Built report: Basic rig-upgrade for tactile feedback

[Squared Circle]

I'd like to start a thread showing the components of a tactile upgrade I recently made to my rig. I guess I would have done things in the wrong way and/or not have thought of important stuff at all without all the info shared by the usual suspects in this forum.
The idea of this post(s) is to share my upgrades with others in as much detail as possible. Not because I think the upgrades are the best possible but to make them clearly visible. On the other hand this will take some time so I plan to do this in multiple posts until all aspects are covered.

In general the upgrade is by far not as sophisticated as others have done it - but it can serve as a few ideas how to achieve good results (very good actually) from my specific starting points.

First off, here are before/after photos of the rig. Obvious differences are:
- The rig is now based on a platform
- Pedal area is modified
- There is some strange construction behind the seat
I'll get to those three things in the posts to come (hopefully over the next 5-10 days)
The obvious difference of the second monitor is of course not related to tactile feedback and has been added between original design an the recent upgrade.

I hope the series of posts will serve their purpose - if you have any questions, please ask.

 

[JohnBeardmore]

Squared Circle: Yes thank you for the details. It is especially useful as I am currently planning and building my rig. It is good to see how other people go about it.

It did make me laugh when you said the whole house was humming. I was imagining my wife's reaction if that was my rig.

I have most details sorted but it seems the isolation will take some thought and experimentation so it is great to get your feedback.

 

[Squared Circle]

@EsxPaul & @JohnBeardmore : You are welcome - in fact I feel a little proud whenever I get something to work DIY-wise without electrocuting myself on the way

 

[Brutal Deluxe]

Great write up and I'm really impressed with the pedal setup. I've used 4 similar isolators (but the male versions) on my V3 pedals and the same BST shakers. It didn't cross my mind to use them on brackets and gives me more options if I find the effort to revisit my install. To stop any movement of the pedals under hard braking I've hand tightened them as hard as I can, which has slightly hindered their ability to isolate. I think that my pedal setup could be improved and I'll probably try a slightly different approach if I ever upgrade to some sprints or ultimates. Will be great to get some further feedback when you come to upgrade. Keep enjoying it!

 

[Squared Circle]

Of course will write about the upgrade once I get the Sprints. Heard they should be available this summer again but I'm patient. If I would be even more patient I would wait for more or less unused Sprints to flood the market when people abandon what they were not really interested in before they were forced to stay at home.

 

[Squared Circle]

Now that my HE Sprints have arrived it was time for an update to the construction. The basic idea here is to mount the shakers to each pedal individually (to avoid L/R-crosstalk between the two front shakers). In any case the crosstalk under the one-piece-G29-pedals was a lot less present than one would think. I assume because the base is made of plastic and is not transferring the rattling a lot. To sum up: It was not bad and it got even a little better.
First a photo of the construction as it is now:

Each pedal is mounted to two 40x40mm extrusions which are also held together by a "heelplate" which is 160x40 profile (on top) as well as the bassshaker (below - invisible in this photo). The whole construction is mounted to the rig using the 40x30mm rubber known from previous posts. There are 10 (ten!) for the brake and 6 for the throttle.

Next photo shows the construction from the front. The bass shaker under the brake pedal (and the aluminium plate it is mounted to) is visible from here:

Now the interesing photo: From underneath.

Things to mention:
- The rubbers are mounted to the "outside" of both extrusions under the brake pedal (using L-brackets). I imagine that should give a little bit more stability than mounting directly under the extrusions. Originally I planned to do this with both pedals but then the pedals would be spaced too far apart (at least for the HE RJ9-cable connecting throttle to brake). I decided to move the pedals together by mounting the rubber directly under one of the throttle's extrusions and not mess with a cable extension. Brake and throttle pedal's centers are spaced around 155mm now. Had to convert some of the rubbers from Type-C to Type-B (with one threaded rod) by cutting 15mm rods.

- 4(!) rubber mounts only on the "rear" of the brake pedal's construction (bottom in photo). Those rubbers are good under pressure but weak when pulling forces are applied. With a brake like this the force goes to the front lifting the back. So I decided to use two more rubbers to reduce the pulling force per piece.

