Alfa Romeo Tipo 33 TT 12

Cars Alfa Romeo Tipo 33 TT 12 1.0

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I like this car and I'm not a good modder. However, after running an online 24 lap race recently on the Kyalami 1967 track, I think there should be some things worth taking a look into for a possible future update. This is solely my opinion on driving these kinds of cars and in general this one seems too grippy.

First of all, I was curious and checked the F1 Grand Prix laptimes of 1973, 1974 and 1975. They were at 1:16s in qualifying. With the Alfa Romeo Tipo 33 TT12 we managed to have 1:11s for the pole followed by several 1:12s , and mostly 1:13s and 1:14s in the ~30 car grid. We started at 95% track grip which rubbered in to almost 98% at the end of qualifying. We ran at 18C/25C air/track temps which was realistic for our own race date. The real South Africa F1 races could have taken place in warmer conditions since it would be summer there when they ran it in the season. But still, not tropical summers. Of course, the soft tire was used for qualifying in our race.

This all might be a simplistic and incomplete approach of mine looking at it. I like more how this type of car drives on harder tire but would be even better with decreased rear wing effect.

- So, rear wing IMO seems to have too much effect, since running as low as 0 rear wing at this historic Kyalami brought 310+ kmh top speeds before T1, at 100 m braking point and no real threat of spinning out anywhere on track, even with running V70 tires. The fastest times in the race with 0 wing and V70 was 1:13s, and with soft tires 1:12s. There is no real penalty but a reward for using very low settings on the rear wing since the car is very understeery to begin with. Many mods are like this with rear wing and was always curious what actually means 0 rear wing. The question is where would I need the default middle value wing if it brings so much drag and grip, and with it, a lot of understeer. Despite the fact that changing suspension settings can help a bit but it's not enough.

- Tires grip seems too much for all three tires available.

- Soft tires, even with tendency to heat up a lot through out the run, can last the whole 24 lap race at a fast track like the old Kyalami.

- tcurve_hard is available but the soft, hard and V70 tires use the same temperature performance curve.

- Maybe there are some differences, but Firestone V70 and slick hard tire seem to be pretty much the same in general grip and wear.

- Soft tire seems to have more grip on the more common race distances than the hard tire.
at 7 vKM for soft tire grip is 98; at 22 vKM for soft tire grip is 96 then falls flat to 90 at 24 vKM
at 11 vKM for hard tire grip is 98; at at 20vKM for hard tire grip is 95 then falls flat from there

The pace difference can be about 1.5 seconds on this short fast track, depending on fuel loads. If you're going to take softs and lower fuel load, even with a pitstop you're going to outrun easily someone on hard tire and with more fuel and no pitstop.

- Pitstops:
[PIT_STOP]
TYRE_CHANGE_TIME_SEC=10
FUEL_LITER_TIME_SEC=0.1
Pitstop times indicate a very quick pitstop for this car with a quick 10 second tire change and 100 liters refuel for the same amount of time which is a bit more than its full fuel tank.

So, in view of no danger of overheating with low downforce, and the life of the soft tire, there seems to be hardly any time to use the harder tire compound anywhere, even on a fast corner circuit like this.

- Gear changes - possibly, gear changes are quicker for users with auto clutch and paddles against manual clutch and gearshift.
 
Again, if you use the aero app you'll see that, for example, both Ferrari 312T and Lotus 72D (I know they are different cars, it's just to give an example) create half the downforce of the Alfa Romeo 33tt. And this seems strange to me. I also found this http://www.mulsannescorner.com/data.html a sort of "aerodynamics database" which also provides the sources from which the data is taken. If you look at some closed wheel protoype from the 1970s, you'll see that they can't generate the downforce of this mod. For instance a 1977 Porsche 936 produces 332 kg at 290 km/h.
Probably best to include this right away instead of acting like an ass. That way others don't have to dispute your claims. "Again," stating your thoughts as a fact also kind of does that, as you're not exactly sure it cannot generate this downforce ("seems strange to me" and "some" is not the same as "exactly this").

If you want to be helpful, be helpful.
 
Probably best to include this right away instead of acting like an ass. That way others don't have to dispute your claims. "Again," stating your thoughts as a fact also kind of does that, as you're not exactly sure it cannot generate this downforce ("seems strange to me" and "some" is not the same as "exactly this").

If you want to be helpful, be helpful.
I didn't want to sound rude or anything, I just told what "problem" I think this mod has. That's it. Then someone replied to my comment in a passive-aggressive way and I replied with the same tone. I never wanted to be an ass or something, I'm sorry if I gave you this impression
 
About the steering wheel, it might be too small.
You see, the model in rF2 is scaled 13% too big compared to the real car (and the rF2 physics make no sense, and wheelbase 2.7m vs 2.340 ) ((seems Arch used WHEELBASE=2.233448 for some reason)).

The lovely little girl you are caressing in your hands... is a small one, exactly 87% size, but now matches reality (except maybe the wheel)
Have you rescaled the car to correct size or is it still 87%?
 
It drives good, but has too much downforce. 600 kg at 275 km/h is not realistic for an early '70s car, at that speed 300 kg should be fine. If you fix it I'm ready to give you 5 stars, because apart from that, the mod is fantastic

I have been re-making physics on the "C" version and the aero is closer to what you describe. Future update will eliminate the non-C version completely.
 
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