PC2 PC 2 Physics

[danracer2000]

Please i have watched some youtube videos , graphics are impresive (betther than PC: amazing work), BUT the real question is HOW ABOUT the physics??, and actually to which actual game it could be compared in term of physics?

Thank you guys.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

Whilst it should be common sense that we can't simulate at 100%, it should be obvious what is or isn't a sim based on knowledge of real world behaviour.

I can describe many rwb that proper Sims replicate, but what I'm curious about is those who do consider it a sim, what rwb convinces you?

 

[apex11]

Whilst it should be common sense that we can't simulate at 100%, it should be obvious what is or isn't a sim based on knowledge of real world behaviour.

I can describe many rwb that proper Sims replicate, but what I'm curious about is those who do consider it a sim, what rwb convinces you?

I think with physics i don't want to ever be thinking "well what just happened there" for me RF2 is wrong to the point of broken with FWD, RRE is about perfect with FWD and thats based on me having had a few FWD track cars and being lucky enough to test drive 2 FWD racing cars in real life.
But a simulation in a the game context has to take into account the whole package as ayou could simply sk the question "does it simulate racing" and in that case its not physics so much as how the AI behaves etc, or how pit stops function etc.
Its not simply simulating physics is it? It simulates what it 'feels' like to be in a race...its a loaded question.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

I think with physics i don't want to ever be thinking "well what just happened there" for me RF2 is wrong to the point of broken with FWD, RRE is about perfect with FWD and thats based on me having had a few FWD track cars and being lucky enough to test drive 2 FWD racing cars in real life.
But a simulation in a the game context has to take into account the whole package as ayou could simply sk the question "does it simulate racing" and in that case its not physics so much as how the AI behaves etc, or how pit stops function etc.
Its not simply simulating physics is it? It simulates what it 'feels' like to be in a race...its a loaded question.

to me the core of a driving /racing sim is the physics/ffb calibration.

If we're to accept your broader definition it would come at the expense of the physics/ffb.

 

[apex11]

to me the core of a driving /racing sim is the physics/ffb calibration.

If we're to accept your broader definition it would come at the expense of the physics/ffb.

Well i'm simply pointing out that actually a 'game' is simulating racing / maybe pit stops, tire wear track temp etc, so in theory you could have amazing physics but rubbish racing i.e. bad AI.
I agree that for me unless the general feel is the same of which i'm used to when driving a car then i'll be put off, i need a good feel for turn in and the ability to lean on the FFB to a degree, then after that its simply a case of how the car can be pushed around the track.
But for sure once you have that feel then the rest then takes over and a game that simulates racing should be simulating the race weekend feel and stuff like AI.
So a game like F1 2017 can be simulating the idea of what an F1 driver may experience if not the full feeling of being in an F1 car for example.
Back in the days when i was playing Geoff Crammonds F1 on the amiga i didn't think it was simulating me actually driving an F1 car but at the same time i absolutely loved playing that game and in my head it all felt brilliant.
I think that was the case with many of the early games you needed your own imagination more...i now find myself looking for a sim to replicate what i feel at track days and that's a big ask but its just about possible...but in that i think i have lost some of the pure enjoyment from it...or maybe i just have too much choice now and maybe its my age...
Sometimes i simply think there is just too much to do now in any one game.

 

[2112]

Yesterday i unplugged my TX from the PC and stuck it back into my xbox and fired it up, i'd put 600 odd hours into PCars on xbox and it really did start me fully down this path to sim racing as actual hobby and stopping track days etc.
So then i found myself with a PC with more sim titles at my disposal.
Going back to Pcars 1 on xbox it still holds up pretty well but now looks less crisp compared to even RF2.
I'd just about got the FFB set right for some cars and it felt alright but really once you have played RF2 and RRE its just not good enough. I had PCars 1 on PC but felt it was pointless really so refunded it as aside from graphics it felt same as version on my xbox.

