2024 Formula One Austrian Grand Prix

Such a nice gloriously indulgent vote result of even distribution of 8 pilots with each 25% of the voting.

Mmh max looking strong in the fp1, let's see later in the qualifying. Expecting a good race on this track, hopefully.

Good qualy; while there's certainly been a step forward for mercedes, and one backward for ferrari, i think mclaren has the best car, max again making a huge difference with his teammate, i think max in a mclaren would have taken the pole by a few tenths.

Finally no track limit BS. What just a meter of gravel can do at a few spots.

Verstappen really is from another planet.
Anyone in F1 can set a good laptime at the RB ring, if the car is right.
But Checo is just starting midfield again, with a great excuse again.
Say the truth is in the middle.
Checo is a few tenths to slow and Max is few tenths faster than the current RB car.
Looking forward to the see some long runs from the contenders.
As the RB ring is a circuit where anything can happen.
Fast parts, slow parts, every now and than some rain, all compressed in many just over a minute laps.

So the first half of the sprint was great, hope for a good race tomorrow. Yet again, feels like lando missed another great opportunity to win?

All Lando had to do was to let time pass, so Piastri and Max's redbull eat their tires again. And once Piastri was 2 or 3 seconds behind him launch an attack to a defenseless Max. The thing is that he is way too focused on live up to the hype of being the Max killer than in giving himself pause and thinking the situation properly instead of acting on impulse.

Max has been carrying red bull for the last 6 races, you only can win for the skin of your teeth so many times before you mess up. He is somehow giving me vibes of 1995 Schumacher.

TRASGU said:

Max has been carrying red bull for the last 6 races, you only can win for the skin of your teeth so many times before you mess up. He is somehow giving me vibes of 1995 Schumacher.

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The effects of his fathers efforts to destabilse the team are starting to show. I'm struggling to see what grand strategy was supposed to play out by making the dominant team that you are locked into for as long as you want to stay there weaker. It's not going well.

I'm surprised Jos is still in the Red Bull garage. He seems to hate the team, the team seem to hate him. He can't be a good influence on Max, especially in comparison to a professional manager, given after the abusive upbringing he had, the time Jos was sent to jail and the current poor behaviour. The only person to who seems to be of any benefit to being there is Jos, and he is the source of all of the problems. The benefits he gets, seem to be the hospitality and travel. I'm sure he can afford a paddock pass.

You'd think they would have learned from Williams and McLaren, don't make the environment too toxic for Adrian Newey to work in. He will just leave and go and provide dominant cars, year after year after year, for someone else.

eetcake said:

The effects of his fathers efforts to destabilse the team are starting to show. I'm struggling to see what grand strategy was supposed to play out by making the dominant team that you are locked into for as long as you want to stay there weaker. It's not going well.

I'm surprised Jos is still in the Red Bull garage. He seems to hate the team, the team seem to hate him. He can't be a good influence on Max, especially in comparison to a professional manager, given after the abusive upbringing he had, the time Jos was sent to jail and the current poor behaviour. The only person to who seems to be of any benefit to being there is Jos, and he is the source of all of the problems. The benefits he gets, seem to be the hospitality and travel. I'm sure he can afford a paddock pass.

You'd think they would have learned from Williams and McLaren, don't make the environment too toxic for Adrian Newey to work in. He will just leave and go and provide dominant cars, year after year after year, for someone else.

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all political. Since the death of RB owner. Horner seems to have made some people angry and it is especially his own ego that is very important since Dr Hemut is also being silenced and not just Jos. Jos wants the best for his son and ultimately Max will choose his father and they will lose Verstappen. Then they can do it with Perez. I wish them the best of luck.

why is Newey leaving? cause Horner?

muzikant said:

all political. Since the death of RB owner. Horner seems to have made some people angry and it is especially his own ego that is very important since Dr Hemut is also being silenced and not just Jos. Jos wants the best for his son and ultimately Max will choose his father and they will lose Verstappen. Then they can do it with Perez. I wish them the best of luck.

why is Newey leaving? cause Horner?

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It could be Horner, he isn't someone I'd like to spend much time with, but they have had a working relationship since late 2005. In that time they took over a midfield team and took it to where it is today, several world championships later. It could be Jos, who has a long history, recorded with criminal convictions for assaulting people.

Regardless of whose fault it is, the result is, the best designer of modern F1 cars is leaving. I think a astute manager would try and mend relationships and keep the team together.

