Am i crazy?

[Ivo Simons]

Just wanted to start doing some iRacing offline.
Got a subscription for a couple of months + plus i bought the Dallara but didnt renew it some weeks ago. Now its says i cant get to the member website and cant even race offline with cars that i bought. Please tell me that i miss something or its the biggest scam i ever came across.

 

[Bram Hengeveld]

The thing about iRacing, and yes - it does have its flaws, is that the development team actually pay attention to the customers; read the forums; interact on the forums; release a product update every 13 weeks (guaranteed)

So do other developers Mark. They are not the only ones that actually interact.

 

[Mark A Warmington]

So do other developers Mark. They are not the only ones that actually interact.

Yep - point taken. I guess the point I am trying to make (badly) is not to denegrate other titles, developers, etc. rather to just state the case why I do not (currently) have an issue with paying my subscription. I get what I pay for. If I no longer like it, or the business model, I take my money and go elsewhere.

 

[CAR]

The LFS devs are scared of their own community, and that’s why it’s slowly dying and has been for sometime. As for netKar PRO Kunos does post on the official forums, and works with real-racing drivers/engineers. Also he has implemented suggestions from the community, such as the auto-update being one. The development’s a little patchy with nKPro because it’s not a viable product, so other projects such as working with BRD (who Williams are a licensee of btw just to sort of keep it on topic), and Ferrari Virtual Academy have to take precedent.

I would raise the issue of the size of the team working on the respective sims, but with Gran Turismo 5 it doesn’t seem to make much difference Nah, but it’s an issue, LFS/nKP both have a few people onboard with one of those responsible for the coding. Still though they’re glimpse of what the products could be with more resources, although you get what you pay for, I’d just rather spend around £20 for what they offer than hundreds for what iRacing does.

 

[Simon Trendell]

Codemasters licensed the Williams FW27 in Toca 3, and remember how bad that was? It doesn’t guarantee quality, as the teams do it for additional revenue.

Yes a license to have it's likeness in the game, which is pretty much about letting someone from Codies go to Williams and take some pictures and give them to a 3D modeller and then bodge some vaguely believable physics together and release it.

Whereas the iRacing were allowed to laser scan the car and work closely with Williams' own simulator team (one of whom has been active on the iRacing member forums), so I think there's a bit more to this license than whatever else Williams have made a deal with. Can't remember the last time Williams put a press release about their car being in anything else:

http://www.attwilliams.com/downloads/pdf/14_01_10_iracing_final.pdf

 

[Kevin Watts]

Codemasters licenced the Williams FW27 in Toca 3, and remember how bad that was? It doesn’t guarantee quality, as the teams do it for additional revenue. I take the opinion of an F1 team member over Indy/Nascar because I actually enjoy the racing, it’s widely considered to be the most advanced form of motorsport, where simulation plays a massive role. Dale who? I’m just playing with you, but he’s hardly known worldwide is he?


Since when has popularity been an indication of quality? Particularly in gaming nowadays it seems the best titles sell the least. Who’s converting from tracks that are almost a decade old? The oldest I’ve seen in the sims I play’s a track from GTL, which’s five years old now?

You based your criticism around an anonymous remark reportedley made by a member of an F1 team. You made a point of embelishing your original comment in your next post. You say you'd take this anonymous F1 team members opinion over a list of named professional drivers. If you had read up a little on the development of iRacing but in particular the FW31 then you'd know they have a former race engineer with a CV as long as your arm to work on the physics and he's had close support from Williams while doing so. I'd take that over a GP4/GPL/GTL conversion or the mod of some guy sat in a basement guessign at the figures.

Way to end with a personal attack Kevin. I’ve explained why I tried the cracked version, which by the way actually made me feel more positive about iRacing, as I quite enjoyed the Skippy but I’m not going to buy it for aforementioned reasons. Oh and my 3 month subscription ended in June this year, I just didn’t use it that much, as it felt like the same old predictable sim’ that I had tried last year.

There was no personal attack, thats a pretty weak accusation. It was a statement of fact, you came here and took the thread off topic and you admitted to using an illegal cracked version. Its quite clear from what you posted you don't have a clue about anything close to being a recent version of iRacing.

 

[CAR]

Whereas the iRacing were allowed to laser scan the car and work closely with Williams' own simulator team (one of whom has been active on the iRacing member forums), so I think there's a bit more to this license than whatever else Williams have made a deal with. Can't remember the last time Williams put a press release about their car being in anything else:

Well it’s in Williams interest to promote the product, as maybe next time they can ask for more money In Toca 3 the car didn’t even have a 7th gear, so I’m guessing as you say they had very little access (maybe none at all), and only paid to have a big name in the game.

