ffbclip with Fanatec CSW 2.5

[JoshOz]

Hi there,
I recently upgraded all my sim equipment to Fanatec and have a question regarding the force feedback strength in AC.

I have the ffbclip app and use it to set ff strength on a per car basis. Due to the increased torque coming from the CSW 2.5 wheelbase, I’m trying to set the force feedback for each car as best I can. My question is about how ffbclip works when you first start driving. When I first start I usually set the force feedback quite low, around 45-50 but when I first start driving the steering feels very strong and heavy but then lightens up as I drive. The problem with this is I’m not sure if this is just how the ffbclip is supposed to work or if it’s something else causing it. In other words, is this normal behaviour?

Can someone please offer me some info about setting force feedback in AC on per car basis in regards to ffbclip and whether this is the best way? Is there a better way?

Thanks,
JoshOz.

 

[JoshOz]

its in
C:\Users\[yo username]\Documents\Assetto Corsa\cfg\ file named user_ff.ini delete this file ac make new when yo start

You're a champion dario993! I renamed the file and then AC generated a new one. I can now see how each car is at the default setting before changing. Thanks again for the help.

 

[Deleted member 963434]

You're a champion dario993! I renamed the file and then AC generated a new one. I can now see how each car is at the default setting before changing. Thanks again for the help.

all cars have 1.000 value or maybe it depends on wheel but i have all default at 1.0000 always

 

[Deleted member 963434]

an yo can open app "ffb setting" in ac while driving (from right menu) and change from 100 to say 80 or 120 and then you have in this file values of 0,800 or 1,200 how yo set it and its saved per car
default value 100 is 100% of gain yo set in main menu say 40%, so if yo set per car 80 ffb its as yo have set 32 % gain for just one car.
and if yo set say 120 ffb its as yo have set 48 % gain for tis one car. thats what ffb clippin app do, it highens gain until clippin occur. its good for belt driven wheels (as DD wheels not clippin so yo not need tis for dd wheel) but problem is it not setting gain per car globally, but per car/track combo so yo have different gain in same car at but at different tracks

 

[JoshOz]

an yo can open app "ffb setting" in ac while driving (from right menu) and change from 100 to say 80 or 120 and then you have in this file values of 0,800 or 1,200 how yo set it and its saved per car
default value 100 is 100% of gain yo set in main menu say 40%, so if yo set per car 80 ffb its as yo have set 32 % gain for just one car.
and if yo set say 120 ffb its as yo have set 48 % gain for tis one car. thats what ffb clippin app do, it highens gain until clippin occur. its good for belt driven wheels (as DD wheels not clippin so yo not need tis for dd wheel) but problem is it not setting gain per car globally, but per car/track combo so yo have different gain in same car at but at different tracks

Ahh, ok that makes sense now. So in the main menu in the force feedback area I have gain set to 65% as per Fanatec recommendations. That means that when I start with a car the force feedback will start at 1.00 which means it will be using 65% strength. If I go up or down from 1.00 it will be altering the 65% for that car. This is how I wanted it to work and hence why I wanted to reset my force feedback file.

 

[Lanmaster53]

Hi @JoshOz,

I use all of the same settings as you and know exactly what you're talking about w/FFBClip. Here's what's happening. The first time you drive a car on a track, FFBClip is set to the default. In my case, 100%. When you manually adjust the FFB setting, look at the actual FFB number, it will still say the default. FFBClip doesn't actually start adjusting the FFB gain until you start driving. So it will be near default until you start driving and will arrive at your setting a couple 100 meters down the track. Once it gets to the manually set FFB, it stays there. The next time you come to that same track with the same car, it defaults to the new setting and you won't have that experience again.

I don't know why it has to adjust this way, but it probably has something to do with the way the software gets in between the game and the hardware and gracefully adjusts the gain. You're using FFBClip to set a static FFB when it was designed to do more than that. So you're experiencing a side affect of what the software was designed to do by using it to adjust a static FFB.

I hope this helps!

