Tracks Clarksville, Indiana_Sportsdome Speedway_Figure 8 & Oval 1.0

[FormulaET]

Dave,
Sounds like we see similar perspective.
Time.....….always time. Practice makes perfect, I reckon.
I smooth, correct, or modify using the track tools in RTB. In fact, I seemed to have hit another plateau per say, using the concept developed by the creator. Common sense prevailing, I started to pay attention to the vertices' height as a point of reference given a particular means I'm trying to achieve.
The cross section tool is invaluable as it displays the vertices. But it is an arduous undertaking that involves trial and error, hence I am getting better at it.... utilizing it to achieve whatever is needed
It takes time, sometimes hours slip by.
I force myself off it sometimes to re charge.
I'm quite fond of the choices I made to the GP track; re introducing the blue/or colored area of the apex and having the rumble strips further off the track line. Makes it F1 like and helps to target the corner which is gratifying if taken proper at fast as possible.
With that, I had to re think the cross section.... extend a level vertice extended beyond the track material, for example. My last update had just terrain under the rumble strip which made it bumpy and would potentially spin the car if crossing over it. I was racking my brains trying to figure out why, and then how I did it originally by accident. That extended section was now able to be airbrushed with a material, concrete for example. Then I was able to color over it any color I wanted.... using all RTB track tools only. So I left some areas irregular to give it a natural feel, not totally smooth and predictable.
KS Editor I use, for now, to assign 1WALL_ to objects, gather object names, activate shadow casting, naming 1PIT_ lane or pitbox…… There is a correction tool for the L and R lines too, but I only used it thus far for Clarksville dilemma. Then of course to save the KN5 format.... so I know there are more possibilities but there is no User's Guide by Kunoz.
Anyhoo up in the future are Salem Speedway, Palm Beach International, Nazareth and maybe Kentucky.... if someone doesn't beat me to it.
Oh BTW, a young English engineer at my work does SCCA type meets, he turned me on the Corvette Test Track down in Bowling Green, Ky. I will give you a Dropbox link from my files as it was only available on a facebook group....

https://www.dropbox.com/s/2ewqwlq28ir9dot/NCM.rar?dl=0

 

[FormulaET]

You have done a great job with all 3 of your tracks and on one of my favorite tracks Milwaukee mile. You are running into the same problem as myself trying to get answers to do sometimes the simplest things in track building. I try to help with the little knowledge I know so far with creating tracks and glad to help you on certain things. I too have more I want to learn, but do not want to get into doing a complete track from scratch-just dont have the time to do one. Note: I have both Blender and 3ds max, but I too need to explore and learn how they work. My main editors right now have been 3dsimed and ks-editor - But I also do want to learn how to fix some tracks I have to smooth them out(a Winter time project). Did you use blender to smooth your tracks?

If you do anymore tracks, look forward to seeing/driving on them in Assetto Corsa.

 

[Dave Thayer]

FYI: there is a Nazareth and Kentucky track and done pretty good. You will see with my posted info in your Profile message area. Is Palm Springs an Oval type track? Always looking for more Ovals for Assetto Corsa, especially short tracks now. I have most the big speedways.
take care,
Dave

PS: I found a picture of the Palm Springs International layout if it is the same one. Has a nice Oval and a very elaborate GP type track layout.

 

[FormulaET]

FYI: there is a Nazareth and Kentucky track and done pretty good. You will see with my posted info in your Profile message area. Is Palm Springs an Oval type track? Always looking for more Ovals for Assetto Corsa, especially short tracks now. I have most the big speedways.
take care,
Dave

PS: I found a picture of the Palm Springs International layout if it is the same one. Has a nice Oval and a very elaborate GP type track layout.

Cool yes!!!
Palm Beach was turned on to me by a co worker who used to watch dragsters there.

I'm thinking maybe doing an original quadrangular oval, fast corners mixed with tighter corners, but you got me thinking.

 

[FormulaET]

FYI: there is a Nazareth and Kentucky track and done pretty good. You will see with my posted info in your Profile message area. Is Palm Springs an Oval type track? Always looking for more Ovals for Assetto Corsa, especially short tracks now. I have most the big speedways.
take care,
Dave

PS: I found a picture of the Palm Springs International layout if it is the same one. Has a nice Oval and a very elaborate GP type track layout.