If you had read up a little on the development of iRacing but in particular the FW31 then you'd know they have a former race engineer with a CV as long as your arm to work on the physics and he's had close support from Williams while doing so. I'd take that over a GP4/GPL/GTL conversion or the mod of some guy sat in a basement guessign at the figures.

What? We were talking about track conversions!

There was no personal attack, thats a pretty weak accusation. It was a statement of fact, you came here and took the thread off topic and you admitted to using an illegal cracked version. Its quite clear from what you posted you don't have a clue about anything close to being a recent version of iRacing.

I’ve had a total of 4 months as a iR subscriber, most recently ending a few months ago. Never mind though, those who claim the others ignorance normally do because they don’t have much of an argument, and this is becoming pretty repetitious on both sides.

 

[Kevin Watts]

Well it’s in Williams interest to promote the product, as maybe next time they can ask for more money In Toca 3 the car didn’t even have a 7th gear, so I’m guessing as you say they had very little access (maybe none at all), and only paid to have a big name in the game.


What? We were talking about track conversions!

I've already mentioned the track conversions in my last post, you questioned the quality of the iRacing FW31 with a childish comment about a game released years ago when its quite clear the difference between the target audience of those titles. As its obvious you've not read anything about the development of the car I commented on the pedigree of one of the team members responsible for the physics and also the close support he received from Williams. Your last reply only serves to show you have nothing of value to add to this particular point.

I’ve had a total of 4 months as a iR subscriber, most recently ending a few months ago. Never mind though, those who claim the others ignorance normally do because they don’t have much of an argument, and this is becoming pretty repetitious on both sides.

You can point the finger and call people ignorant, hurl accusations but it doesn't hide the fact that in one post you say you were a recent subscriber and yet in response to Glenn's comment about hosted racing you said "They didn’t have hosted racing when I was last in". Hosted racing was added to iRacing October 2009. Either you subscribed to iRacing and didn't pay any attention - in which case I'd question your assessment od iRacing or you were not a subscriber as recently as you say you were.

Back on topic

I don't think iRacing should auto renew but really the responsibility comes down to the user. I know its easy to forget but I've played a lot of online subscription based sims and all of them auto renew as well as many other day to day services such as car insurance etc.

 

[CAR]

I've already mentioned the track conversions in my last post, you questioned the quality of the iRacing FW31 with a childish comment about a game released years ago when its quite clear the difference between the target audience of those titles. As its obvious you've not read anything about the development of the car I commented on the pedigree of one of the team members responsible for the physics and also the close support he received from Williams. Your last reply only serves to show you have nothing of value to add to this particular point.

I brought it up because you made it sound like gaining a licence required some sort of special requirements (other than money). But again it’s common for people to want to end an argument that they’re losing track of.

You can point the finger and call people ignorant, hurl accusations but it doesn't hide the fact that in one post you say you were a recent subscriber and yet in response to Glenn's comment about hosted racing you said "They didn’t have hosted racing when I was last in". Hosted racing was added to iRacing October 2009. Either you subscribed to iRacing and didn't pay any attention - in which case I'd question your assessment od iRacing or you were not a subscriber as recently as you say you were.

Who did I call ignorant? During my free trial they didn’t have hosted racing, and that’s when I gave iR a proper go. My 3 months for the price of 1 offer was from March this year, but as it was the same predictable experience, I didn’t see the point of investing money in content that would allow me to join other league members I know in their hosted events (so again there was little motivation to race).

This only went off topic because you seem to automatically assume other people are idiots whilst not bothering to properly read the things they write (a great combo for a debate).

 

[Bram Hengeveld]

Guys make a seperate thread for this discussion please as again we are getting offtopic, or agree that you disagree would solve it also

 

[Kevin Watts]

I brought it up because you made it sound like gaining a licence required some sort of special requirements (other than money). But again it’s common for people to want to end an argument that they’re losing track of.

Who did I call ignorant? During my free trial they didn’t have hosted racing, and that’s when I gave iR a proper go. My 3 months for the price of 1 offer was from March this year, but as it was the same predictable experience, I didn’t see the point of investing money in content that would allow me to join other league members I know in their hosted events (so again there was little motivation to race).

This only went off topic because you seem to automatically assume other people are idiots whilst not bothering to properly read the things they write (a great combo for a debate).

