FOV with something new.

[David Cordell]

I just noticed something that I don't recall being mentioned in all the other threads around the simosphere about FOV(field of view).

For the longest time I played with a FOV much higher than my calculated correct FOV because at first I didn't know any better and then once I learned the basics, I wouldn't lower it much because it was too hard to get used to. Once I finally forced myself to start lowering it, I found it to be true what all the FOV nerds would say about it being easier to hit braking points and how it hinders peripheral vision with the single monitor.

My correct FOV for my monitor and eye point relationship is 31degrees. Up until a few weeks ago I have been running around 44-48deg which was much better than the 65-70degs I ran for a long time before that and my lap times and consistency got much better the lower I took the FOV and closer to correct.

In the last couple weeks I decided to force myself to slowly and incrementally take the FOV to 31deg. When I finally got to 31 I noticed 3 things....

1. Peripheral vision got horrible so I turned on all 3 virtual mirrors and that cured that issue.
2. My lap times continued to fall due to being able brake even later with much more control.
3. The rotational rate of the car(world), in sharper corners, for the first time looks right.

Number 3 is the new and fantastic revelation of using my calculated correct FOV. With higher FOV's and in sharp corners, the car(world) always looked like it was rotating too slowly and It tricked my brain into thinking the rear was sliding even though it wasn't and it made it difficult to catch a slide when the rear was really sliding because of this overly slow rotation due to the pinched view of the world.

It's like a whole new world in sim racing now. I am able to get through the esses at Mid Ohio and the hairpin at Sebring with ease and without the sense of the car over steering when it's not. I am not sure what the scientific term for this phenomenon is but I would like to know.

For the record, I am not an FOV nazi that thinks everyone should use their calculated correct FOV. I have never heard anyone mention this aspect of it before and just wanted to let others know.

 

[Hash_V8]

Had same thing a while back, had similar FOV as you on calculator (34), but refused to drop that low because I felt wasn't right, but one day forced myself and simply adjusted seat to suit and wow what a difference, I now see wrong FOV's straight away, its that much of difference, my wheel is almost right on my screen, so noticed when correct FOV, the in game wheel is both the same size relevant to my wheel, and the positions line up perfectly, this just confirmed it for me, so yeah use the calculators and try to stick with it even if feels strange at first, IMO.

 

[ouvert]

yep .. the only right way for me .. 33 .. looks right, feels right

 

[Blkout]

It's a great way to cheat just like using the bumper camera in games that allow it. With nothing to block your view of course it's easier to hit brake points. Its just not realistic at all but some people will trade realism for an advantage.

 

[JeffL]

It's a great way to cheat

It's not cheating using a fov calc to get realistic eyepoint. lol With my setup it is 29 and it feels like driving a car (Triples).

 

[David Cordell]

It's a great way to cheat just like using the bumper camera in games that allow it. With nothing to block your view of course it's easier to hit brake points. Its just not realistic at all but some people will trade realism for an advantage.

Oh good grief......it has nothing to do with the dash or a-pillar blocking the view.

FOV is totally different than seat position. Changing FOV makes it look like you moved the seat/camera forward with a lower FOV and rearward with a higher FOV but the camera/seat position has not changed at all. It's like a camera with a zoom lens changing focal length. To help you understand, go into hood view or bumper view so there is no dash blocking the view and try running some laps at 100deg FOV and then try some laps at 50deg FOV and then see how much harder it is to hit a braking point or apex when the view is at 100.

The main point of this thread was to discuss how a higher than calculated correct FOV compresses the image around the vertical axis causing the rotation of the world to appear to rotate slower than it really is which makes it difficult to negotiate tight turns and this effect worsens the higher the FOV is.

 

[Blkout]

I have my opinion like everyone else. I knew my response would ruffle feathers and don't care. I use triple 30" monitors myself and I don't like any of the FOV calculators. They sure make it easier though since most of the view is completely unobstructed. Might as well just run bumper can when its allowed or is that cheating?

 

[David Cordell]

I have my opinion like everyone else. I knew my response would ruffle feathers and don't care. I use triple 30" monitors myself and I don't like any of the FOV calculators. They sure make it easier though since most of the view is completely unobstructed. Might as well just run bumper can when its allowed or is that cheating?

Wow! Like I said before, FOV has absolutely nothing to do with the dash or how much of the track you can see vs the dash, pillars, etc. Seeing more or less of the dash is just a side effect of the focal length of the lens changing.

 

[Hash_V8]

I have my opinion like everyone else. I knew my response would ruffle feathers and don't care. I use triple 30" monitors myself and I don't like any of the FOV calculators. They sure make it easier though since most of the view is completely unobstructed. Might as well just run bumper can when its allowed or is that cheating?