Dave I like these ovals you sent... an interesting thing is I think these guys make the track white lines etc a lightsource… if I de activate the track lights at Kentucky for example, the track stays illuminated... hmmm

 

[Dave Thayer]

Yeah that is interesting. Never really investigated their track lighting yet. They do some different things with the replay cameras also. Check how they do their balloon animations, you could add that to your tracks. I dont know how much you are into Oval Racing. The only real bumpy/rough track is Rockingham.

Guess what, I found a Gateway track done by someone in the Drifting community. It is done very good. it has both an Oval and a GP interior trackage. How close to realistic specs to the real track, I dont know, but looks pretty good. I also found Orlando and New Jersey Ovals to play around with. All I need now is the Saint Petersberg Road track and I have a complete Indycar track series.
take care,
Dave

 

[FormulaET]

Yeah that is interesting. Never really investigated their track lighting yet. They do some different things with the replay cameras also. Check how they do their balloon animations, you could add that to your tracks. I dont know how much you are into Oval Racing. The only real bumpy/rough track is Rockingham.

Guess what, I found a Gateway track done by someone in the Drifting community. It is done very good. it has both an Oval and a GP interior trackage. How close to realistic specs to the real track, I dont know, but looks pretty good. I also found Orlando and New Jersey Ovals to play around with. All I need now is the Saint Petersberg Road track and I have a complete Indycar track series.
take care,
Dave

Yes the more I know all the tricks, I would want to strive for more realistic look.
I changed the surface of the GP track to that of cracked old look. I still need to fine tune it's size; length & width of the surface. I added a makeshift grandstand, crowd and what not. Still not on par with these builds that have a wonderful representation of reality. Floating cameras, lut settings, all the different file tweaks within the data folder are yet to be utilized.
The more I discover, the less I know....
If the ovals are worthy, please post to my profile as you did with the others.
If you want, or anyone reading this is interested, I can link the KN5 file only, so you can drop it in it's respective track folder, just for R&D purposes.
I also have been focusing on the vertices of the cross sections to match eachother every 50 meters or so.
Again......the more I learn and discover, the less I know......
I am receiving a new custom guitar amp friday, so I will split my time between it, family and of course the new hobby.
Ooo....also, I gave Kentucky, which is about 45 minutes from me, a new AI Super Lead, also fixed the pit lane, the line was too close to the pitboxes.
Be well, and thanks for keeping in touch, Dave.

 

[FormulaET]

Yeah that is interesting. Never really investigated their track lighting yet. They do some different things with the replay cameras also. Check how they do their balloon animations, you could add that to your tracks. I dont know how much you are into Oval Racing. The only real bumpy/rough track is Rockingham.

Guess what, I found a Gateway track done by someone in the Drifting community. It is done very good. it has both an Oval and a GP interior trackage. How close to realistic specs to the real track, I dont know, but looks pretty good. I also found Orlando and New Jersey Ovals to play around with. All I need now is the Saint Petersberg Road track and I have a complete Indycar track series.
take care,
Dave

I would be willing to send you the .fbx file with or without objects if you wish to work together on it. A team effort could result in a win/win outcome, if you are interested.

 

[Dave Thayer]

I need to learn all my new edit tools basics which I have both 3ds max, 3dsimed, and Blender. I am having problems with FBX files getting them to export back out and getting a good KN5 file. 3dsimed I have the most time with cause both imports and exports are in KN5 format. Let me get comfortable with these tools first before I can help you. I might of gotten Race Track Builder, but it doesnt have the import features I like for existing tracks. Mainly for those that start from scratch. My changes I do to tracks are for my own use and pleasure anyway plus a good learning experience. I have converted several winding drifting tracks to work as Circuit tracks for doing Go Kart racing.

I think you might be interested in the Gateway track. It is setup up for the drifting guys right now, so no valid pit stalls or starting grid where they should be. Also need to create fast lane, pit lane, and side lines for Oval configuration. All the trackage is there for both Oval and GP, just need some work on above. I will make some changes to it and then send it to you. If the other Ovals I found work out, I will pass them along to you to try.