So yeah honestly, for me now i have access to RF2 etc i don't really see the point in PCars 2 and its still got similar issues as the first one, most likely i'll pick it up in a sale or out of curiosity get on steam and play and decide if i should refund it back.
Having played RRE after PCars 1 i found myself thinking why bother? RRE ticks so many boxes now and any it doesn't i stick on RF2 drive the USF2000 and realise that right there is about the best car in sim land right now for feel.
I can accept a game that costs £11.99 like RF2 to have hit and miss cars, but to hear things like PCars 2 having some terrible cars but a few worth driving " from GAMER MUSCLE from a game that the first one made millions is a bit of a kicker for me.
Nope i'm out.

I hear you. The thing for me, though, is the ability to race against others, and let us be honest: The two games that offer the most racing are PC and iRacing. The sims such as RRE, RF2, AC and AMS are, IMO, better than both iRacing and PC1 but their online presence kills the games as it is very difficult to find a race. At least it is for me.

But...

I say this one night after playing PC2 and I can state in no uncertain terms that I feel PC 2 will take a lot of traffic from the other games. And it will enjoy the history of PC1's ability to generate an on-line presence. The improvements in PC2 will bring back a lot who left the game due to the physics issues. And those people will pass the word to others who are either looking for a cheaper alternative to iRacing, or a game in which you have many options to race in anger. On servers that do not feature the same cars on the same track for a year or two, like AC does.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

Well i'm simply pointing out that actually a 'game' is simulating racing / maybe pit stops, tire wear track temp etc, so in theory you could have amazing physics but rubbish racing i.e. bad AI.
.

This is more of a budgetary problem than a definition IMO, the small PC sim developers often don't have the cash so they prioritize physics/ffb.
At the end of the day, having epic pit stop mechanics won't make me a fast real world driver.
There's nothing wrong with liking pcars 2 or the way it drives, but I have huge doubts as to whether it deserves the title of sim, at least according to my definition.

 

[apex11]

This is more of a budgetary problem than a definition IMO, the small PC sim developers often don't have the cash so they prioritize physics/ffb.
At the end of the day, having epic pit stop mechanics won't make me a fast real world driver.
There's nothing wrong with liking pcars 2 or the way it drives, but I have huge doubts as to whether it deserves the title of sim, at least according to my definition.

No, they are all simulating racing. I won't get Pcars 2 as I'm nuts deep into RRE and RF2 and have iRacing, I don't need Pcars 2 like I needed Pcars 1. I hate to be that guy, But if you own a PC, Pcars franchise is irrelevant IMO...

 

[Chobonator]

No, they are all simulating racing. I won't get Pcars 2 as I'm nuts deep into RRE and RF2 and have iRacing, I don't need Pcars 2 like I needed Pcars 1. I hate to be that guy, But if you own a PC, Pcars franchise is irrelevant IMO...

Your opinion is wrong, but I think I get why. Looks like you played the bad one and now you won't try the amazing one. Perfectly understandable.

I think what I did right is not forcing it with Project CARS. I thought it was crap, like a Shift 3 Unleashed. There was a big FFB overhaul, and that made only two cars playable for me.

Project CARS 2 is the most thoughtful and intuitive racing game I've ever played, and it also feels great with minimum tweaking, like a big budget rFactor 3 made by someone who's in love with motorsports and not just simulation.

 

[apex11]

Maybe, gamer muscle said that compared to RRE and AC and rf2 PCars 2 is nowhere near as good for the ffb and physics so as a PC player why would I bother though? I may as well wait till it is in a steam sale, we gave so much choice and not much play time, so it's very simple for me to just skip PCars 2... I'm currently sat in my rig waiting to qualify on iRacing just an hour to kill before bed, happy with that.

 

[Chobonator]

Maybe, gamer muscle said that compared to RRE and AC and rf2 PCars 2 is nowhere near as good for the ffb and physics so as a PC player why would I bother though? I may as well wait till it is in a steam sale, we gave so much choice and not much play time, so it's very simple for me to just skip PCars 2... I'm currently sat in my rig waiting to qualify on iRacing just an hour to kill before bed, happy with that.

If you play iRacing on a regular basis, don't get Project CARS 2, otherwise that very expensive NASCAR mod will feel even worse than usual in comparison.

 

[apex11]

Well I'm sat here qualify in against 20 drivers in Mazda mx 5 having felt the most amazing ffb and feel from the virtual car, why in God's name would I ever want PCars 2?
Even more so when I could stick rf2 on after or RRE or AC..come on.