 

[JoshOz]

Hi Lanmaster53,
Thanks for your explanation of FFBClip. You described extremely well what I was experiencing which I found a bit disconcerting. I actually decided to not use the app anymore after setting my global force feedback to 65 (based on the Fanatec recommended settings) and then using the 'force feedback controller' app to fine tune the strength. I am finding this method works well for me and I think the FFBclip was just overcomplicating what shouldn't be all that complicated. I watched a YouTube video today that was talking about force feedback clipping and how it is more likely to happen on weaker wheelbases. When I play ACC with force feedback on 70 I don't see clipping in the grey bar near the bottom right of screen so I'm assuming (and maybe incorrectly) that I'm not getting clipping in Assetto Corsa either seeing as I'm using 65 for force feedback as my starting point.
Anyway, thanks for the reply to my question. Always good to hear from other players.
Bye for now,
JoshOz.

 

[Lanmaster53]

Does the 'force feedback controller' app store per car FFB settings so you don't have to change it every time you load that car? I noticed if I use the keyboard shortcuts for FFB, they don't persist. I figured the built-in app was just a GUI on top of the same keyboard shortcut functionality.

 

[JoshOz]

Does the 'force feedback controller' app store per car FFB settings so you don't have to change it every time you load that car? I noticed if I use the keyboard shortcuts for FFB, they don't persist. I figured the built-in app was just a GUI on top of the same keyboard shortcut functionality.

Yes, Lanmaster53, it does save the setting for each car. I just activate the app whenever I start with a new car and drive a lap or two and make an adjustment to the force feedback. I don't use keyboard shortcuts though so not sure about that. When I make the change I click 'save' and a message at the top of my screen appears saying 'saved to controls.ini' or something to that effect. Depending on what wheel/wheelbase you are using it might be worth trying this method instead of the ffbclip app. I did however delete/rename the file 'user_ff.ini' as per dario993's instructions (thanks dario993!) to give me a fresh start because my previous wheel setup was a Logitech G920 which is quite different to the Fanatec CSW 2.5 wheelbase. I'm really enjoying the force feedback now. Also in another post question I was questioning why certain cars had really poor feel around centre. I now have the answer after upgrading to the Fanatec CSW 2.5. It really sorts out the lack of feel at centre. Please let me know if you decide to just use the stock 'force feedback controller' app instead of 'ffbclip'.

 

[Lizard Of Bodom]

Can I just hop in to this without opening new thread and ask about your experiences with clipping? Im also currently experimenting with setting up my new wheel (Fanatec CSL Elite racing) but not using FFBClip, rather focused on putting Fanatec recommended settings in AC and modifying FFB to my liking. But when driving I sometimes still notice clipping on the "pedals" widget. for 99.9% of lap its gray but rarely it spikes to red on fast corner with bump for example.
Question is, would I consider thats ok and its "best possible setting with ocasional spikes" or I should lower down gain/FFB enough to never have clipping, with a cost of lower FFB in general for other feelings? Seem to me that those few spikes within 4minute of track lap is something I can live with but maybe Im missing the point?
new to belt driven wheels and whole experience, coming off G25 :>

 

[JoshOz]

Can I just hop in to this without opening new thread and ask about your experiences with clipping? Im also currently experimenting with setting up my new wheel (Fanatec CSL Elite racing) but not using FFBClip, rather focused on putting Fanatec recommended settings in AC and modifying FFB to my liking. But when driving I sometimes still notice clipping on the "pedals" widget. for 99.9% of lap its gray but rarely it spikes to red on fast corner with bump for example.
Question is, would I consider thats ok and its "best possible setting with ocasional spikes" or I should lower down gain/FFB enough to never have clipping, with a cost of lower FFB in general for other feelings? Seem to me that those few spikes within 4minute of track lap is something I can live with but maybe Im missing the point?
new to belt driven wheels and whole experience, coming off G25 :>