Thanks for the info on Kentucky track, I have been just going to quick RACE with Indy cars on most the tracks. The worst track is their Daytona track starting grid. If you do particular car sets like F1,they bounce down hard onto the track starting grid and most turn upside down - because of the steep side angle of the track there. Later on I may move the starting grid back to the flatter part of the track.

Great you got a guitar amp, I play midi guitar and keyboard also. Havent done much playing for a while.

take care,
Dave

 

[FormulaET]

I need to learn all my new edit tools basics which I have both 3ds max, 3dsimed, and Blender. I am having problems with FBX files getting them to export back out and getting a good KN5 file. 3dsimed I have the most time with cause both imports and exports are in KN5 format. Let me get comfortable with these tools first before I can help you. I might of gotten Race Track Builder, but it doesnt have the import features I like for existing tracks. Mainly for those that start from scratch. My changes I do to tracks are for my own use and pleasure anyway plus a good learning experience. I have converted several winding drifting tracks to work as Circuit tracks for doing Go Kart racing.

I think you might be interested in the Gateway track. It is setup up for the drifting guys right now, so no valid pit stalls or starting grid where they should be. Also need to create fast lane, pit lane, and side lines for Oval configuration. All the trackage is there for both Oval and GP, just need some work on above. I will make some changes to it and then send it to you. If the other Ovals I found work out, I will pass them along to you to try.

Thanks for the info on Kentucky track, I have been just going to quick RACE with Indy cars on most the tracks. The worst track is their Daytona track starting grid. If you do particular car sets like F1,they bounce down hard onto the track starting grid and most turn upside down - because of the steep side angle of the track there. Later on I may move the starting grid back to the flatter part of the track.

Great you got a guitar amp, I play midi guitar and keyboard also. Havent done much playing for a while.

take care,
Dave

Ky. does the bounce thing as well. If the author is a member, I'd like to inquire permission before posting my AI mod.
You know.......what would help is if you have fbx format objects I can use. The export tool for files in RTB only accepts fbx..... the name escapes me at the moment.

If you could, please send the Gateway link.

Also, I am not savvy yet to use a software that let's one explore a KN5 file.
I just use KS Editor for KN5 import... too bad you can't open KN5's through KSEditor.

 

[Dave Thayer]

Hi FormulaET,
Yeah each editor seems to do its own thing. That's why I have such a hard time importing and exporting back out at this time with FBX and to get a final working kn5.

One thing that wasnt too clear to me with RTB is far as imports. Reading, Seems it cant import FBX files directly, correct? You have to do some kind of XPACK process. So I didnt know if it could edit existing tracks, that's why I went with 3dsimed. So, can we edit already created tracks with RTB? I was thinking RTB had its own saved file format. Shows you how much I know about it. hehe

Another thing is do we have to pay a hefty fee to use google maps to get accurate locations to design tracks from(reading this info from STEAM discussion users)? I had brief thoughts of creating a track but this kind of put the speed brakes on that.

I also have the kn5Conv app which I use on AC tracks first to get an ASCII FBX file and and creates a nice texture folder. From that, Works great with 3dsimed and to import a kn5 file.

Note: Anybody else reading this discussion, this is for my own offline track racing/use and learning how edit tools work. I have learned allot so far, and have allot to learn yet - as you also have come a long way in track design.

i will send a link to gateway in your profile messages.

I think the person to talk to in the "Nascar Facebook group" is Christoper M Dwyer. You may be able to get to his profile page, dont know if you can see the members or any of his posts? Since i am joined, I can see everything.

Do you still need that file link on the Nascar Tracks in your profile messages?

take care,
Dave

 

[FormulaET]

Hi FormulaET,
Yeah each editor seems to do its own thing. That's why I have such a hard time importing and exporting back out at this time with FBX and to get a final working kn5.

One thing that wasnt too clear to me with RTB is far as imports. Reading, Seems it cant import FBX files directly, correct? You have to do some kind of XPACK process. So I didnt know if it could edit existing tracks, that's why I went with 3dsimed. So, can we edit already created tracks with RTB? I was thinking RTB had its own saved file format. Shows you how much I know about it. hehe

Another thing is do we have to pay a hefty fee to use google maps to get accurate locations to design tracks from(reading this info from STEAM discussion users)? I had brief thoughts of creating a track but this kind of put the speed brakes on that.