 

[sambat29]

Yes you are right, why drink red wine while I love white wine, why make love with a blonde woman, while I love brown, it also applies to beer, everyone does as he wants.
but one will have regrets, the one who has never tried either red wine or blondes.

 

[apex11]

Yes you are right, why drink red wine while I love white wine, why make love with a blonde woman, while I love brown, it also applies to beer, everyone does as he wants.
but one will have regrets, the one who has never tried either red wine or blondes.

You maybe just need to lay off the wine mate...Jesus.

If you only own a console then get PCars 2, if you own a PC you have rf2 or AMS, with rf2 it has a car which if it was the only car available in sim land id not be bothered, the USF2000 in rf2 is the best virtual representation of a racing car ever IMO, it's just perfect, there is nothing PCars 2 can give me that I can't get in other games, I don't feel I'm missing out on anything by not getting PCars 2.

 

[blanes]

@totheapex - Why do you keep trying to convince people here of your belief? Your assertions are based on hearsay of someone else. Just go play iRacing and be happy, seems you might feel bit insecure and want some validation but you will only truly know once you spend proper time racing pC2. And yes it definitely feels like the best of AC & rf2 but with so much more, but of course feel free to believe otherwise.

 

[Chobonator]

You maybe just need to lay off the wine mate...Jesus.

If you only own a console then get PCars 2, if you own a PC you have rf2 or AMS, with rf2 it has a car which if it was the only car available in sim land id not be bothered, the USF2000 in rf2 is the best virtual representation of a racing car ever IMO, it's just perfect, there is nothing PCars 2 can give me that I can't get in other games, I don't feel I'm missing out on anything by not getting PCars 2.

Project CARS 2 simulates more stuff than rFactor 2, gets a higher % of cars right, has more options, better visuals, similar performance and is only getting started.

I normally don't tell people that they are missing out, because it's condescending, but since you said that you're not missing out, I'm telling you that you're missing out. It's like the sequel to a bad movie, but the actors are different, the director is different, the scriptwriter is different, it's shot in the same location, but with better equipment. So what if it's called Pennsylvania Commando 2?

 

[GT VIRUS]

Where are all these good FFB comments coming from? It felt like there was a horrible strong center spring always implemented, and it ruins it for me.

And there is far far far too much grip everywhere. Doubly so in the wet. And then there is the horrible artificial effects, like the extra drag in the wet, the canned tyre hop effect, and the terrible grip and spin effect when you touch the sand. Absolutely horrible from a simulation point of view

 

[Chobonator]

And there is far far far too much grip everywhere.

Possibly, but compared to what?

 

[GT VIRUS]

Possibly, but compared to what?

Real life. I've raced in most conditions, and nothing about this game's driving was realistic

 

[cpt_gandy]

Where are all these good FFB comments coming from? It felt like there was a horrible strong center spring always implemented, and it ruins it for me.

It does seem there is some possible issues with certain makes of ffb wheels which effects some direct drive and belt driven wheels. I have no issues with my G29 and the ffb has been very good for me to the point where it is damm close to AC. In AC i have to use a lut file to get the most out of the ffb.

 

[apex11]

The issue of grip is probably the greatest achievement of PCars, that SMS listened to actual drivers telling them how much grip is available in a real racing car etc.
Nic Hamilton i know was very very vocal on sims not simulating grip well enough.
Also in PCars 2 defense can someone confirm that in the snow you get studded tyres? If so there is your grip, same with wet tyres on wet track, the only time there would be an issue of grip is if your suing the wrong tyres on the track so slicks on wet track etc...
So many people would be shocked at what grip a racing car can give. Hell look how much you can push the average road car FFS.

There is some online documents from Nic and Ben (Collins) to SMS staff bout how racing cars feel and Ben Collins is telling them how easy to drive the 1970's F1 are and how the idea they were simply trying to kill you at every corner was false, this mythical thing of racing cars being impossible to drive and the only reason they dont skid off is the driver is a joke and even more stupid when you see the amount of wings and rubber they carry, THAT is what makes them stick around corners FFS!!