2014 Formula One Japanese Grand Prix

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So then we agree its first of all a driver mistake (taking too much risk). (Un)fortunately F1 is all about taking risks and these things can happen, its part of the job.

And these conditions weren't really that hard compared to full wet races in the past. The moment the safety car went in for the first time the first thing Button did was changing to intermediates (taking a risk).

Instead of sending the SC out with each drop of rain they should just continue and race with full wets. If drivers feel that it's becoming too dangerous due to a lack of grip or aquaplaning, slow down. Its really that simple imo.
 
It wasn't that wet since everyone was in intermediate tires... The problem here... Marshall in station 12 was waving double yellow flag but only when the truck was still in his area. Right after the truck goes 2 meters behind he waves green. In my opinion, despite being right what he did because the truck wasn't in his area anymore, he should have waited the truck to be inside the barriers before changing the flags... Too cocky with the distances. And, unfortunately, Bianchi was a bit too fast because he saw that green flag... The marshall is not necessary wrong, just a bit too precise.

EDIT: Just saw Bram post. Fully agree.
 
It wasn't that wet since everyone was in intermediate tires... The problem here... Marshall in station 12 was waving double yellow flag but only when the truck was still in his area. Right after the truck goes 2 meters behind he waves green. In my opinion, despite being right what he did because the truck wasn't in his area anymore, he should have waited the truck to be inside the barriers before changing the flags... Too cocky with the distances. And, unfortunately, Bianchi was a bit too fast because he saw that green flag... The marshall is not necessary wrong, just a bit too precise.

EDIT: Just saw Bram post. Fully agree.

He couldn't even see the flag post over the crest at the point where he lost control, and his dash must have been lighting up the yellows still, as he was still in the yellow zone.

I have yet to see any evidence of anything the marshalls did to cause the crash. The only issue is - as Brundle has said numerous times before - the safety car not coming out when you have these collection vehicles out on track, especially with dangerous corners like these where you could lose it any time in the wet.
 
He couldn't even see the flag post over the crest at the point where he lost control, and his dash must have been lighting up the yellows still, as he was still in the yellow zone.

I have yet to see any evidence of anything the marshalls did to cause the crash. The only issue is - as Brundle has said numerous times before - the safety car not coming out when you have these collection vehicles out on track, especially with dangerous corners like these where you could lose it any time in the wet.

Yeah, I agree. Marshalls did nothing to cause the crash. I just said that the marshall in post 12 was a bit too cocky (not sure is the right term but...).

Well, they were waving double yellow flags. I don't know if there was the need to deploy safety car...
 
So, they where considering having standing starts after Safety Car has been out, due give the specators more action, but they don't want to deploy a SC when a effin tractor is "out on track" to pick up a vehicle because it "ruins the race"? What gives?
Imo, if any vehicle but a F1 car needs to enter the track the Safety Car should be deployed for the sake of security (funny how it's called a "safety" car right?), it wasn't and that is the problem that needs to be reviewed for future races, end of that discussion for me.
Whether we need to deploy a SC for picking up debris on track (like they do in Nascar) is another question, but I'm not opposed that either tbh. Focus should be minimizing the time the SC needs to be out while maintaining the maximum possible security for both drivers, spectators and all other personell involved in a race weekend.
 
Situations like that happened a lot of times before without the need of deploying the safety car. It's something to be reviewed specially after this crash.. But something we can't deny that Jules was driving a bit too fast on that zone...
 
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A Statement from the family of Jules Bianchi Yokkaichi, Japan 7 October 2014, 23.00hrs local/15.00hrs BST

The following statement is provided by the family of Jules Bianchi, in conjunction with the Mie General Medical Center, and is distributed on their behalf by the Marussia F1 Team.

“This is a very difficult time for our family, but the messages of support and affection for Jules from all over the world have been a source of great comfort to us. We would like to express our sincere appreciation.

Jules remains in the Intensive Care Unit of the Mie General Medical Center in Yokkaichi. He has suffered a diffuse axonal injury and is in a critical but stable condition. The medical professionals at the hospital are providing the very best treatment and care and we are grateful for everything they have done for Jules since his accident.

We are also grateful for the presence of Professor Gerard Saillant, President of the FIA Medical Commission, and Professor Alessandro Frati, Neurosurgeon of the University of Rome La Sapienza, who has travelled to Japan at the request of Scuderia Ferrari. They arrived at the hospital today and met with the medical personnel responsible for Jules’ treatment, in order to be fully informed of his clinical status so that they are able to advise the family. Professors Saillant and Frati acknowledge the excellent care being provided by the Mie General Medical Center and would like to thank their Japanese colleagues.