I also have the kn5Conv app which I use on AC tracks first to get an ASCII FBX file and and creates a nice texture folder. From that, Works great with 3dsimed and to import a kn5 file.

Note: Anybody else reading this discussion, this is for my own offline track racing/use and learning how edit tools work. I have learned allot so far, and have allot to learn yet - as you also have come a long way in track design.

i will send a link to gateway in your profile messages.

I think the person to talk to in the "Nascar Facebook group" is Christoper M Dwyer. You may be able to get to his profile page, dont know if you can see the members or any of his posts? Since i am joined, I can see everything.

Do you still need that file link on the Nascar Tracks in your profile messages?

take care,
Dave

Yes xpacker is what its called. I havent done anything with since my first week on rtb

I think it only takes fbx files, I have to re learn.

Yes I had to sign up at google for terrain and another attribute. First 300.00 bucks is on them.
Lilski the smartass said it wasnt accurate and he threw all his laser way of doing it. In other words, he tried my track, couldnt wait to tear me down because I used google terrain, and preached how wrong I am and how right he is.
That was at that other site, I was nice in my response at first but that arrogant chickens*** wouldn't respond. Very arrogant and smart ass a hole.
Excuse me for being new to this.... I was so excited to be doing it, geeks get jealous.
He is lucky I am not there in person to address his attitude towards me.
Thats the b.s. I've tolerated.
Where you on the other hand have shown kindness.
But back to the point, yes I think there are other means to getting terrain and height.
If I can get the gist of creating objects, ultimately I will gravitate to using Blender.
Perhaps even the entire build.

I'm not an engineer, but I know how to drive a race car. So these nit picky guys can blank_themselves.
Anyhoo I may look into 3Dsimed, just so I can open up my KN5 somehow. To correct things.
Rtb is good for beginner on training wheels, I will get my moneys worth out of it.

 

[Dave Thayer]

Yeah sorry you had bad dealings with some other modders, they do more criticizing then helping, but some do help. That would be cool for you to learn how to do objects, that is a whole creative Art design in itself.

If you get a chance, no hurry, let me know if I can import an existing track FBX with XPACKER into RTB to do minor modifications here and there. 3ds max is not too bad either, I just need to get beyond the basics. I dont know, but every time i look at Blender, it seems to be the hardest to learn.

3dsimed I find the easiest for me, but it is limited, and it does a great job of seeing the tracks in texture view, renaming objects such as changing Road to Pits to make pit servicing to work, does moving objects in a crude way, and I used it for creating/moving AI pits and starting grids on tracks, plus it imports and exports in KN5 format and a great interface to the KS Editor. I have not tried to add new objects with the program. 3dsimed for some is a great tool to convert tracks from another game to Assetto Corsa.

Anyway, take care,
Dave

 

[FormulaET]

Dave,
Xpacker is just for materials and textures objects...… say I give you the fbx. of Rex Oval, you put it in the track file in RTB, then open RTB to get to it...Xpacker is importing the small stuff, not an entire track.
The fbx. file I would send, would be in raw form prior to exporting it in RTB for opening up in KSEditor to name stuff and ultimately create the KN5.
Hang on………… I see... the track fbx file in C:/users/you/Documents/Race Track Builder, is in notepad form.
I guess aside from RTB, software can open it up. KSEditor I then can open that same file to create the KN5.

EASY PEASY it looks as though. xpacker isn't what that's used for the best I understand it.... it is just for create xpacks for RTB that you take from for all objects, string objects, tracks, walls, etc.....

I am sending you a Rex Mays Oval fbx

 

[FormulaET]

Yeah sorry you had bad dealings with some other modders, they do more criticizing then helping, but some do help. That would be cool for you to learn how to do objects, that is a whole creative Art design in itself.

If you get a chance, no hurry, let me know if I can import an existing track FBX with XPACKER into RTB to do minor modifications here and there. 3ds max is not too bad either, I just need to get beyond the basics. I dont know, but every time i look at Blender, it seems to be the hardest to learn.