Hey Lizard Of Bodom. Good to have you jump in with your thoughts/questions. I don't pretend to be an expert in any way, which is obvious from the thread I started here. That said I have been watching YouTube videos on the subject, trying to educate myself in regards to force feedback and clipping since I upgraded to Fanatec hardware. From the experience you are describing I think you have force feedback set up really well. If you are only occasionally seeing a spike of clipping in the pedals app then it's not really a problem. Seeing as I'm not using 'ffbclip' app anymore I thought it might be wise for me to just do a quick test and see if I am indeed suffering from clipping. I did a few laps of 'Imola' (Kunos track) with the 'Ferrari 488 GT3' (Kunos car) and used the 'Dk Pedals' app to monitor the gray force feedback bar as you did. While driving around Imola my force feedback felt really good and I didn't see any clipping. I've attached two images to show you my global force feedback settings and the 'force feedback controller' app settings for that car. I did set it to 100% so it would be using 100% of my global setting. My global settings are those recommended on the Fanatec forum which lists settings for various games.
I hope what I have said is somewhat helpful or encouraging. Please let me know if you have any questions.
JoshOz.

 

[Lizard Of Bodom]

..
I hope what I have said is somewhat helpful or encouraging. Please let me know if you have any questions.
JoshOz.

Hi
tx for thoughts!
Looking at your values, those differ a bit from mine (Fanatec recommends Gain 70 for my wheel) but kerb/slip/ABS that I have added are just personal preferences. With them zeroed, it makes no difference to my query so those are just to intensify feeling.



The only way for me to achieve completely "never on red zone clipping" is to reduce overall FFB down to 60 or lower it per each car but then, as mentioned - it affects whole FFB feel and other desired effects are less felt so I am happy with ocasional clipping.
Worth mentioning, the track I experience this "issue" most is Highlands Long, being very bumpy and fast, expecially after long straight and series of turns on bumps and with high G force.
Nordshleife has just few moments where I experience it aswell but in general the gray ffb dial remains in its 75-90% indication even on demanding parts.
Think I will leve it as is for now, as seem like it is as good as gets.

 

[JoshOz]

Worth mentioning, the track I experience this "issue" most is Highlands Long, being very bumpy and fast, expecially after long straight and series of turns on bumps and with high G force.
Nordshleife has just few moments where I experience it aswell but in general the gray ffb dial remains in its 75-90% indication even on demanding parts.

I know what you mean about experiencing spikes on those tracks. I have come across tracks that on occasion give me nasty jolts in my ffb that I really dislike. I usually end up deleting these from my AC library because I can’t drive them without the being conscious of those spikes/jolts so I don’t race on them. The other two settings I change on my wheelbase setup that might help are 'f.eff.int' and ‘shck.vib' both set on 50 to help reduce overall vibration and shock. That’s just me because I didn’t like it when both were set to 100. Not sure if these settings would have anything to do with the clipping, probably not.

 

[Gelly916]

Don't mean to hijack the thread, but back when I used a CSW 2.5 I never used the ffb clip app. In my opinion, it just wasn't that great. What I did personally was set my gain to 100. My FFB on my actual wheel is also at 100. Then I dial back each car to a preferred strength using the Force Feedback App when I'm actually on track. If memory serves me right, right around 52 was a pretty normal number for my FFB. Then let's say I drove a mod with heavier steering, I'd turn that number to something like 42-47. If a car needed stronger FFB, I changed it to 55-65. You can save the every car's individual FFB using that app.

 

[Gelly916]

I could usually tell within the first couple turns how much FFB I needed to add or subtract from that "52" baseline number in order to reach a desired strength. Also, I wouldn't suggest figuring out your preferred FFB (if clipping is bothering you) at tracks like Nords or any other bumpy track. It's really difficult to not clip with that base (or anything outside a DD) when the track surface is that rough.

 

[JoshOz]

Don't mean to hijack the thread, but back when I used a CSW 2.5 I never used the ffb clip app. In my opinion, it just wasn't that great. What I did personally was set my gain to 100. My FFB on my actual wheel is also at 100. Then I dial back each car to a preferred strength using the Force Feedback App when I'm actually on track. If memory serves me right, right around 52 was a pretty normal number for my FFB. Then let's say I drove a mod with heavier steering, I'd turn that number to something like 42-47. If a car needed stronger FFB, I changed it to 55-65. You can save the every car's individual FFB using that app.

Hi Gelly916! Good to hear your thoughts, you're certainly not hijacking the thread. The more input the better. I strongly agree with all you said. It seems much better to set a global ffb strength in settings and then fine tune each car as needed. What you are doing is exactly how I'm setting force feedback now (except for the initial gain setting). Thanks for your comments.

