ripped model as the basis for this mod? (sorry if this has already been answered)

 

[SunBro]

Not judging one way or the other, but can I ask why the model wasn't scratch built?

If you have made and released other scratch-made mods for AC, what prompted the decision to use a ripped model as the basis for this mod? (sorry if this has already been answered)

It hasn't been answered but here's a lil bit of side info: all of his past models were already built by someone else and then abandoned/not updated for a long while. Shaun and modelers, sound modders and sometimes people like @mclarenf1papa (i don't know his exact involvement) just took them(with permission), updated the models, re-worked sounds, sometimes scratch made physics and released them back into the wild. As far as i know, ZERO cars have been made from scratch under the supervision of Shaun. They were all just updated.(yes, yes yes i know "lots of work" have gone into them, lots of budget bla bla but in the end, it's just an update)

 

[Leonardo Ratafiá]

With that approach there are some kunos model which are way off as well, would you do the same?

 

[Shaun Clarke]

@Fat-Alfie @SunBro is correct in one way, but not in another, I will explain.

The Models where already built, but wasn't exactly correct, like the Ginetta for example. This was from 2013-2014 model, so the interior was re-done, bits added, and the physics was totally overhauled, built from the ground up. Seat Leon, Audi TT where more completed models, but still needed a lot of work to bring it up a level, so although the basics was there but needed a lot of time and effort. I also took the route of involving real teams and drivers...bla bla bla.
@Fat-Alfie
Now to answer your question. I have asked for over 2yrs if anybody would scratch build this for me, and even offered to pay for it to be made, and the replies I got was, "why would you want to do that" so I just left it. I believe this was because its not massive "globally" and is a very niche market but a series I follow very closely (have friends driving in it) and it's part of the TOCA package, again, very close to me.

Then by total surprise (didn't know it was coming and I certainly never asked for it) it just landed in my inbox, with a message "Enjoy"

So just to confirm, I never asked for it to be what it is, and again, like above, I apologise for sharing it and my passion on here.

Shaun

 

[Shaun Clarke]

With that approach there are some kunos model which are way off as well, would you do the same?

Sorry you lost me there? With what approach, as I explained, I never "took" it, I never thought, oh that's rubbish I can do a better job, so as far as I can see, the only mistake I have done, was just talking about it, and sharing pictures of it on here.

Shaun

 

[Kenny Paton]

Guys please this is coming across imho as a bit petty.
Surely these things should be handled by pm and not tarnish this thread.
No one can seriously doubt Shaun's commitment and dedication so some respect please.
Plus it upsets us kids when mum and dad fight.