3dsimed I find the easiest for me, but it is limited, and it does a great job of seeing the tracks in texture view, renaming objects such as changing Road to Pits to make pit servicing to work, does moving objects in a crude way, and I used it for creating/moving AI pits and starting grids on tracks, plus it imports and exports in KN5 format and a great interface to the KS Editor. I have not tried to add new objects with the program. 3dsimed for some is a great tool to convert tracks from another game to Assetto Corsa.

Anyway, take care,
Dave

BTW, I am liking the extra ovals you hooked me up with, thanks very much.

 

[Dave Thayer]

Yeah thats what I thought about XPACKER/RTB and reading discusssions on STEAM. It doesnt do what I want it to do which I need to bring in the entire track to look at and modify. It only works with initial scratch built tracks. That is where and why I use the other editors. We cant edit existing tracks with RTB.

Your FBX file you sent is almost like a config file listing materials and other things. It is not like an Autodesk FBX file which has all the track information.

I know it outputs an FBX to work with in other editors, I think. but is it just objects materials.
thanks for the info.

Note: I may of also answered an old message about surface files, if so, just ignore it. hehe

Dave

 

[FormulaET]

Yeah thats what I thought about XPACKER/RTB and reading discusssions on STEAM. It doesnt do what I want it to do which I need to bring in the entire track to look at and modify. It only works with initial scratch built tracks. That is where and why I use the other editors. We cant edit existing tracks with RTB.

Your FBX file you sent is almost like a config file listing materials and other things. It is not like an Autodesk FBX file which has all the track information.

I know it outputs an FBX to work with in other editors, I think. but is it just objects materials.
thanks for the info.

Note: I may of also answered an old message about surface files, if so, just ignore it. hehe

Dave

Ah, but you can edit tracks built in RTB. I would think if you can open it in a 3d software, that would be cool. If you have RTB, the file I sent will open up in RTB and you can modify it that way.. Is this what you are wanting to achieve? I hope so... that way we can tweak it together so to spreak.

 

[LilSki]

So through the use of a magic time machine I can go back to what I said from the deleted posts over on ACM. Here is what I said:

“The sooner you ditch RTB and its horrible assets the better off you will be. A steep learning curve (blender) but worth it if you want the track to actually look like the real thing. Also FYI the google API used with RTB isn't really all that accurate compared to using the aerial lidar data that is available or using the google earth capture method used for Kyalami. Your track has odd humps in the turns that the real track doesn't have according to some video I just watched. This is due to the low resolution data used in the API from google. Plus the real thing is very rough which is another thing you can't get from RTB. Also instead of a second track you can make the road course a second layout.”

And he "liked" the post.


Then this was his reply:

“Well well, lilski… finally got in touch with you!!! I was waiting for the hammer to drop; 'friends don't let friends use RTB' Ok, I know how to pilot a car, know a good circuit, so...…… what would you all recommend as far as 3d track modeler? I have downloaded Blender, but it's all greek to me at this point I see 3Ds Max is a hefty yearly fee, but...... In regards to the terrain not being accurate, well I scanned it down to the 'inth' that the terrain tool would let me... So what you are telling me is that there is something more accurate. I accept this, as I am new. You guys obviously know.... LilSKi please stay in touch, I need all the tutelage I can get. Criticism can be painful, but I am willing too learn. Track building has sparked my artistic side, similar to guitar playing, so please keep me in your prayers whilst I gravitate to bigger and better ways of doing things. Thanks again, lilski for chiming in..... nice to hear from you ET”

Now my initial post may not be sunshine and rainbows but reading it back now I don't think it was that harsh. And your reply did not imply that you were angry in my post in any way. Then I get shown the post above and at first I think "eh whatever I've been known to piss people off" But I really don't see the "punishment" meets the "crime" here.

But in any case I still stand by the API RTB uses for google data is not nearly as accurate as either a aerial lidar dataset or even the the 3D photogrammetry used by google. RTB to my knowledge does not use the photogrammetry data.

However given that your track is basically flat with little to no elevation it will be less likely to spot the errors that you would come across on a track with significant elevation and camber changes.