You completely misunderstand FOV then, sit in your car, have a frame or imagine one same size as monitor, now hold it where your monitor sits, thats what you should see in game, its supposed to be a window to game world, a wrong FOV means wrong scaling etc, sorry if my explanation confuses you more, its what made me understand it,using correct FOV to cheat isn't really a opinion, its just wrong.

 

[JeffL]

You have right to your own opinion not your own facts.

 

[JeffL]

29 degrees how is that unobstructed

 

[RaceWasGood]

sit in your car, have a frame or imagine one same size as monitor, now hold it where your monitor sits, thats what you should see in game

Best "sim-FOV vs reality" explanation ever

 

[ouvert]

It's a great way to cheat just like using the bumper camera in games that allow it. With nothing to block your view of course it's easier to hit brake points. Its just not realistic at all but some people will trade realism for an advantage.

it has nothing to do with that
correct FOV is about having proportions and perpective right ..
50m looks like 50m and not like 200m -> you can judge your brakepoints better
Oponents cars have corect dimension so it is easier to judge their distances from you, curves have correct angles and are not flatened like with higher FOV ... you still have pillar and dashboard in sight .. basically you making it look like you are sitting in real car with limitations to pheripheral vision (unless you have tripple screen .. and with tripple screen it is the same, you just add pheripehral vision on the sides with two extra monitors .. but the middle screen still looks like single screen with correct FOV), and some just can`t addapt to it and go for little bit higgher setting as a compromise (40 instead of 33 for example) ..
Off course it is just mathematically correct FOV (where distances, perpective, scaling is like in real life) and it doesn`t mean it is the right one, whatever suits you

this is what you woud see in real car if you were looking through the monitor (the part in the rectangle, not whole picture)... most of us just moves seat back (not changing FOV) to have some dash in view and to see more on the sides ..

 

[Ari Antero]

There is a problem to calculate correct FOV in rFactor 2. Game is not Nvidia supported game and that means that when Nvidia releases new driver or when ISI i updates gMotor scaling is different.
ISI has been asked years to submit latest build of the rF2 executables to Nvidia so that an updated working rFactor2 profile can be created but nothing happens.

 

[ouvert]

There is a problem to calculate correct FOV in rFactor 2. Game is not Nvidia supported game and that means that when Nvidia releases new driver or when ISI i updates gMotor scaling is different.
ISI has been asked years to submit latest build of the rF2 executables to Nvidia so that an updated working rFactor2 profile can be created but nothing happens.

how is that related to FOV? if you have single 22 inch 16:9 screen, sitting 51cm far, your correct fov is 30 .. i use 16:10 ration so it is 33 for me .. works fine, exactly like in rF, GSC, AC and other using vFOV ... hFOV in pC would be 50

 

[Ari Antero]

how is that related to FOV? if you have single 22 inch 16:9 screen, sitting 51cm far, your correct fov is 30 .. i use 16:10 ration so it is 33 for me .. works fine, exactly like in rF, GSC, AC and other using vFOV ... hFOV in pC would be 50

rFactor2 has multiview UI but if you are using old style multiview with Nvidia bezel correction scaling is not right with current Nvidia driver 361.43, it is not possible to to calculate correct FOV. Nvidia driver 353.30 and 353.45 has correct scaling. However there has been number of new driver releases after 353.30 and 353.45 and they all have wrong scaling. Maybe you can test driver 353.30 or 353.45 vs 361.43 with single monitor and look if wrong scaling has also effect to single screen?

 

[Emery]

Who still uses the old style multiview? I think by now, most are using the ctrl-= multiview if they're using multiview at all.

 

[Ari Antero]

Oldd style multiview & Nvidia bezel correction makes life more easy if you are playing also other games like rFactor, GSC, pCars etc. which don`t have proper multiview UI like rFactor2 and iRacing have.
If you are using rFactor2 multiview UI and you have wrong scaling eye distance measure is wrong.

 

[ouvert]

rFactor2 has multiview UI but if you are using old style multiview with Nvidia bezel correction scaling is not right with current Nvidia driver 361.43, it is not possible to to calculate correct FOV. Nvidia driver 353.30 and 353.45 has correct scaling. However there has been number of new driver releases after 353.30 and 353.45 and they all have wrong scaling. Maybe you can test driver 353.30 or 353.45 vs 361.43 with single monitor and look if wrong scaling has also effect to single screen?

Nah, single screen is fine

 

[Ari Antero]

How do you know that if you don`t test it and compare 353.30 and 353.45 vs 361.43?