The hospital will continue to monitor and treat Jules and further medical updates will be provided when appropriate.”

------------

From Wikipedia on a Diffuse Axonal Injury

Diffuse axonal injury (DAI) is one of the most common and devastating types of traumatic brain injury,[1] meaning that damage occurs over a more widespread area than in focal brain injury. DAI, which refers to extensive lesions in white matter tracts, is one of the major causes of unconsciousness and persistent vegetative state after head trauma.[2] It occurs in about half of all cases of severe head trauma.

It is thought that diffuse axonal injury can occur in just about every level of severity, with concussion thought to be one of the milder forms. In mild to moderate forms of diffuse axonal injury, recovery is possible, with the mildest forms of diffuse axonal injury often resulting in few if any long-term issues.

The outcome is frequently coma, with over 90% of patients with severe DAI never regaining consciousness.[2] Those who do wake up often remain significantly impaired.[3]
 
That is bad news. But the accident was as bad as one can design it to be. Also on the first eFormula race last corner accident was close, if you look at it frame by frame, decapitation was close there. Two things need to change: track procedures 1) and open cockpit 2)

1) Yellow light and second speedlimiter. No safetycar but reduced speed. Safetycar can not keep up the speed F1 need to survive. They are breathing in such low mass of air where they are not designed to work. It needs the speed thru corners, more than any safetycar or safetycar driver can provide. Only a speed limiter can, if every driver gets a light in his cockpit that it's "full course yellow", they can't exceed certain speed on track. How that speed is calculated and is it mean average of laptime instead of set speed is up to discussion. This is also allows the study of automated control, can race director just press a button to make every car go from driver to race control (not suddenly without warning, of course) But if every car has a big button on the middle of the wheel and it starts flashing yellow, you need to press that button in 5 seconds or face penalty, that sort of simple mechanism.. FIA boffins are way more clever than i am.

2) Closed cockpits are here. And it's about time. When we moved thru 90s and the helmets kept getting more and more less visible, we changed along the line. Our focus moved. No one looks at the helmets on track anymore. We haven't seen hands move since 1989. So don't give me bullcrap about that aspect as it has been long gone. I admit that it's a nice look, open cockpit but closed cockpit is safer, more aerodynamic, every single aspect apart from history supports closed cockpit. It can be made to be reliably removable as the current driver safety gear, we are not talking about a twisted metal hull but a canopy which shape and modern materials allows it to be super strong, enough to withstand what happened to poor Jules..... It is absolutely insane that drivers are driving with their heads out. I could understand any other body part that the one holding your brains. Open cockpit needs to go.

We have a case, with clear evidence, good data of the impact, conditions, everything we need to not have this happen ever again.
 
I'm almost sure the cockpit hood would not have changed much in this accident. However I'm all in for it because it is safer in many other situations.

About the automatic speed limits replacing SC, total agreement with the idea, all the DRS stuff already involves remote control from FIA, it is a minor extra detail to make it possible.

Furthermore, on tricky situations you could activate every safety gimmick that we have ditched for the sake of the show: traction control, ABS, speed limit...
 
hmm does anyone else think it is time to look at Parc Ferme when their is a change to climactic conditions, now that Gear selections is locked in for a full season, does anyone else think that when their is a change to conditions then the teams should be allowed to change things such as ride height, rear wing settings, suspension stiffness and so on?
 
does anyone else think it is time to look at Parc Ferme when their is a change to climactic conditions (...)
does anyone else think that when their is a change to conditions (...)
Wow... I (kind of) understand misspelling "they're" as "their", but how big of a bump to the head do you need to write "their" instead of "there"? :rolleyes:
Anyway, park ferme conditions apply between the end of qualifying and beginning of the race. After it starts, the teams can do with the car whatever they please. The thing is - they rarely have enough time for that. Last Sunday they did have time though - during the red flag period from lap 2 - and I remember the guys from Sky saying that some of the teams would change some stuff on their (see what I did there? :whistling:) cars to make them more drivable in conditions MUCH worse than during qualifying.
 
Wow... I (kind of) understand misspelling "they're" as "their", but how big of a bump to the head do you need to write "their" instead of "there"? :rolleyes:
Anyway, park ferme conditions apply between the end of qualifying and beginning of the race. After it starts, the teams can do with the car whatever they please. The thing is - they rarely have enough time for that. Last Sunday they did have time though - during the red flag period from lap 2 - and I remember the guys from Sky saying that some of the teams would change some stuff on their (see what I did there? :whistling:) cars to make them more drivable in conditions MUCH worse than during qualifying.
oops haha I think I need to go back to school :) that is the first time in years I have made that mistake :cry:
 
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