Now the accuracy RTB can achieve might be fine for you and there is nothing wrong with that at all. I was simply stating is that there are far more accurate methods of track building out there if you were interested in it being as accurate as it can be. Again if you are happy with how it is now then that is fine. It is your hobby and you do what you want. Just don't expect everyone to like your work and bend over backwards to praise everything you do just because you did it. Right or wrong everyone has different standards. So some will be happy and some will not. It's just the way the world works.

 

[FormulaET]

So through the use of a magic time machine I can go back to what I said from the deleted posts over on ACM. Here is what I said:

“The sooner you ditch RTB and its horrible assets the better off you will be. A steep learning curve (blender) but worth it if you want the track to actually look like the real thing. Also FYI the google API used with RTB isn't really all that accurate compared to using the aerial lidar data that is available or using the google earth capture method used for Kyalami. Your track has odd humps in the turns that the real track doesn't have according to some video I just watched. This is due to the low resolution data used in the API from google. Plus the real thing is very rough which is another thing you can't get from RTB. Also instead of a second track you can make the road course a second layout.”

And he "liked" the post.


Then this was his reply:

“Well well, lilski… finally got in touch with you!!! I was waiting for the hammer to drop; 'friends don't let friends use RTB' Ok, I know how to pilot a car, know a good circuit, so...…… what would you all recommend as far as 3d track modeler? I have downloaded Blender, but it's all greek to me at this point I see 3Ds Max is a hefty yearly fee, but...... In regards to the terrain not being accurate, well I scanned it down to the 'inth' that the terrain tool would let me... So what you are telling me is that there is something more accurate. I accept this, as I am new. You guys obviously know.... LilSKi please stay in touch, I need all the tutelage I can get. Criticism can be painful, but I am willing too learn. Track building has sparked my artistic side, similar to guitar playing, so please keep me in your prayers whilst I gravitate to bigger and better ways of doing things. Thanks again, lilski for chiming in..... nice to hear from you ET”

Now my initial post may not be sunshine and rainbows but reading it back now I don't think it was that harsh. And your reply did not imply that you were angry in my post in any way. Then I get shown the post above and at first I think "eh whatever I've been known to piss people off" But I really don't see the "punishment" meets the "crime" here.

But in any case I still stand by the API RTB uses for google data is not nearly as accurate as either a aerial lidar dataset or even the the 3D photogrammetry used by google. RTB to my knowledge does not use the photogrammetry data.

However given that your track is basically flat with little to no elevation it will be less likely to spot the errors that you would come across on a track with significant elevation and camber changes.

Now the accuracy RTB can achieve might be fine for you and there is nothing wrong with that at all. I was simply stating is that there are far more accurate methods of track building out there if you were interested in it being as accurate as it can be. Again if you are happy with how it is now then that is fine. It is your hobby and you do what you want. Just don't expect everyone to like your work and bend over backwards to praise everything you do just because you did it. Right or wrong everyone has different standards. So some will be happy and some will not. It's just the way the world works.

Piss off M8, my initial response was being nice.... You trolling my posts here on the more mature site, not responding when I message you to ask for help____THATS A DEAL BREAKER! Now all of a sudden you chime in??? Pffft. I have no use for you with how you responded to me on the other arrogant site...….
Stop trolling me and worry about you.... I won't even give you the satisfaction of reading your un invited post here. In fact pasting the conversation further proves my point.
You want to be right, and show others wrong.

That's a maturity thing you need to learn.
"Anything beyond the tip of your nose, is none of your f****** business"​

Don't ever post on my stuff again without being invited, I don't care if this is open or not.
Your whole post just totally proves my point.
The help I receive on RaceDepartment is above and beyond that other site you are on. Guys here uplift, not over criticize and discredit...… I don't care how great you are at something, talking down to people fails every time.
If I was you, I would take what I say with a grain of salt, and maybe ponder which site you wish to show your allegiance to.....

 

[Monol]

"Don't ever post on my stuff again without being invited"...

Quite literally not how Forums work. LilSki can post where ever the hell he feels like.

If you want your posts to yourself without LilSki commenting, you are free to write them on a piece of paper and nail them to your wall.