TRASGU said:

All Lando had to do was to let time pass, so Piastri and Max's redbull eat their tires again. And once Piastri was 2 or 3 seconds behind him launch an attack to a defenseless Max. The thing is that he is way too focused on live up to the hype of being the Max killer than in giving himself pause and thinking the situation properly instead of acting on impulse.

Max has been carrying red bull for the last 6 races, you only can win for the skin of your teeth so many times before you mess up. He is somehow giving me vibes of 1995 Schumacher.

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He waltzed to the title that year though

eetcake said:

It could be Horner, he isn't someone I'd like to spend much time with, but they have had a working relationship since late 2005. In that time they took over a midfield team and took it to where it is today, several world championships later. It could be Jos, who has a long history, recorded with criminal convictions for assaulting people.

Regardless of whose fault it is, the result is, the best designer of modern F1 cars is leaving. I think a astute manager would try and mend relationships and keep the team together.

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It doesn't matter whose fault it is: if the environment goes toxic and handwringing, he leaves, just as you said. Which is why I find improbable that he will go to Ferrari, that's the absolute worst destination considering what made you leave your current workplace.

Oh that was a mighty lap by max in the qually! great job!

pai said:

It doesn't matter whose fault it is: if the environment goes toxic and handwringing, he leaves, just as you said. Which is why I find improbable that he will go to Ferrari, that's the absolute worst destination considering what made you leave your current workplace.

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Compare the current Ferrari to Michael Schumacher's Ferrari.

One of the reasons why he and Ferrari were so absurdly dominant was his ability to build a team around him. Very fast, willing to do absolutely anything to win (make of that what you will) for sure but if he hadn't made Ferrari so unbeatable I don't think he would have won so many championships.

Imagine how his career might have played out differently if he wasn't able to keep Ferrari from self destructing for some reason in 2000 and had a family member deliberating fueling the fire. In 10 years time, could that be the difference between Max and LH and MS and people are talking about who won obscene numbers of WDCs and why didn't Max win as many as his talent suggests he should have.

eetcake said:

Compare the current Ferrari to Michael Schumacher's Ferrari.

One of the reasons why he and Ferrari were so absurdly dominant was his ability to build a team around him. Very fast, willing to do absolutely anything to win (make of that what you will) for sure but if he hadn't made Ferrari so unbeatable I don't think he would have won so many championships.

Imagine how his career might have played out differently if he wasn't able to keep Ferrari from self destructing for some reason in 2000 and had a family member deliberating fueling the fire. In 10 years time, could that be the difference between Max and LH and MS and people are talking about who won obscene numbers of WDCs and why didn't Max win as many as his talent suggests he should have.

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Michael Schumacher of course took the most important people from Beneton to Ferrari! but you are right, a strong team was built and now it is Italian chaos as usual

I don't think Lando and Max will be exchanging Christmas cards this year.

eetcake said:

Compare the current Ferrari to Michael Schumacher's Ferrari.

One of the reasons why he and Ferrari were so absurdly dominant was his ability to build a team around him. Very fast, willing to do absolutely anything to win (make of that what you will) for sure but if he hadn't made Ferrari so unbeatable I don't think he would have won so many championships.

Imagine how his career might have played out differently if he wasn't able to keep Ferrari from self destructing for some reason in 2000 and had a family member deliberating fueling the fire. In 10 years time, could that be the difference between Max and LH and MS and people are talking about who won obscene numbers of WDCs and why didn't Max win as many as his talent suggests he should have.

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Jean Todt is the #1 reason that worked. He was the one who empowered Michael, and he also was who always blocked the italian high table from messing up with the team, withstanding mafia death threats in the process. After years of winning everything a media line surged stating that Ferrari was not Ferrari anymore, because it was an international team instead of being based on italian talent and leadership. Di Montezemolo cracked under that and sought to tear apart the team, which he successfully did. The 2007 championships are always remembered by McLaren faltering, but it was a testimony of Todt's leadership on how he managed to snatch victory from the jaws of defeat. Since he left Ferrari, it has always been the other way around, and there hasn't been a single sign of that changing.

I've heard for +15 years the storyline of X new team principal guiding Ferrari to its resurrection, for them stumbling upon the same problems, the teams title challenge falling apart, the said saviour getting unceremoniously fired, and the process beginning again. It will continue to happen until the high table stops messing around with the running of the team.