You've still not responded with anything of value, instead creating a straw man argument. Again you take this discussion further off topic. Stay on topic or create another thread. You clearly said "They didn’t have hosted racing when I was last in" and as I pointed out hosted racing was added in October 2009, almost a full 12 months ago. You also said "There’s an old cracked version of iRacing, I gave it a go after my free trial" so your comments about iRacing are hardly relevant when you're talking about an online game that is constantly under development as other online only games are. Your comments have been disingenuous at best when it comes to your actual experience in iRacing. You took this off topic with your own limited out of date analysis and one anonymous comment from someone who claims to be a member of a top F1 team. Thats not what this topic was about.

 

[Kevin Watts]

Sorry Bram you replied just before I finished my post

 

[CAR]

You've still not responded with anything of value, instead creating a straw man argument. Again you take this discussion further off topic. Stay on topic or create another thread. You clearly said "They didn’t have hosted racing when I was last in" and as I pointed out hosted racing was added in October 2009, almost a full 12 months ago. You also said "There’s an old cracked version of iRacing, I gave it a go after my free trial" so your comments about iRacing are hardly relevant when you're talking about an online game that is constantly under development as other online only games are. Your comments have been disingenuous at best when it comes to your actual experience in iRacing. You took this off topic with your own limited out of date analysis and one anonymous comment from someone who claims to be a member of a top F1 team. Thats not what this topic was about.

This will be my last post on the matter (promise), as I have no intention of discussing iR, as everyone already knows where an honest debate on the matter almost inevitably leads & I was only in this section because someone posted the Greger Huttu article in the wrong place.

Again, again (like a sodding Teletubbies episode I’m having to explain myself), after my 3 month subscription ended only a few months ago I came to the conclusion that it felt exactly the same as during my trial last year. I didn’t try hosted racing because to race with people I know would have meant a significant investment in content. Yes I noticed there were new features, but until the new tyre model comes along nothing will change the feel (or lack of), so I continued playing a sim’ which already has its tyre model spot on. Surely it tells you something that the other major sims all have new tyre models coming doesn’t it?

Claims to be a member of a top team? It was an in-depth article with a top team! I thought this whole thread was about people feeling short-changed by iRacing, be it because there’s no offline mode or the auto-renewal thing. My opinion is that iR is at its core very ordinary, and others feel the same, so of course the comments from a front running F1 team are going to make me laugh (out loud as they actually did). If you can’t handle differing opinions that’s fine, just try not to make people look like idiots in an attempt to dismiss their views, as it’s fairly childish and also pretty moronic.

 

[Kevin Watts]

This will be my last post on the matter (promise), as I have no intention of discussing iR, as everyone already knows where an honest debate on the matter almost inevitably leads & I was only in this section because someone posted the Greger Huttu article in the wrong place.

Again, again (like a sodding Teletubbies episode I’m having to explain myself), after my 3 month subscription ended only a few months ago I came to the conclusion that it felt exactly the same as during my trial last year. I didn’t try hosted racing because to race with people I know would have meant a significant investment in content. Yes I noticed there were new features, but until the new tyre model comes along nothing will change the feel (or lack of), so I continued playing a sim’ which already has its tyre model spot on. Surely it tells you something that the other major sims all have new tyre models coming doesn’t it?

Claims to be a member of a top team? It was an in-depth article with a top team! I thought this whole thread was about people feeling short-changed by iRacing, be it because there’s no offline mode or the auto-renewal thing. My opinion is that iR is at its core very ordinary, and others feel the same, so of course the comments from a front running F1 team are going to make me laugh (out loud as they actually did). If you can’t handle differing opinions that’s fine, just try not to make people look like idiots in an attempt to dismiss their views, as it’s fairly childish and also pretty moronic.

"They didn’t have hosted racing when I was last in" or "after my 3 month subscription ended only a few months ago" when you contradict yourself like this and talk of using illegal copies of the software its no wonder people have a hard time believing what you say. You say you noticed new features but didn't notice one of the biggest, if not thee biggest one added a year ago, one that many people asked for and a feature the divided many racers. It says nothing about netkar that other development teams are developing their own tyre models, Live For Speed has already done it, its like claiming netkar invented the wheel - its a natural progression of sims. If we had the perfect sim we'd all be playing it, I have never portrayed iRacing as being perfect.

You still cling to that anonymous quote, its still just one quote amongst many more vouching for the accuracy of iRacing. For someone who whined about a perceived personal attack when there was no such thing you are quick to hand out the insults. Different opinions are fine. I posted replies to your posts with facts and information and now you're getting upset. A forum is a place for debate, if you cannot handle the subsequant discussion and analysis of your comments then thats really your problem.