- 2 horizontal rubbers under the brake pedal (photo shows them vertically of course). The G29 pedals need a lot less force and this force is applied vertically as well as horizontally. The HE Sprint's brake is a different animal. Now there is a significant amount of force going to the front. The rubbers are also bad at taking shearing forces so I mounted those 2 rubbers to avoid too much of that on the other rubbers.
One more photo showing those additional rubbers.

So far I'm happy with the results. I didn't do any measuring but I think the pedals are now significantly higher than with the G29s - but this didn't need any adjustment in seating position and I liked it immediately. Maybe because the differences in feel of the HE pedals is "overshadowing" everything else.
Need to get used to this totally different feel.
Maybe I'll mount some brackets on the footrests to keep my feet in place (although the slots also provide some grip). In any case both are not tactile topics

 

[Brutal Deluxe]

Really like your approach to this! I was thinking along the same lines of placing bobbin mounts horizontally to stop everything moving under hard braking. Happy enough with my V3 pedals at the moment, but might look to upgrade further down the line and try a very similar approach to achieve a better stereo effect than I currently have. Keep up the good work. Do you currently have any other upgrade plans for the rig?

PS - You won't thank me for this... If you wanted to take things one step further, you could have some isolated heel plates and use additional shakers or exciters! Sorry, just when you thought you'd finished.

 

[Squared Circle]

In fact that was one of several reasons to decide for Sprints vs. V3s: The V3 frame is a lot more sturdy than the G29 base so it would have been hard to get that "stereo" effect.
Next upgrade will be a SC2. Not an upgrade but more important: To learn rF2

And yes, I know I'm not finished on the tactile side of things But no real plans at the moment.

 

[mrtugaz]

It's nice to someone being creative and physically testing methods, not just running with the approach that lots of people;e do in using 3D pre-planned design and settle with what looks good onscreen or in theory.

What I find when getting stuck into constructing something, that often new creative ideas can come to light to consider trying that you would never have considered from doing 3D plans. Ive seen me have an idea, it may not work out as expected or I don't quite like it but from that, having some study to then adapt the idea with alternative options or solutions.

Is your seat on isolators to decouple it from the main support frame?

Points Id note on your journey with this and for others, a tactile unit does not necessarily have to be installed at the position of desired felt impact. It can be installed in close proximity like under the seat and then still channel its vibrational energy by a controlled path with 8020 (in my case steel tubing) to the desired locations.

Note that I said "locations"
It is possible to have units positionally placed under the seat and their energy be used to flow into the user from multiple body regions. This by having the units installed to a channeled track/tubing. You can then utilize this to have contact points from under the knees to beneath the buttocks then up the spine and to the shoulder region. Ive yet to see an 8020 owner do this but I know its benefits having done the same with my own tests using steel tubing.

Consider this, compared to just installing a tactile unit direct to the seat as while that works it creates a hotspot at the point of installation and a single/primary pathway for that energy to flow into the seat and user. Multi-path solutions bring contact points to help spread the energy more specifically into body regions like the knees, thighs, buttocks, spine and general torso. The energy will still of course travel over the whole seat region but the goal here is to use more than one application of flow.

Professional based vibrational materials (which there are plenty) seem to have different operational roles. Mainly for vibration dampening/absorbition control and acoustic soundproofing. So reducing low-frequency hum and then also for mid-higher frequencies to subdue harmonics and actual noise. Multilayer solutions are usually the most effective.

Rather than tennis balls, these also apparently work well and can be inset into MDF cut boards/platforms.
Although the alternative is to place the rig onto quality rubber castors and use some dampening/soundproofing under rubber tiles.
I've swayed this direction as the benefits of the castors are not just in making the rig easily movable but this then reduces all the vibes from the rig to only 4 tiny contact points with the floor and ceiling beneath meaning much less surface contact area from the rig than the platform-floor approach.

Enjoy your entry into tactile and lets hope this build helps inspire some creativity in others.

I have been struggling with a solution. I found your ideal worth a shot! IT WORKED!
I put the inflatable cushions directly under the rig. It gave two different effects. It almost completely solved the vibration issue as it makes my rig wobble as I drive. It a lot of fun in wrc. I got a motion rig as well!