What will happen with Max, we don't know. Nobody looks particularly better into 2026 atm.

muzikant said:

Dr Hemut is also being silenced and not just Jos. Jos wants the best for his son and ultimately Max will choose his father and they will lose Verstappen. Then they can do it with Perez. I wish them the best of luck.

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Silencing Marko is an excellent idea. And if Jos wants the best for his son, he should stay away from the Red Bull garage. Nobody needs the input of a very ordinary ex-driver. Jos had nothing to do with the success of Red Bull.

Those two need detention or at least a spot on the naughty step and being sent to bed with no tea!.

Nico Hulkenberg DOD.

Kingkoenig said:

Silencing Marko is an excellent idea. And if Jos wants the best for his son, he should stay away from the Red Bull garage. Nobody needs the input of a very ordinary ex-driver. Jos had nothing to do with the success of Red Bull.

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Marko did, he made RB's success and he is in the Verstappen camp, and strange that Newey is leaving, right? he also seems to have an argument with Horner. So Horner's ego is quite big. As for Jos... yes, he wants the best for his son and certainly no fuss and Max will not lose out on Marko and his father. Horner just has to be smart and temper his ego a bit after my idea, otherwise they will lose Verstappen, as I already said

TRASGU said:

All Lando had to do was to let time pass, so Piastri and Max's redbull eat their tires again. And once Piastri was 2 or 3 seconds behind him launch an attack to a defenseless Max. The thing is that he is way too focused on live up to the hype of being the Max killer than in giving himself pause and thinking the situation properly instead of acting on impulse.

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This was yesterday. I told the key to win yesterday's sprint, very predictably it was also the key to win today's race, Lando blew it up again for the same reasons as yesterday.

I also said that one driver can only win so many races by the skin of his teeth without a mistake, RBR needs at least to fix their suspension. Their tire degradation turns them in sitting ducks at the end of the stints and weirdly enough at the end of the stints with low fuel.

In the last stint of the race Lando had what seemed like a full second advantage over a Max that also had a huge flatspot making him unable to brake hard. Lando had the race in his pocket but he again managed to grasp defeat from the jaws of a sure victory.

Lando got impatient not waiting for a clean pass that was just a matter of time. But he tried to bully Max with out of control dive bombs sending Max out of track twice (the same mistake Lando also did and also failed yesterday) and the third time Max showed him that he may be his friend, but he wasn't going to tolerate that, he isn't a push over. Riling up Max always ends badly, he races you twice as hard.

Not only Lando doesn't give himself a pause to think about the big picture along the race, he didn't even learn from yesterday mistakes. D--k measurement test always end in tears with Max, Lando should know better, he has raced online with him both in F1 and online hundreds of times. Lando wanted to not only win, but to humiliate him on his home race with a flamboyant pass to send a message to unstabilize Max, and instead Lando was on the losing side with the clearly faster car once again.

The overview is that Lando started the weekend 69 points behind against a rival with a car that eats it's tires alive, and now Max is 82 points ahead. All because of falling into the hype trap, Lando believed his own hype, like Perez did 2 years ago.

I can't believe how much Lando has been suffering since Miami against a Max that is in a car that even when it is slightly faster at the start of the races ends up being quite slower due to the high tire degradation issue they have.

He lost the race the moment he chose to rile up the most aggressive driver on the grid instead of waiting for the clean pass that was going to happen as the red bull tires were dead and in the process of dying even more.

Mclaren is also losing a chance to win the WDC by making stupid mistakes: like letting your lead driver choose his own pit strategy, allowing the second driver to block and interfere with your lead driver. Today they even could have used Piastri to block and slow down Max after both his pitstops so Lando could catch up.

RBR is crippled by: losing Newey, the team instabliltiy and internal infighting, the amount of wind tunnel hours that Mclaren has to spare, Perez is lost in combat, the car has a big tire degradation issues, suspension issues, Perez shows RBR underside and diffuser at every chance he has, Max had the DNF at australia, and a 10 grid penalty pending over him for the power unit that only lasted few minutes and the fact that we still have not reached the half point of the championship.

Mclaren can't have it more favourable to them, RBR only weapons to counter them as of now are Max and the points advantage that can dissapear really fast if the next Mclaren upgrade works again. Remember 2022, arriving at Hungary the championship seemed Ferrari's to lose, the TD arrived and it turned out to be a Max's walkover.