 

[JoshOz]

I could usually tell within the first couple turns how much FFB I needed to add or subtract from that "52" baseline number in order to reach a desired strength. Also, I wouldn't suggest figuring out your preferred FFB (if clipping is bothering you) at tracks like Nords or any other bumpy track. It's really difficult to not clip with that base (or anything outside a DD) when the track surface is that rough.

That's a great tip Gelly916. Some tracks are terribly bumpy and I can see how it would be difficult to accurately set the force feedback on those tracks.

 

[Gelly916]

Not a problem! It's been a while since I used the 2.5 so I don't know what the wheel settings are like with recent firmware updates. But I was going to say if you struggle with clipping, but also want a heavier wheel without increasing actual FFB, you can adjust the drift setting to compensate. My only issue with that is I hate going back and fourth when it comes to my physical wheel settings. I basically have two now for AC - one for cars without power steering, and one for cars with power steering. One is much more dampened than the other, but the force feedback strength of the two is the same.

 

[JoshOz]

Not a problem! It's been a while since I used the 2.5 so I don't know what the wheel settings are like with recent firmware updates. But I was going to say if you struggle with clipping, but also want a heavier wheel without increasing actual FFB, you can adjust the drift setting to compensate. My only issue with that is I hate going back and fourth when it comes to my physical wheel settings. I basically have two now for AC - one for cars without power steering, and one for cars with power steering. One is much more dampened than the other, but the force feedback strength of the two is the same.

Gelly916, I know about the 'drift' setting you are referring to. I think I've got mine set on the recommended settings from the Fanatec forum. I think it adds/removes resistance when turning the wheel (which is pretty much what you said ) so I don't tinker much with this setting. Quick question for you and others reading this who use Fanatec wheelbases. There are two wheelbase settings, 'force feedback intensity' and 'shock vibration'. I noticed if I leave these on default 100 as per Fanatec recommendations, I get lots of shocks and vibrations etc. I find it really unnerving so I have set these both to 50. Does anyone else here use these at 100? I know it's a bit off topic but thought I'd check. I'm asking because I find it strange that 100 is the Fanatec recommended setting but I can't drive with either of these on 100. (I haven't tried to use 100 since I first started using the wheelbase but have since updated firmware so it might have changed.)

 

[Gelly916]

I like to run shock "SHO" at 100. I feel like if you hit a rumble strip in a stiff racecar in real life, you're going to feel those vibrations through your hands big time. If you don't like the vibrations you get from that setting because of regular surface detail, try turning down the "road" setting in AC's FFB settings. The Force Feedback Intensity (FEI I believe?) I leave at 90. I feel that at 100 the FFB is a little too violent. But if I play with it as 70, I feel like the FFB is too soft. So 80 or 90 is my preferred setting for that. There's also the FOR setting (can't quite remember what that's short for) but that goes hand in hand with the FEI setting. I'm pretty sure I play with that on 80. Those two settings play a huge role if you're trying not to clip when using a non-DD base too.

 

[JoshOz]

I like to run shock "SHO" at 100. I feel like if you hit a rumble strip in a stiff racecar in real life, you're going to feel those vibrations through your hands big time. If you don't like the vibrations you get from that setting because of regular surface detail, try turning down the "road" setting in AC's FFB settings. The Force Feedback Intensity (FEI I believe?) I leave at 90. I feel that at 100 the FFB is a little too violent. But if I play with it as 70, I feel like the FFB is too soft. So 80 or 90 is my preferred setting for that. There's also the FOR setting (can't quite remember what that's short for) but that goes hand in hand with the FEI setting. I'm pretty sure I play with that on 80. Those two settings play a huge role if you're trying not to clip when using a non-DD base too.

Gelly916, thanks for the info and explanations. I think I will experiment again with those settings. Maybe I’m missing out by having them at 50. I have my wheelbase mounted to a cockpit which sits hard up against the edge of a table which supports my monitor. Any violent shocks or vibrations seems to amplify through my desk which is maybe the reason I turned those settings down almost straight after I bought the wheelbase.